XM-8: New U.S. Service Rifle?

Modern Firearms and Ammunition website ^ | unknown | Unknown

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Caliber: 5.56x45 mm NATO
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: no data
Barrel length: no data
Weight: 2.67 kg empty
Rate of fire: no data
Magazine capacity: 30 rounds (STANAG)

The development of the XM8 Lightweight Assault Rifle was initiated by US Army in the 2002, when contract was issued to the Alliant Techsystems Co of USA to study possibilities of development of kinetic energy part of the XM29 OICW weapon into separate lightweight assault rifle, which could, in the case of success, replace the aging M16A2 rifles and M4A1 carbines in US military service. According to the present plans, the XM8 should enter full production circa 2005, if not earlier, several years before the XM-29 OICW. The XM8 (M8 after its official adoption) should become a standard next generation US forces assault rifle. It will fire all standard 5.56mm NATO ammunition, and, to further decrease the load on the future infantrymen, a new type of 5.56mm ammunition is now being developed. This new ammunition will have composite cases, with brass bases and polymer walls, which will reduce weight of the complete ammunition, while maintaining compatibility with all 5.56mm NATO weapons. Along with 20% weight reduction in the XM8 (compared to the current issue M4A1 carbine), this will be a welcome move for any infantryman, already overloaded by protective, communications and other battle equipment.

The XM8 will be quite similar to the "KE" (kinetic energy) part of the XM-29 OICW system, being different mostly in having a telescoped plastic buttstock of adjustable length, and a detachable carrying handle with the Picatinny rail.

Technical description. The XM8 is a derivative of the Heckler-Koch G36 assault rifle, and thus it is almost similar to that rifle in design and functioning. The key differences are the NATO-standard magazine housing that will accept M16-type magazines, the set of Picatinny rails on the forend, telescoped buttstock of adjustable length and a different scope, mounted on the Picatinny rail, built into the detachable carrying handle.

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I know. But damn it, it was BORN here, and that, to me, makes it AMERICAN!

By born, I mean originally designed and manufactured. That the Canucks could build it cheaper is a reflection on union (goonion) practices sadly tolerated by GM for far too long.

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The heck with the lugs (although, what's wrong with wanting a copy of your country's service rifle?), what I want to go away are those butt-ugly thumbhole stocks, non-flash-supressed barrels, and reduced-cap magazines.

All of the above are outright nonsense, reflecting only the unmitigated ignorance of those who wrote and promoted the foolish law.

[Shooter 2.5]

I was lucky to buy M-16 thirty round mags for 16 dollars a year ago. I wish I could find the old twenty rounders for that price.

You don't even want to know how much standard capacity mags for a .45 Para-Ordnance are.

[xp38]

The fact that it was built in Canada has more to do with auto trade agreements hammered out in the 1960s and long standing factories owned by the US auto makers than cheaper labor in Canada. The UAW exists just as strongly in Canada as the US if not more so. IIRC the agreements stipulated that production levels would be roughly equal to the number of sales the auto makers made in Canada. To some extent it's the luck of the draw which models get built where.

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Tell me about it. One of my prime reasons for forgoing the M1A/M-14 as a choice is the cost of magazines (as well as the rifle!). One of my chief hopes for the sunset is a commensurate reduction in prices. Another dream...

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I was unaware of those facts. Thanks for the info! I thought the Canadian plants started work on the F-bodies in the '80s.

At the very least, the Camaro, due to its old-fashioned layout, styling, and in-your-face horsepower, is undeniably American-born.

Sadly, I'll have to wait another five months to see mine again (as well as my family, home, cats, dog, guns...). I've never owned a vehicle which offered so much pure FUN to the driver. As a bonus, it's easy to work on AND to modify.

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Cost is another reason why this looks so attractive.

The XM-8 and it share the same operating principle.

[Destructor]

"The M1 carbine round will definitely penetrate clothing, but not much more. Penetrating 1/2" exterior plywood is about all M1 carbine round can do. It has ballistics slightly better than the 9mm round. It excels in accuracy out to about 200 yards, mine will group about 6 inches at this range."

Like I said, this is what I've read about the M1 carbine. The M1 Carbine was generally dispised by the soldiers in the Korean War for that lack of power. If you're happy with it more power to ya! Personally, I'll stick with my CAR-15, since it is very similar to my actual service rifle.

[Shooter 2.5]

I don't have a 180.

I started with the Garands, moved to the M1A and bought a lot of magazines right after the ban when the prices hadn't gone up that much. I found someone who was selling them for 25 each.

I then moved to the AR series because of High Power and was buying the 20 rounders for seven because most people were looking for the thirties.

The poor man M1A is a FN-FAL. I bought ten of those mags for six dollars. I think they're around 12 now.

The NRA stated the fight for the AWB would be the last election because that was the last time we could vote for the people who would sunset it. They're right and the person I worked for won and promised his support against the ban. I hope it never leaves the committee.

[xp38]

You are probably right about the F bodies starting to be built in Canada in the 80s. I was just refering to the fact that the Canada US auto pact trade agreement was developed back in the 60s. What gets built where and at which factory depends on a lot of different factors and production gets shuffled around over time. As far as I'm aware the F bodies ended production 2 years ago so hold on to that Camaro. Hopefully the Firebirds and Camaros will return one day.

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Hell, the halfway decent FN-FAL clones go for over a grand now. I was looking at the Spanish CETME for a while, as quite a few are available for low cost, as well as mags, but I'm usure of the overall quality. I've noticed G-3 clones now on the market for under fivr bills, I might check those out, too. I know that they had some initial quality control problems, but Century swears they've gotten the bugs out...we'll see.

[Shooter 2.5]

I didn't know the FN's are so expensive now. A friend alerted me to a gunshop that had some for 600. I bought one and I hadn't realized that a group of my friends had bought the others. We later took them to a place south of Dallas that refinished the parkerizing. They look brand new.

It's funny how I wish I could buy all the M-16 magazines possible but when it came to buy the FN magazines for only 6 dollars, I only bought as many as I thought I needed.

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The good ones are. Those by DPMS and Entreprise are among the finest, and they ALL run over the $1200.00 mark. The less expensive ones from Century and the like are made up of parts shipped in from Brazil and Israel. From what I've heard, their gas pistons are weak, and have a tendency to fail, as do some of their other parts.

[Shooter 2.5]

Mine is a parts gun with a Hesse receiver. After it was refinished I was still digging sand out of the innards.

I did have one problem with it from my ignorance. I accidently left it in the auto mode and it wouldn't cycle. I thought the gas piston was stuck or something. I fooled with it for a half hour until a friend took it from me and the first thing he did was check to see if it was on safe before he tried to fire it. That's when he noticed where the selector was. He flipped it to single and emptied the mag with no problems.

Also the flash hider keeps loosening. I have to locktite it but I keep forgetting. The blue locktite should be sufficient.

I'm not in love with FN's. The seem to be to muzzle heavy, the rear sight is difficult to adjust and the pistol grip seems to be too low. Just my opinion. I like my son's AR-10. I don't like his magazine prices.

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In light of the recent troubles with the M16 series in heavy sandstorm environments (Iraq), I have a question:

What can be done, at the design level, to make a rifle less susceptible to being jammed by sand and other particles? How about by the user?

I ask because the US is now working on a replacement for the M16, and since for the forseeable future the primary AO in which it will be used is in desert environs, this should be a part of the design process.

The AK series is far less susceptible to sand fouling jams, but it is not accurate enough to satisfy the U.S. Armed Forces. What design features make this so? Could they be replicated in a US service rifle, retaining the accuracy potential and human engineering on which we pride ourselves?

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Almost forgot you. PING!!!!!!!!!!

BTW, if I ever get back to Jax, it'll be in February or thereabouts. I want to do two things: go shopping for a new rifle, and to go to the range for a few hundred rounds of fun.

After I reaquaint myself with my wife, of course.

[FlyVet]

We definitly need something bigger than .223

Most interesting thing I've found on the subject lately: 6.5mm PPC, or .26 Grendel. More compact than .223, but I'm sure weighs more. This guy claims 1000 ft/lbs. @ 1000 yds, 1.5" groups at 300 yds. in an AR 15 match rifle. I want one.

http://www.competitionshooting.com/pages/708565/index.htm

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I ask the question because of all the reports about M16s, particularly those involved in the action in which PFC Jessica Lynch was captured. None of those involved apparently worked; all were clogged with dust and sand from the sandstorm.

No doubt, those Soldiers there failed to properly clean their weapons in a combat zone, but then again, it's difficult to do this while on the move in such a storm. A clean weapon is dirty again in only a few minutes. What means could be designed in by the manufacturer to prevent a total failure under those circumstances?

Since it seems that the actual openings in a firearm that lead to the action are the ejection port, muzzle, charging handle, and trigger group, perhaps this is the area to start?

We already have dust covers for ejection ports- could these be sealed with rubber gaskets? How about similar "boots" for the trigger and bolt?

[Moosefart]

Type: gas-operated, select-fire

Gauge: 12

Length: 787 mm

Barrel length: 525 mm.

Weight unloaded : 4.57 kg

Capacity : 10 rounds in removable revolver-type drum magazine

Rate of fire: 240 rounds per minute

Nice little shotgun!

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I'll expect that to appear in the next sci-fi movie or action movie in production, as soon as Stembridge Gun Rentals gets their hands on some of them.

I won't be expecting to see one in my local gunshop anytime soon. Such a weapon will simply terrify the graboids. Look for Chuckie and Di Fi to wave one around in the Senate shortly, to boost support for renewing the AWB.

I think it looks pretty cool, and innovative. However, the Succer Moms won't.