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XM-8: New U.S. Service Rifle?
Modern Firearms and Ammunition website ^ | unknown | Unknown

Posted on 08/07/2003 10:52:17 AM PDT by Long Cut

Caliber: 5.56x45 mm NATO
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: no data
Barrel length: no data
Weight: 2.67 kg empty
Rate of fire: no data
Magazine capacity: 30 rounds (STANAG)

The development of the XM8 Lightweight Assault Rifle was initiated by US Army in the 2002, when contract was issued to the Alliant Techsystems Co of USA to study possibilities of development of kinetic energy part of the XM29 OICW weapon into separate lightweight assault rifle, which could, in the case of success, replace the aging M16A2 rifles and M4A1 carbines in US military service. According to the present plans, the XM8 should enter full production circa 2005, if not earlier, several years before the XM-29 OICW. The XM8 (M8 after its official adoption) should become a standard next generation US forces assault rifle. It will fire all standard 5.56mm NATO ammunition, and, to further decrease the load on the future infantrymen, a new type of 5.56mm ammunition is now being developed. This new ammunition will have composite cases, with brass bases and polymer walls, which will reduce weight of the complete ammunition, while maintaining compatibility with all 5.56mm NATO weapons. Along with 20% weight reduction in the XM8 (compared to the current issue M4A1 carbine), this will be a welcome move for any infantryman, already overloaded by protective, communications and other battle equipment.

The XM8 will be quite similar to the "KE" (kinetic energy) part of the XM-29 OICW system, being different mostly in having a telescoped plastic buttstock of adjustable length, and a detachable carrying handle with the Picatinny rail.

Technical description. The XM8 is a derivative of the Heckler-Koch G36 assault rifle, and thus it is almost similar to that rifle in design and functioning. The key differences are the NATO-standard magazine housing that will accept M16-type magazines, the set of Picatinny rails on the forend, telescoped buttstock of adjustable length and a different scope, mounted on the Picatinny rail, built into the detachable carrying handle.


TOPICS: Extended News; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: ar; assaultrifles; aw; bang; banglist; g36; gunporn; guns; hecklerkoch; hk; m8; miltech; rhodesia; servicerifle; sl8; xm8
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To: The Scorpion King
No, because it uses a more robust and reliable (not to mention cleaner) operating system, reduces the weight, and adds the modular designs so preferred nowadays. Also, it uses HK's design, which is one of the best in the world.

If only it used a better cartridge, it'd be perfect. But I'm dreaming, there.

161 posted on 08/07/2003 6:49:46 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: wysiwyg
Wow, and people call the AR ugly...

That XM-8 does remind me of something. If I could just place where I saw it....


162 posted on 08/07/2003 6:50:53 PM PDT by archy (Keep in mind that the milk of human kindness comes from a beast that is both cannibal and a vampire.)
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To: archy
The Modern Firearms website has this to say about the L85A2:

While official reports about the upgraded weapons were glowing, the actual field reports from the British troops, engaged in the Afghanistan campaign of 2002, were again unsatisfactory. The future of the L85 rifle remains unclear but there's some rumor that it could be retired from British service around the year 2006, and replaced by another design (most probably, the Heckler-Koch G36 assault rifle).

Seems they're on the same, or similar, track we are.

163 posted on 08/07/2003 6:52:30 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: Long Cut
"No, because it uses a more robust and reliable (not to mention cleaner) operating system, reduces the weight, and adds the modular designs so preferred nowadays. Also, it uses HK's design, which is one of the best in the world. If only it used a better cartridge, it'd be perfect. But I'm dreaming, there."

Yeah, you are dreaming there. The fact that the rifle is light weight is not necessarily a good thing. An Infantry weapon shouldn't fall apart in your hands if you have to apply the old "buttstroke to the head" maneuver!

164 posted on 08/07/2003 6:57:07 PM PDT by The Scorpion King
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To: Long Cut
However many hearts it would warm, we're not going back to full-powered battle rifles any time soon (or later!). We have to deal with what is, and that's the smaller calibers.

Big bump there!

If you need a full size battle rifle, you should have called arty 15 minutes ago. Our soldiers don't take territory; the consolidate our hold on it. If you're not doing it that way...you're doing it wrong.

165 posted on 08/07/2003 6:58:37 PM PDT by Woahhs
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To: The Scorpion King
To be fair, the M-16 wasn't the best tool for "bayonet and buttstock" fighting, either. Fact is, such fighting is simply not regarded as frequent enough to warrant consideration.

The last rifle that was actually useful for such fighting was the M-14, which will, like its contemporaries, remain in the past as far as infantry use goes.

166 posted on 08/07/2003 7:00:14 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: Woahhs; The Scorpion King
Good point, Woahhs. most combat nowadays is done by artillery, missiles, and tanks. What's left is pounded by heavy machine guns and mortars, as well as air. That's exactly why the infantryman's personal weapon has recieved so little work over the years...the concentration has been on him not having to use it.
167 posted on 08/07/2003 7:03:16 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: Long Cut
"To be fair, the M-16 wasn't the best tool for "bayonet and buttstock" fighting, either. Fact is, such fighting is simply not regarded as frequent enough to warrant consideration. The last rifle that was actually useful for such fighting was the M-14, which will, like its contemporaries, remain in the past as far as infantry use goes."

My Service Rifle was a true M-16 with a solid stock that had a steel plate on the end of it. I always figured that it would get the job done! However, I do see your point about the bayonet.

168 posted on 08/07/2003 7:12:28 PM PDT by The Scorpion King
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To: Long Cut
It'll sunset unless it becomes an issue in the election, which it will if we have some crazed shooting massacre just before it.

Which based on historical precedence, you can pretty well count on. There *will* be some incident that the gun grabbers in the media can hype and pontificate over, although if it will really deserve the term "massacure" is really beside the point.

169 posted on 08/07/2003 7:15:49 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: Long Cut
Wait until we get into another Vietnam type jungle war. Our boys will pay the price for all of the emphasis on "high tech" rifles. The enemy will no doubt be using older rifles that were designed to take care of the business at hand.
170 posted on 08/07/2003 7:15:56 PM PDT by The Scorpion King
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To: Harold Hill
oh no...
171 posted on 08/07/2003 7:21:57 PM PDT by danneskjold
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To: The Scorpion King
Hell, in a jungle fight, give me a .45 ACP submachine gun, UMP-45 style, and a LOT of napalm.

In any case, the XM-8 appears very conventional in design, if one simply removes all the electronic geegaws. it's still a gas-operated automatic magazine-fed rifle, just more robust and reliable than its predecessor. Don't forget, polymer won't decay in a wet, humid environment like the M16's aluminum would.

172 posted on 08/07/2003 7:41:05 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: El Gato
Then those of us on the RIGHT side of the debate need to keep up the pressure, and NEVER shut up about it.
173 posted on 08/07/2003 7:42:20 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: Woahhs
Yes, I am sure that greater case capacity is certainly important...but I was only addressing the bullet design. I think more case capacity would vastly improve effectiveness, but so would better chemistry, and/or switching to a larger diameter bullet. I just don't forsee our military changing our ammo that much, unfortunately, and so it would seem that improving interior ballistics is the way to go. Making the barrel shorter will only decrease performance, if not compensated for elsewhere.
174 posted on 08/07/2003 7:44:33 PM PDT by PoorMuttly ("Will bite people for guns")
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To: SAMWolf; 68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub; dansangel; .45MAN
Bump. Thought y'all'd be interested, on a "support the troops" level.

Do me afavor, and ping the Canteen threads, willya? I'm kinda busy...

175 posted on 08/07/2003 8:24:07 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: snippy_about_it; AntiJen; Darksheare; The Real Deal; SpookBrat; Victoria Delsoul; souris; ...
Ping
176 posted on 08/07/2003 8:28:17 PM PDT by SAMWolf (Drop the vase and it will become a Ming of the past.)
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To: Long Cut; jjm2111
" thank God they didn't pick a bullpup..."

Agreed! I despise the things.

Forgive my ignorance, but what's wrong with a bull-pup if it's well-designed? It would seem that it provides a longer barrel than a conventionally-designed firearm with an identical trigger-to-muzzle length. To be sure, a lot of bull-pup designs I've seen seem somewhat awkward, but I'd think it should be possible to design one that wasn't too bad.

177 posted on 08/07/2003 8:29:51 PM PDT by supercat (TAG--you're it!)
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To: supercat
Personal opinion only, on my part. I find them the UGLIEST firearms ever designed.

That, and the ejection pattern problems have never been satisfactorily adressed, and the balance of them feels...odd to me.

178 posted on 08/07/2003 8:37:07 PM PDT by Long Cut
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To: Long Cut; Kathy in Alaska; MoJo2001; LindaSOG; LaDivaLoca; bentfeather; Bethbg79; Iowa Granny; ...
"Do me a favor, and ping the Canteen threads, willya? I'm kinda busy..."

PING!

Thanks Long Cut for posting this!
179 posted on 08/07/2003 8:37:10 PM PDT by 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub (God Bless and Protect our military and our allies military.)
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To: mvpel
I believe that, with the passage of the Volkmer-McLure act of '86, that no further full autos can be offered to civilians for sale. Pity, that.

No full autos manufactured after passage, existing guns can be still be transferred to citizens, with Uncle Sugars permission of course and with payment of the transfer tax.

The chapter and verse is pretty short US Code Title 18 section 922 (o)

(1)
Except as provided in paragraph (2), it shall be unlawful for any person to transfer or possess a machinegun.
(2)
This subsection does not apply with respect to -
(A)
a transfer to or by, or possession by or under the authority of, the United States or any department or agency thereof or a State, or a department, agency, or political subdivision thereof; or
(B)
any lawful transfer or lawful possession of a machinegun that was lawfully possessed before the date this subsection takes effect.

The law took effect May 19, 1986. Now while it would seem any gun transferred via the Tax Stamp process would be "under the authority of the United States", but that is not what the author of those line intended when he inserted them at the last minute (almost literally) into the bill that became the law, and that is also not how the BATFE and the courts are interpreting them.

180 posted on 08/07/2003 8:40:51 PM PDT by El Gato
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