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Team in Kuwait Develops "Slammer" to protect Troops
The Birmingham (Ala.) News ^ | 8/5/2003 | Tom Gordon

Posted on 08/05/2003 6:09:14 AM PDT by gunnrmike

Anniston's `Slammer' 08/04/03

TOM GORDON News staff writer CAMP ARIFJAN, Kuwait - The people who don't want U.S. troops in Iraq seem to be thinking they can achieve their goal by attacking convoys and killing soldiers. Inside a huge hangar-like warehouse in this sprawling Army post, a team of Anniston Army Depot workers is building a vehicle that they hope will better withstand attacks and better protect the convoys.

The cab of this vehicle in the making is the hull of an M113 Armored Personnel Carrier. On its side is the nickname, The Alabama Slammer. When it is fitted on the bed of a five-ton truck and equipped with two-.50 caliber machine guns and buttressed with additional armor, Depot workers are hoping the Slammer will live up to its name.

That's why they are also calling it "a war wagon." "When you bring Depot workers over here with the expertise that these guys have got, you can turn a product around really quickly to match the needs of the soldier (in Iraq)," said Bob Whistine, a spokesman for the Army Materiel Command here.

And one of the needs of the soldiers, especially those on the convoys that seem to be the targets of almost daily attacks as they move through Iraq, is better protection.

For now, the primary protection vehicle for the Army convoy is a lightly armored Humvee with one mounted .50-caliber machine gun. While it has been an effective weapon in many respects, the Humvee has been vulnerable to 105-millimeter artillery shells planted on roadsides and detonated by remote control.

The heavier war wagon should be able to better withstand the bombs and surprise the attackers with its additional firepower, Depot workers say.

"It's going to look like part of the convoy until they actually fire on it and then you've got two .50-caliber machine guns firing back at you," said Chuck Gunnels of Piedmont, a special projects officer in Anniston who is part of the war wagon construction team. "If they cut loose on something, the word will get around real quick," said Randy Hughes of Oxford, who oversees turbine engine repair at the Depot.

"If we can send the troops to the front line, the least we can do is stand behind them and give them the best equipment they can have," added Larry Phillips, a Depot welder from Lincoln.

The Depot workers, all volunteers, are part of the Army Materiel Command's Forward Repair Activity here, which is the staging area for thousands of troops and pieces of equipment as they have moved in and out of Iraq. One team of about 16 Depot workers started arriving in February and most have now headed home. The second team, which now has about 17 members, expects to stay until late December and some workers may join them in the weeks ahead.

The workers can't say how many war wagons may be up and operating at that point, because the prototype won't be ready for at least a month. In addition, their primary mission is repairing Humvees and truck engines, along with the 750-horsepower engine that powers M88 A1 vehicles, the forerunner of the Hercules tow truck that pulled down the statue of Saddam Hussein in Baghdad near the end of full scale fighting in the Iraq war.

Plus, as Phillips said, military priorities have a way of changing, and sometimes they do so daily. Sometimes war wagon work and other projects give way to an immediate need to put some more armor plating on a convoy, and such a short notice request landed in the lap of the Depot workers on a night late last month.

"We could build (other war wagons), or they could come up next week and say `scrap it,'" Phillips said. But, he added, "we look for them to follow through on the first one." If it proves itself in the field, "chances are they'll build more."

If the war wagon becomes a reality, it - and many rebuilt engines - will not be the only legacy of the Anniston teams. Tents around Arifjan are flying flags - most of them seem to be Alabama's state banner - from poles made by Depot workers.

Last week, the Depot team fashioned a pole with a sharp edge to place on top of a Humvee. The idea for the pole arose after military intelligence suggested that the convoy attackers are about to try a new tactic: stringing piano wire across the highways to catch the necks of the soldiers who man the mounted Humvee machine guns.

The pole, Phillips, said, is to catch and cut the wire before it gets the gunner. But like the Alabama Slammer war wagon, it is for now, only a prototype.


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; US: Alabama
KEYWORDS: alabamaslammer; anniston; apc; convoy; guntrucks; iraq; kuwait; miltech; protection; rebuildingiraq; slammer; troops; utah; wheeledarmor
Did a search and didn't find this article in the archives. Reminds me of and articel I saw in the Gun Trucks used in Vietnam to protect the covoys. This is the first time however I have heard reference to the piano wire threat. But as Gunny Highway would say "Adapt, Inprovise and overcome"! God bless our trops. HOO RAH!

Gunnrmike

1 posted on 08/05/2003 6:09:14 AM PDT by gunnrmike
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To: gunnrmike

Is there a photo of this vehicle?  I'm having trouble with the link.

 
 

Owl_Eagle

" WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
DIVERSITY IS STRENGTH"


2 posted on 08/05/2003 6:30:21 AM PDT by End Times Sentinel ("Fire can be our servant, whether it's toasting S'mores or raining down on Charlie"-Pcpl Skinner)
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To: gunnrmike
I just don't understand how it is possible to build a new type of military vehicle without engineering studies, competitive bidding, and a politicized procurement process.

Plus, these aren't union workers.

(end sarcasm)
3 posted on 08/05/2003 6:57:58 AM PDT by babyface00
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To: babyface00
Wait until Shinseki hears that these guys arent buying into the new high speed unarmored vision. These guys are all going to wind up as midshift security auxillary standing around the perimeter in Thule.
4 posted on 08/05/2003 7:40:58 AM PDT by gnarledmaw
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To: gunnrmike
The locally modified gun trucks used in Vietnam weren't pretty but they served the purpose. I don't think any two were alike. The first ones were merely 2 1/2 or 5 ton trucks with sandbags and guys riding in the back with M-60s - the later gun trucks were more heavily armed and had more protection. One gun truck had four XM-134 miniguns and twin M-60s! Jeeps were also equipped with M-60 machine guns and we always tried to carry M-79 grenade launchers in addition to a M-14/M-16.

http://www.guntrucks.com/HardRide.htm
5 posted on 08/05/2003 7:43:33 AM PDT by Ben Hecks
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To: gunnrmike
ROFLMAO

I used to bartend, and the only Alabama Slammer I knew of was this one:

1/2 oz Amaretto
1/2 oz Southern Comfort
1/2 oz Sloe Gin
1 splash Orange Juice
1 splash Sweet and Sour Mix

Pour above ingredients into a stainless steel shaker over ice and shake until completely cold. Strain into an old fashioned glass and serve.

6 posted on 08/05/2003 7:43:55 AM PDT by eyespysomething
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To: gunnrmike
My Brother was a Doc in Ban Mi Tuit in Nam with an Engineering Battalion, and he described those "gun trucks" mentioned here.

Apparently they were just a regular 5-ton dump truck, the dump-body of which was fortified somehow - perhaps with a double wall packed with sandbags in between (?) and a couple of .50 Brownings peeking over the top to answerer any threats with. "Steps" were placed inside to facilitate manning the guns, firing over the side or getting in & out, or personel could hunker down out of the line of fire if need be. A tent could be spread accross the top in inclement weather or as a sun shade, and they apparantly figured that a moving truck was sufficiently hard to nail with a knee mortar (although the "Charlie" was reputedly notoriously adept with them) so that incoming from above was not considered to be all that great a threat.

Bro. "Dan" was riding in the "Lead Jeep" in a convoy once when a rocket (probably an RPG) came whizzing out of the boonies, right over the hood of the jeep.
The gun-trucks following "lit up" like thunder almost instantly and tore a ragged hole in the jungle where the missile had just emerged in no time at all.

One of the favorite forms of "armor" at the time seems to have been regular paving asphalt; they would take out all the windows etc. from the doors of 3/4 ton vehicles, etc., and pack the space between the interior and exterior door panels with hot asphalt and let it set up. It seemed to absorb both explosive energy and bullets equally well, and was one of the few things that would stop an RPG, which the VC seem to have enjoyed using nearly as much as the Al Quadia Islammonazis do. I'm not too sure but what they poured some in the floorboards as well to protect against land mine shrapnel to some extent.

Of course this made the vehicles pretty heavy, increases fuel consumption and other tactical considerations - but it may be a reasonable trade-off in areas where ambushes are becoming the national sport and they seem to be taking out an average of one of our Soldiers per dieum.

As to the "command det" ordnance - I assume that these are electrically operated?

In a prior post I speculated that a multi-frequency, directional signal generator might induce sufficent current in a det-wire (that's why they call it "induction", BTW) to pre-detonate the device before it gained proximity to the target. I primarilly envisioned such a device as defense against the IslammoKazi Det-Vests that they seem to enjoy martyering themselves (and as many Jews as possible) with. Well, it turns out, according to a couple of contributors who seem to know well of which they write, that such contraptions have been used for years, and "just might" have something to do with these occasional reports of terrorists "accidentally" blowing themselves up in the act of preparing or transporting their bomb(s). "Hoist on their own Petard", so to speak.

Fancy that?!

Now couldn't a little loudspeaker-like directional antennae be mounted to the grille of a lead vehicle to discretely "scan" the roadway ahead for oh, say 75 meters or so?

And if they take the time to bury the detwire (and I hope that our Snipers are covering hot sections of road and keeping a sharp eye out for that sort of activity) perhaps a ground contact arc generator - like an electric fince putting an intense burst of voltage into the ground ahead of the vehicle) might prove interesting. The ground over there is probably too dry to be very conductive, but hey; it might be worth a try!

I'll bet that any radios etc. that such a rig interferes with could be electronically syncronized to block reception every time the signal or voltage generator "pops" - kind of like the machine-guns on the old WW-I biplanes that fired between the propeller blades.

As for the wires strung accross the road - man, that's one of the oldest tricks in the book!

Have you ever noticed on WW-II Jeeps the funny steel bar sticking out in the front, angled back over the hood, with a little forward-facing hook on top? It was mounted on bilatteral "arms" that were hinged to the frame about where the firewall is, so that the whole apparatus could swing up and back if it met with resistance.

Now just what do you suppose THOSE were for, eh?

American ingenuity, resourcefullness and creativity are among the major tactical advantage our forces have had going for them over the years, and I'm proud to see those virtues demonstrated again!
7 posted on 08/05/2003 7:58:35 AM PDT by Uncle Jaque
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To: gunnrmike
I'd kinda favor the "Vulcan" 20 mm electrically fired gatling gun I once saw in operation in NM. Without a doubt the most impressive gun I've ever seen. 3000 rounds per minute of high explosive shells, each one with a 3 meter killing radius. Sounds like a fuel dragster on the starting line when the light goes green, and at night looks like a ray gun.

I watched it obliterate a target truck from one and a half miles away in a very few seconds. Makes a quad .50 look like a BB gun.

Shredded raghead, anyone?
8 posted on 08/05/2003 8:08:32 AM PDT by jimt
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To: *miltech; Ernest_at_the_Beach
http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/bump-list
9 posted on 08/05/2003 1:47:33 PM PDT by Libertarianize the GOP (Ideas have consequences)
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To: Ben Hecks
One of the most interesting modifications for a gun truck I've seen (pictures of, to young for 'Nam) was where they took an M113 APC, cut the running gear off, and mounted the whole works on the back of a truck. Us 'mericans have always been good at creating effective solutions to problems.

Seems to me that we even brought one of the 'famous' gun trucks back to the states, and it resides in a museum somewhere.

Yhwhsman

10 posted on 08/05/2003 6:32:26 PM PDT by yhwhsman ("Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small..." -Sir Winston Churchill)
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To: yhwhsman
LOL, and just as I post, look what I managed to find.

Gun Truck

Yhwhsman

11 posted on 08/05/2003 6:37:08 PM PDT by yhwhsman ("Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small..." -Sir Winston Churchill)
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To: yhwhsman
It's in the Army Transportation Corps museum, Ft. Eustis, VA. Some more info with a photo of the museum truck is here:

http://www.almc.army.mil/alog/gun_trucks.htm

Since we were in Vietnam for several years, there was an accumulation of odds and ends available to build gun trucks. Our guys in Iraq pretty much had to do with what they brought. Unfortunately, some of the lessons we learned about convoy security seemed to have been lost over the years.
12 posted on 08/05/2003 7:13:02 PM PDT by Ben Hecks
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To: babyface00
Junk Yard Wars... :-)
13 posted on 08/05/2003 7:16:57 PM PDT by tubebender (FReepin Awesome...)
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To: gunnrmike
Can someone say "RAT PATROL"?
14 posted on 08/05/2003 7:18:51 PM PDT by eastforker (Money is the key to justice,just ask any lawyer.)
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To: gunnrmike
It might be good for some situations, but I'm not sure how useful this new Gun Truck will be against bombs dropped from over-passes or fired in cities and towns with lots of civilians around.
15 posted on 08/05/2003 7:26:39 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Ben Hecks
Thanks Ben, for your service.

I'd never even heard about the gun trucks until I ran across an Osprey book at a hobby store.

You would think that they would have done a better job protecting the supply columns, you can't get anywhere when your front-line troops run out of fuel, food, ammo, water, and medical supplies. Aren't the Marine's LAVs fast enough to travel in a supply column? Then again, whatever the guys are cooking up may actually be better armored then the LAVs or Bradleys.

BTW, did you serve on a gun truck?

Yhwhsman
16 posted on 08/07/2003 1:21:31 PM PDT by yhwhsman ("Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small..." -Sir Winston Churchill)
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To: gunnrmike

This is not a picture from Kuwait but it is a M-113 on a 5-ton.
This is an undated picture from Vietnam.

17 posted on 08/07/2003 1:30:25 PM PDT by jriemer (We are a Republic not a Democracy)
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To: yhwhsman
My convoy experience in Nam was in 65-66 before the era of the gun trucks. Fortunately, the 1st ID, 25th ID and other units that we supported provided good convoy security.....they scattered APCs throughout the convoy and their Cav Squadron usually had troops deployed in the vicinity of likely ambush points. It was always reassuring to have gunships in the area and someone close with a radio on their frequency. I don't have any experience with LAVs but I wouldn't think they would have a problem running at normal convoy speeds.
18 posted on 08/08/2003 7:25:23 PM PDT by Ben Hecks
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To: gunnrmike
Ooooooooo...Muttly NEED Alabama Slammer.

How am I supposed to get to sleep NOW ?!!!
19 posted on 08/08/2003 7:31:01 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (No Kibble - No Peace)
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