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The failure of feminism.
08/01/03 | Francesca Venturi Bernardini

Posted on 08/01/2003 9:47:27 AM PDT by Ippolita

The failure of feminism

Feminism began as the battle for equality of civil rights for women. It has ended in the belief that the best possible woman is a man. Maybe, at the dawn of the third Christian millennium it is time to take stock.

1. A little bit of history.
Although feminists like to discuss the existence of matriarchal societies (that is: societies were women wield power) the truth is that the examples, in both myth and history, are far and few between. Matriarchal societies are important because they allow feminists to project their ideals for the future into the past, and hence claim that they are not really revolutionizing anything, but simply re-establishing past traditions. Prime examples are the completely erroneous usage of the Amazons, of the Queens of Egypt, of several American Indian tribes, none of which show any form at all of matriarchy.

2. A little bit of anthropology.
Many cultures do show the tracing of the female lineage, this however has got nothing to do with the actual wielding of power. That the lineage be traced by female descent is normal: after all it is women that give birth; power, however, is then to be found on the avuncular level: the brother of the mother, the uncle (lat. avunculus, hence avuncular), is the head of the family. This is true of the Iroquois, as of the ancient Hebrews, as of Islam. Nothing feminist about it, it is simply a way of tracing descent: of keeping track of people in relation to oneself. The real innovation is paternity: the attribution of the child not the mother and her family, but to the father and his family: The creation of a father-line, when paternity is anything but sure - unless you get a DNA check – is the cultural step.
Suppose a given culture is exogamic and divided into 3 clans A, B, C. Prescribed marriage rules indicate: A* - B+; B* - C+; C* - A+ (where * = male, + = female, and - = marries). The offspring, in a matrilinear culture, are attributed to the female clans so a male child of A* - B+ is B*, of B* - C+ is C+, and of C* - A+ is A*. This translates into a redistribution of wealth through the clans because an A father’s possessions will go the B clan, etc. The creation of patrilinear descent translates into the concentration of ‘goods’ in one clan. If A* has an A* child it all stays in the same family.
Ancient Egypt, the first in history to tackle the problem, devises an endogamic system: A* marries A+, possibly sister marries brother. One would think all of ancient Egyptians to be incestuous perverts but in truth this strict endogamy is prescribed only for the royal line: this is where it is REALLY important for the ‘goods’ to stay in the family, since the possession needing to be transmitted is power. Hence the fabled Egyptian queens much loved by feminists. We will return to them shortly.

3. A little bit of mythology.
Much is also made out of the existence of mythological creatures which seem to incarnate the feminist ideal. Here the archetype is that of the Amazons: gorgeous warrior women, so attractive that the ritual mutilation of their breast (they cut off one, to better wield the bow) only enhanced their beauty, brave beyond belief, raiders of horses; they were a sort of ante litteram ‘special ops troops’. These ladies, according to Greek myth, used to kidnap men to procreate. They killed the male offspring and nurtured only the girls. The men were kept at home, as slaves, to cook, clean, and take care of the children, while the Amazons, hunted, foraged, and fought as mercenaries.
Working on the assumption that if Schliemann found Troy, they could find ‘Amazonia’ many scholarly feminists have tried to anchor this myth in history. Unfortunately myth doesn’t work the way they would like: Schliemann moved from the assumption that if many other cities in the Homeric epic were real (Athens, Thebes, etc.) then why not Troy? While no myth records the existence of an Amazon city, or settlement for that matter. Myth records the existence of Cyclopes, one eyed monstrous giants, but no one in their right sane mind would think Cyclopes existed anywhere. Moreover myth often works by using opposites. A myth founds reality as it is today, things which happened at the time of myth can no longer happen now. So Amazons are a cultural antithesis, a direct opposite of what Greek society was really like.

4. A little more anthropology.
Most cultures show an internal (home) role for the woman and an external role for the man. This, in part, is due to objective biological necessities and, in part, to cultural determination. Nature decrees nine months of pregnancy and seven years nurturing by the mother (the first three very intense), this makes the woman prefer an stable social structure over a nomadic one; hence her predilection for agriculture over hunting and gathering. Most cultures have myths on the introduction of agriculture (whether cereal or tuber) which have a woman protagonist (Isis, Demeter, Hainuwele, etc:). Most cultures also ascribe a civilizing role to the woman: a transition from wild to domestic. Stable conditions create a surplus of goods (land, livestock, accumulated produce, capitalization, gold and ultimately of course power) to be ‘passed on’ and a cultural necessity for patrilineal lineage. In the absence of DNA tests ancient cultures remedied by closeting their women. This ensured chastity as well as the possibility of continued surveillance (virginity being the prime requirement for the male to ensure that his specific seed got in first, while seclusion was necessary to ensure his seed was also the only one to get in).

5. A little more history.
Most ancient cultures were royal cultures, where positive law was unheard of. The Greeks, with their idea of politeia and of demokratia, and then the Romans, with their res publica and their constitutio, changed the picture. The Greeks invented the elective process and genetic citizenship (birth rights), Romans invented the ius civilis and extendable citizenship (any one could become a roman citizen if they fulfilled the right criteria) and civil rights were born. These of course did not extend to women. Women could not vote, could not bear arms, could not inherit directly, etc: They also did not pay taxes, which, in my opinion, was a perk.
Obviously, royal dynasties and oligarchic families always had means of protecting themselves, and in extremis solutions (special laws allowing women to inherit, special dispensations allowing women to sit on the throne, etc) have always been available. The women which history remembers, however, and portrays in a position of power, followed the dominant culture: Hatshepsut ruled as Pharaoh (wearing a false beard and a false phallus and all the male regalia) and so did Cleopatra; Queen Elisabeth the first acted like a king.
Things pottered along in history with no great change until the industrial revolution when, for the first time the women were removed from their traditional domestic setting, and introduced into the factory. Obliged to work as men some of them began to clamour for the extension of civil rights. Suffragettes asked for the vote, women workers asked for equal pay, the right to education was soon acknowledged as part of the requests and women in general began broadening their possibilities in life.
The need to extend civil rights to women was of course very important and I stand proudly behind those women that initially fought hard and long for this basic recognition.

6. A little bit of polemics.
Since then however things have gone completely over-board. The fight the equality of civil rights has turned into a fight for equality full stop. The feminist movement has lost the battle for the ERA and has instead successfully placed women in the untenable position to have to work and act like men. In short, the feminist movement has been unable to create a real female culture, nor a pro-female culture. They have adopted male behaviour at all levels from working hours to combat but have been unable to promote laws which protect the fundamental birthright of a woman: i.e. to have a child. While the USA calmly allows its young women to get in harms way in war (if they so wish), a working woman who wants to have a family has only three weeks delivery leave and no guarantee that her job will still be there when she gets back. Oh yes, I know, a job is guaranteed; that means that a top level executive manager in Air France returns to work after birthing her baby and finds herself working in the mail room. The feminist movement seems to have gone down the path of diversity more than equality, reinforcing the position of those masculine ladies who prefer to live a man’s life while betraying those many millions of women who are happy and proud to be female, and who would like to be able to enjoy their traditional role without peer pressure to ‘get a career’ and with some guarantees for their jobs.
The model roles proposed by these anti-woman feminists are always masculine ones: hence their fixation with the Amazons (who behaved like men) with the queens of Egypt (who ruled as Pharaohs and hence as men): The ultimate objective is the ‘empowering of women’: hence, their fixation with matriarchy (the rule of women as opposed to that of men).
A true feminist movement would work to support the female role within the modern day structure. It should work towards the formation of a culture of respect of both sexes and of their individual responsibilities and not towards the transformation of two sexes into one.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: feminism
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To: elbucko; Ippolita
From the article:
"Most cultures have myths on the introduction of agriculture (whether cereal or tuber) which have a woman protagonist (Isis, Demeter, Hainuwele, etc:). Most cultures also ascribe a civilizing role to the woman: a transition from wild to domestic. Stable conditions create a surplus of goods (land, livestock, accumulated produce, capitalization, gold and ultimately of course power) to be ‘passed on’ and a cultural necessity for patrilineal lineage."

***************

Why would accumulating property make patrilineal lineage necessary?

Having property go through women makes just as much sense; more really, since measuring lineage through women was the traditional method, and tradition of any kind is not easily overthrown.

21 posted on 08/01/2003 12:32:32 PM PDT by exodus
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To: exodus
I can think of a few male politicians who fit your criteria for hermaphrodite, not really men. On both sides of the aisle.

Agreed. However, they tend to agree, politically, with the hermaphrodite women. The exceptions will, generally, tend to prove the rule.

22 posted on 08/01/2003 1:21:29 PM PDT by elbucko
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To: exodus
Abraham was willing to sacrifice his son to God.

Perhaps. I prefer that Abraham was willing to obey God. If that meant sacrificing Isaac, Abe would obey the Lord. A friend and Rabbi, who has on occasion had me at his Sader table during Passover, considers this to be a parable AGAINST child sacrifice, and an attempt to put an end to it in the ancient world.

23 posted on 08/01/2003 1:40:23 PM PDT by elbucko
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To: exodus
Why would accumulating property make patrilineal lineage necessary?

Having property go through women makes just as much sense...

Maybe in a just world, but the history of mankind is not so. Men will fight to the death to defend their home (or they should), women will merely be killed (or, at best raped, and forced to bear the children of the conquerer and his lineage). This is true for the male of many species. The male bird is territorial. The female will defend to the death her young, but will not defend an empty nest. The male, however, will. Because the nest is the "future to the male. The discussion of "lineage" and "property" are actually two different subjects, though they affect each other in the life cycle of a species.

IMHO, it is precisely this confusion of the value given to property and offspring by males and females that causes many of our socio-political problems.

24 posted on 08/01/2003 1:57:25 PM PDT by elbucko
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To: Ippolita
I'm all for 'feminism,' e.g. equal pay for equal work, allowing women to enter any career or hold any job for which they can meet the same qualifications as men.

Having said that, I think it is always better for mom to stay home with the kids until they get out of grade school. I also think women who are rabidly anti-male have been hurt by a guy at some point in their lives and have simply shut themselves off to any possibility of having a relationship with a real man.

I can tell you, I love having my knight in shining armor come in and kill that spider for me. LOL

25 posted on 08/01/2003 2:06:59 PM PDT by MEGoody
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To: KellyAdmirer
"The Carthaginians had a gruesome practice of child sacrifice at places called tophets."

Now we call them abortion clinics.

26 posted on 08/01/2003 2:07:55 PM PDT by MEGoody
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To: Ippolita
I enjoyed reading this.
27 posted on 08/01/2003 2:25:55 PM PDT by eabinga
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To: jjm2111; NYer
Actually not over the top at all. This episode really happened in middle of the 1980's at AirFrance in NYC. I believe another freeper should be able to confirm it.
Nyer does it ring a bell?

Yes you keep title and same pay but what is the use of being CEO in a mail room? The lady in question quit her job and moved on to another corporation.
28 posted on 08/01/2003 5:15:11 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: elbucko
:)
I guess so!
29 posted on 08/01/2003 5:16:37 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: elbucko
A surplus of goods promotes envy in societies that do NOT have stable conditions (or, crime causes poverty). This compels the "Stable Society" to consider the necessity of self defense, until the unstable societies become stable. Until then, it's still a dangerous world.

Good point!

30 posted on 08/01/2003 5:19:04 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: elbucko
IMHO, the present day example of this phenomenon is the rise of the Democrat female politician. When one ponders Hillary, Barbara Boxer, Loretta Sanchez and, to a certain extent, Diane FeinStein, the image of hermaphrodite comes to mind. Not woman.

Yes, that is a precise trend today, which is certainly a consequence of this mentality. The 'hermaphhrodite' is a good metaphore for the type of future 'human' these ladies envisage.

31 posted on 08/01/2003 5:22:23 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: exodus
Carthage, like many other societies of the ancient world maintained the matrilinear descent. This does not mean 'power'. As to the several primitive tribes where the Chief would be a man, but the women of the tribe were the ones who chose which man would be the Chief, and could remove the Chief from his position if he proved incompetent, this can be true, but the pool from which the new chief can be picked is determined by the culture, making the choice very restricted, and limited within certain bounds.
A similar situation seemed to be in vogue in the early sumerian culture where the godess Inanna 'chose' the new king through a blind draw: the candidates had to find a certain gem, hidden among various piles of dates; of course the whole affaire was carefully rigged, so much so, that we have the'texts' on which the players acted their parts.
32 posted on 08/01/2003 5:31:47 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: BubbaBasher
Jewish culture is and always has been a matriarchal structure>BR> Jewish culture is matrilinear not matriarchal. That is, being jewish is traced by female line: if your mother is Jewish, you are jewish; if your mother is not, you are not.

This is shown quite clearly in the Bible. Ishmael could not be part of the Jewish story because his mother was not Jewish, while Isaac was Jewish because Sarai was. If the line had been traced throught the male, in this case Abraham, then Ishmael would have been as Jewish as Isaac.

33 posted on 08/01/2003 5:38:44 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: exodus
Why the silence? There should be a distinct record of the change, of what would have been a world-shaking change in both property and civil law.

No silence: what you call 'historical times' (meaning times that have left written trace of themselves, as opposed to prehistoric times, of which only mute artifacts remain), are precisely the trace you are looking for: And what a racket it has made: from Egypt where this whole thing began around 4000 b.C. the idea of paternity (and its cultural benefits - stability of power, definition of nationality, etc.) swept through the known world and took it by storm.
Many ancient cultures could not full adapt to the new idea and like Carthage, Israel, Crete and Greece, maintained a dual standard (avuncularity). Others, like Egypt and Rome, adopted this new structure completely, and revolutionized the world: the first transformed the polytheistic system to define Egypt as a nation, and Kingship as a power structure (this is the true beginning of history as Kingship always leaves written documentation of itself); the second, many millenia later, transformed polytheism to define the 'state' as a super-ethnic entity (as compared to a nation which is ethnic based), and the republic as a power structure.

34 posted on 08/01/2003 5:53:52 PM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: exodus
yes. Read my reply to BubbaBasher.
35 posted on 08/02/2003 5:45:15 AM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: exodus
Why would accumulating property make patrilineal lineage necessary?

In the marilinear system, goods get distributed around (see Paragraph 2). Only with a surplus of goods (created by stable conditions) is there the need to transmit these goods to one's offspring (and not to the tribe in general) . In the female-line system the concentration of goods is vanified by the redistribution amongst the clans.

36 posted on 08/02/2003 5:51:49 AM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: MEGoody
I'm all for 'feminism,' e.g. equal pay for equal work, allowing women to enter any career or hold any job for which they can meet the same qualifications as men.

That is not femminism. You (and I) are all for the equality of civil rights which should be applied without regard for race, gender, creed, etc.

This said, the state should recognize the necessity of the woman's nurturing role and hence should move to protect it, not to disregard it by blindly applying a supposed equality of standard.

37 posted on 08/02/2003 5:58:02 AM PDT by Ippolita (Si vis pacem para bellum)
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To: Ippolita
As in some cultures women were to have doweries(sp)?
38 posted on 08/02/2003 6:56:47 AM PDT by countrydummy
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To: Ippolita
I so agree. Women that wish to be mothers and stay at home, are unable to do so in today's world. There is no support given. If one chooses to stay home, it is a great sacrifice for the family unit starting with finances. The less finances available, then the less chance of learning opportunities for the children. (I am not talking about money to buy boats and expensive cars!). As part of society and the history of such, stay home mothers have proven that crime rates are less, children are brighter and healthier.
39 posted on 08/02/2003 7:02:27 AM PDT by countrydummy
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To: Ippolita; carenot; farmfriend; Nick Danger; Lorianne
Good article.

For some truly insightful analysis of why societies fall into nihilistic chaos when men are marginalized/disempowered/deprived of their children, check out Nick Dangers many posts on this thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/946681/posts

40 posted on 08/04/2003 7:51:23 PM PDT by Z in Oregon
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