Pilots Soak Up Firearms Training

Atlanta Journal Constitution (via Firearmnews.com) ^ | Mary Lou Pickel

[heckler]

BRUNSWICK -- If there's one thing an armed pilot cannot do, it is allow a terrorist to take the gun away.

That's why 12 pairs of sweaty airline pilots punched, grabbed and pulled at each other at the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center here Wednesday. They were learning how to ward off an attacker trying to get their pistols.

The pilots are part of the latest group of 44 training for federal approval to carry guns in the cockpit to deter terrorist attacks -- and defend their planes and passengers if one occurs.

[rockfish59]

Hmm..all the fighter pilots in WW2, Korea and Vietnam all carried sidearms!

What the hell's the problem, Mineta?? Get your ass in gear!!
Stop listening to the Million Mom Marchers and Sarah Brady!

[ibbryn]

They need to get rid off the b.s. two hour psyc exam. If they don't have confidence that the pilots are sane, don't let them pilot.
The pilots also need to be permitted to carry 24/7 on or off duty, anywhere a Fed can carry. Putting 1000's of armed pilots on the street should be very useful in providing "homeland security." I'm suprized the Feds haven't figured that our. (ha!)

[Darksheare]

*SSSSSSH!*
Do you want to give them ideas?!
It's bad enough they confiscate fingernail clippers and emery boards at the airport, I don't want them storming in my front door just ecause I'm filing/clipping off a hangnail!!

[TXnMA]

What's the purpose of the 2 Glassers?

Studies have shown that the first 2 shots in a violent confrontation -- as the antagonists maneuver for cover -- have the most likelihood of going astray.

That loadout is for dense urban carry; out here in the boonies, where the backdrop is far less populated, I use all Federal HPs or Hydrashocks as you do.

I love my M8 -- the M13's grip always felt like a 2X4 in my hand. I shoot modified Weaver, and my P7M8 is totally inert until the front sight is on target and the final "lockup" of the rearward-pulling off-hand squeezes the grip-cocker. That's real gun control!!

Any time I need more than 9 plus a spare 8, I am going to be hauling you-know-what out of the situation as fast as I can. (Or facing the situation from the get-go with one of those horrid "assault weapons" and/or a full-combat Mossberg.)

BTW, the advent of body armor has caused me to retrain from the old "double-tap to center-of-mass and 1 to the head" drill to "1 to C-O-M and 2 to the head". Breaking years of training & practice ain't easy! Glad I reload...

To the rest of you FReepers -- apologies for all the "shop talk"...

[TXnMA]

I wish I had another one. M13 maybe?

See my #44...

[TXnMA]

Oh, can you explain those gelatinous bullets?

See comments #23, #27, #32, and #44...

[TXnMA]

"An armed pilot in the air makes me feel safer than 10,000 federal bureaucrats on the ground. "

AMEN! That should be the "Quote of the Day"!!

[UpToHere]

Hmm..all the fighter pilots in WW2, Korea and Vietnam all carried sidearms!

Still do

[PsyOp]

Great follow-up on the glasers. I've never fired any myself but have seen demo films of what they do--very nasty--wouldn't want to get in the way of one. I keep promising to get some for my .44 mag, but I have a Win 1200 pump for home defense. Wouldn't think of using the .44 indoors without glasers.

A couple weeks ago I saw something new (to me anyway). I think they were called Hydra-Shocks. They use stacked discs. They appear very nasty and have many of the same benefits as the Glaser, except they have greater penetration.

[Shooter 2.5]

Hydra-Shoks don't use stacked discs. You must be thinking of another manufacturer. Hydra-Shoks are identified by a post in the middle of the hollow point that's supposed to redirect the penetrated material to the outside of the bullet cavity.

[LibKill]

The really great thing about this is, the hijackers won't know which pilot has a gun.

In a discussion about my CHL (Concealed Handgun License) my YELLOW-DOG-DEMOCRAT Uncle told me;

"You are performing a public service when you carry your gun. When I go to the mall, the bad guys don't know if it is me or you."

Crime is down in Texas since we got CHL.

May it be the same for our airlines.

[PsyOp]

Hydra-Shoks don't use stacked discs.

You're probably right. I was guessing at the name and that's what came to mind. I'll have to go back to the store and take a look at them again.

[steve-b]

Isn't airline safety the reason the glaser safety bullet was developed? Those 8 shot filled gelatinous bullets that don't penetrate much, so the aircraft hull has a lower chance of rupturing if the pilot misses the perp.

"Rupturing the hull" is not an issue in any case. Goldfinger is an action movie, not a documentary.

[Atlas Sneezed]

Bang

[Atlas Sneezed]

I love my M8 -- the M13's grip always felt like a 2X4 in my hand. I shoot modified Weaver, and my P7M8 is totally inert until the front sight is on target and the final "lockup" of the rearward-pulling off-hand squeezes the grip-cocker. That's real gun control!!

---

My M8 prefers to be cocked as it is brought up to the target, just as a 1911 shooter would click the safety.

I find that cocking after being on target disturbs my grip and sight alignment.

I do, however, scrupulously keep my finger off the trigger until it is time to go "bang."

[Veloxherc]

The shrinks ask you to talk about a traumatic experience in your life. 9-11 duh!!

[TERMINATTOR]

Yes they need a bulletproof partition behind the pilots. Fire at will!

[supercat]

Pilots who do NOT "pass the background and psychological tests" darn well shouldn't be driving fully loaded airliners God-only-knows-where.

The concern--probably warranted--is that the psychological tests could be run by people who want as few pilots as possible to pass.

I would expect that someone who was giving psychological tests and wanted to fail as many people as possible could probably find some reason to disqualify just about anybody.

In most circumstances, psych evals are done by people who prefer to have candidates pass. While an employer would hope to reject people who would be unsuitable for their position, an employer wants to find qualified employees. Thus, it's unlikely that a psych eval will be particularly biased against a prospective pilot.

By contrast, since the TSA is run by people who want to arm as few pilots as possible (preferably none), it seems likely that their psych evaluators will have a strong bias against all prospective applicants.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

since the TSA is run by people who want to arm as few pilots as possible (preferably none), it seems likely that their psych evaluators will have a strong bias against all prospective applicants.

I quite agree, and I see now that it is possible to misunderstand my point which quite simply is that if you give someone the controls of a fully loaded, fully fueled 747 you are giving them the ability to conduct a suicide attack just about anywhere. If 9/11 proved anything it proved that it's pretty stupid to then blanch at the thought that that same person might elect to carry a (gasp of horror) gun!

Fascinating to think how liberals' basic philosophy is that the government can be trusted with unlimited power to do good under the control of the smart people, on the one hand - and on the other hand they have a revulsion at a symbol of authority in the hands of a specific real, existing person at the human level.