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Why I Outsource Offshore
Friday, July 18, 2003 | Me

Posted on 07/18/2003 3:52:41 PM PDT by FoxPro

Why I Outsource Offshore

Friday, July 18, 2003

When the planes hit the World Trade Center, I was sitting in my cozy sunroom home office. Living in Fairfax County Virginia, we actually heard the plane that hit the Pentagon fly very low overhead. We knew something else was going to get hit. Then we actually heard and felt the explosion. The next minute my son and I were outside in the street looking up into the sky. We didn’t know what to expect.

I didn’t know that my life had radically changed that day; I knew the country had, that was quite apparent. But the downward spiral I was about to take wasn’t going to be pretty.

I remember telling my sons pre 9/11 about the phone calls I would get from headhunters, at least once a day. I would tell my kids’ that was real job security, having skills that were readily needed in the marketplace. I actually made $16,000 in about a day, tracking down a bug in a major government computer system. I remember working on another system on my laptop aboard a cruise ship in the Caribbean (the cruise ships had just gotten email capabilities, and my client had no idea where I was, and didn’t care). Talk about working from home! We all probably all have many great memories of the good times.

The week after 9/11, nobody returned my phone calls. I had a couple of contracts with a very large city government. We couldn’t even get into the building. Of course I later found out that the city was much more interested in detecting anthrax and acquiring and placing cement barriers than the work I was doing for them, tracking the maintenance of the cities trees and processing abandon vehicles left on the city streets. I was instantly unemployed. It was the end of an era.

It was time to send out some resumes, nothing, time to get out the Rolodex and tap into my “old boy network”, nothing. A month goes by, then two. I remember going to the local shoe retailer, because they had a sign posted looking for a store manager. I showed the current manager my resume, and he told me not to bother applying, they knew I would be gone the instant I got another tech job. Time to send out thousands of resumes, all over the world, nothing. Several months pass. I tap into my homes equity to pay the mortgage, sort of like chewing your own arm off. All my friends are doing likewise. We talk with each other, it deadens the boredom and pain, misery loves company.

Ok, so I am going to re-tool, so I buy some on-line coursework to learn Oracle 9i. I start digging in 8 hours a day, going through the coursework; I hate every second of it.

I actually started reading articles about offshore outsourcing here on freerepublic.com. I was upset by this as most people were. I had lost my wife by then, and it is apparent that the house that I had planned to play with my grandkids in will be gone soon also. I am at my low point.

Just through dumb luck, a complete stranger calls me up one day, and tells me he ran into my resume, and was impressed with my background. He tells me that over the last year, he has cobbled together a team of programmers in Moscow that can write computer systems in just about any language. He tells me they are quite good, and I believe him because I have worked with Russian programmers before. The he told me one thing that would change my career goals forever. The Russians will write computer systems, Including Oracle systems for as little as $15 per hour. In other words, I am beating my brains out to learn a computer database system that can be done elsewhere in the world for about the same price as is paid to a cahier at the local grocery store. This changes everything. I rewrite my rather lengthy resume.

I cobble together a list of email addresses of headhunters and other companies from several job boards. The title I put on my resume is “Offshore Outsourcing Project Manager”. In my resume under the skills section I put the rather lengthy list of technical skills the Russians posses. The list includes just about every major computer system I have ever come across. It is the ultimate resume. I mail out a few hundred. I don’t have to wait for long.

The next day, the phone rings. Another telemarketing call, I am thinking. The man on the other end of the line tells me he is looking at my resume. He starts explaining a project he needs accomplished, actually two projects. I have no idea what he is talking about. And I can tell he is getting frustrated. He tells me that he is going to email me his address, and I should show up the next day at 1 PM. I am excited yet confused. I don’t sleep well that night.

I am ushered into a boardroom a little after one the next day. I didn’t eat lunch, partially because I really don’t have much money, and I am a little dizzy (lost 30 pounds through the last 12 months). They start explaining the projects to me, three guys, a marker board and me for 3 hours. The last hour I am just sitting there with my mouth hanging open. I am starting to get what they want, two computer systems for arguably the largest retail chain in the world. They are massive undertakings using cutting edge technology, and it is obvious it will take dozens of programmers and other specialists (maybe more). Then they tell me how much they want to pay for all of this, and it isn’t much. But it beats the heck out of what I made in the last 6 months, which was nothing. At this point I am only thinking that I want to just get something going, anything. I just want something to do, any form of cash flow, to make some contacts and get the hell out of my house once in a while.

I instant messaged the Russians the next morning. They couldn’t believe whom the project was for or the massive scope of the undertaking. I had my Visio thing going most of the night, and I had some pretty dead on flow charts of what was explained to me, which I emailed to them. They started sending over some very impressive examples of XML scripts based on my previous nights work and the hours of conversations we had. The client liked it all. They were impressed. I could not believe what I was getting into.

We all signed the clients NDA’s, and wrangled over some small details in our various contracts. We put together a scope of work, and set a timeline with invoiceable milestones in MS Project (the Russians are very good at this also). My project leads wife had a baby, and we all send each other pictures of our kids. Weeks pass in preparation. I am starting to get to know these guys, and they work together as a precise seamless team (woman are not allowed in there office building). They work late into the night (5 PM EST is 1 AM Moscow time). The client is happy, we are busy and I can’t provide any further details for legal reasons. Suffice it to say your mother/sister/wife will probably use this system at a store near you within the next few months. And I get to point to it and say, “I did that”. I didn’t make much money off of it, but it sure beat sitting at home all day playing computer games.

A little information on the team:

They don’t speak English, but they read and write it well. In the late 80s the Russian defense industries essentially imploded, and a lot of very intelligent people were left jobless (sounds familiar). It was at about this time the Internet came into its own (well email initially). They started getting possession of US computer systems documentation. Many of them learned English by mastering these systems. It took them several years to do this. Thousands of hours of hard work and study. They are very good technical writers and write proposals and documentation like no others that I have seen. They are very productive, and are slowly getting rich (by there standards). I have never met any of them personally, but look forward to doing so someday. I do enjoy working with them. They are slowly becoming good friends.

In conclusion:

Am I taking jobs from Americans, yes, do I feel bad about this, yes, do I have any other choice other than waiting tables, no.

Should I mop floors to keep an American in a cubicle, I will let you decide.


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To: FreedomCalls
"The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them."

But we're not selling, we're buying.

I think the old days of large industrial countries fighting one another is dead and gone. The more interlinking of economic systems the better.

Some will bleat that "it didn't stop WWII". Yup. And there wasn't nearly the level of magnitude of international economy as today either. We wouldn't dream of going to war with France or Germany today. Even if they are jerks. But we certianly did go after Germany 60 years ago.

61 posted on 07/18/2003 5:02:04 PM PDT by narby (Terminate Gray Davis)
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To: narby
If the retailer knew they could get software for $15/hr, then that's what they'll pay.

Bingo, you have won the cigar. I did this to make contacts and avoid boredom. I am really not making much money on this. Not enough to pay my mortgage certainly. I suppose I could join the Peace Corp. And I actually looked into this.

62 posted on 07/18/2003 5:03:00 PM PDT by FoxPro
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To: Moose4
I thought it was a kitten?

Get with the program (no pun intended) it's PUPPY, PUPPY man.


63 posted on 07/18/2003 5:03:22 PM PDT by unixfox (Close the borders, problems solved!)
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To: FoxPro
The answer to America's high tech unemployment problems are hidden right here in FoxPro's post, if folks will just stop and think about it.

It might take some legal help, nasty confrontations and court cases, but it can be done and won.

I've got to be on the road for a few hours, but will check this thread later.

64 posted on 07/18/2003 5:05:33 PM PDT by meadsjn
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To: FoxPro
Don't beat yourself up. You have to do what you have to do. I'm very much opposed to outsourcing, but I'm not going to lie to myself about what I would do in your shoes. Hell, I've already decided if I get laid off and the job market is really as bad as it seems, that I will pursue opportunities overseas (Ireland maybe) as a PM for coders. I would still vote for candidates that worked to limit outsourcing.
65 posted on 07/18/2003 5:09:22 PM PDT by StolarStorm
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To: FoxPro
Just for you, my friend, I found a couple of Indian and Pakistani programmers who happen to keep PO boxes right here in the states. Let us know when you get another hot American project.
66 posted on 07/18/2003 5:09:35 PM PDT by meadsjn
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To: FoxPro
OK
I decide you suck.
Not for outsourcing, but for actually believing my memory is so short that the whole Y2K panic, and frantic search for IT professionals, and the obscene wages the IT world commanded for the industry should be maintained indefinately, for your personal benefit.
IIRC, H1Bs were strictly controlled in the years leading up to the dreaded end of the computerised world,2000.
Bet "you", as in your type, paid an illegal immigrant slave wages to clean your house/pool/lawn and perhaps babysit your children while the big money was flowing.
"You" justified your skirting of labor laws by saying it is unfair for you to have to pay legally for an employee, all the unfair taxes the government charges employers.It didnt bother you a bit that many honest and "legal" citizens could not compete financially at the level you were willing to pay for labor.
After all, it was your hard earned money...
Now it is your horse that is being gored.Hard to step down from the elite position? Should I sympathise with you?LOL!
Yes, I decide you suck.
67 posted on 07/18/2003 5:10:23 PM PDT by sarasmom (Punish France.Ignore Germany.Forgive Russia.(Tell Turkey to lay off the hookah).)
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To: unixfox
Guys, guys, settle down. You're ALL right.

Yes, it's true. Every time you outsource a job, God kills a puppy, a kitty, a baby lamb AND a baby seal.

I hope that settles the matter.
68 posted on 07/18/2003 5:11:21 PM PDT by Elliott Jackalope (Formerly Billy_bob_bob)
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To: kezekiel
To survive, we are all going to have to get tougher, faster, smarter, and bolder. Bitching about all the little yellow people who will work for less than us is probably a big waste of time.

Having worked with a few Hi-B's, I must comment on a very likable fellow I know from India. While listening to him talk may make me dizzy at times, he writes proposals and technical reports in absolutely the most beautiful English I have ever seen. His mastery of the language is far better than mine, and of most people posting here. My wife told me not to feel too badly about it..."After all, they were part of the Empire for a long time! Of COURSE Ravi would be good at it!"

69 posted on 07/18/2003 5:13:35 PM PDT by Gorzaloon (Contents may have settled during shipping, but this tagline contains the stated product weight.)
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To: sarasmom
Yes, I decide you suck.

Everything you said in your post is completely true. I do suck, and quite frankly it would be nice to be sucked again (I do remember those days fondly). But all of your points are well taken. See how confusing this is? Lets go out and have a beer sometime, eh?

The Internet, the great equalizer.

70 posted on 07/18/2003 5:17:26 PM PDT by FoxPro
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To: FoxPro
I dont have a security clearence. If you dont have one it is almost imposible to get one. If you do have a security clearence, it is very easy to get one. See how that works?

Clinton got one. I would think after that, anyone could send a quarter and a ceral boxtop to DISCO or DoE and get one.

71 posted on 07/18/2003 5:18:27 PM PDT by Gorzaloon (Contents may have settled during shipping, but this tagline contains the stated product weight.)
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To: Poohbah
the world was so starved for industrial capacity that we could do low-quality work for big bucks...

Very true. It's going to be hard for some folks to adapt to the new reality, but I think we can do it. In my mind, adaptability is the key word for us all.

72 posted on 07/18/2003 5:21:06 PM PDT by livius
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To: narby
If trade freedom is good between the states, then obviously it's good between countries.

Apparently you didn't take economics in college. The kind of "trade" we're talking about does not help the American economy. Unless American businesses reinvest their capital in the local ecomomy or lower their prices the only people who benefit is the corporation and someone from China/India/etc.

Joe corporate executive that does the outsourcing might spend some personal income in the economy but that's nickle and dime stuff compared to 1000's of white collar workers.

73 posted on 07/18/2003 5:25:31 PM PDT by RockyMtnMan
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To: FoxPro
You ever head out in the back yard, look at an anthill, and just stir that sucker up?

;^)

74 posted on 07/18/2003 5:32:23 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (© 2003, Ravin' Lunatic since 4/98)
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To: Cyber Liberty
You ever head out in the back yard, look at an anthill, and just stir that sucker up?

Been known to do that in my yute, yep yep.

75 posted on 07/18/2003 5:35:37 PM PDT by FoxPro
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To: FoxPro
Yer doin' it in yer old age...yup yup yup!
76 posted on 07/18/2003 5:37:26 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (© 2003, Ravin' Lunatic since 4/98)
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To: FoxPro
I dont see anything confusing in our respective posts.
Why are you confused?
You chose your path.
Many men, and a few women, died to give you that choice.
Can you understand how insulting it is to the society these people fought for, and are fighting for now, even as we "speak" that you would dare ask for justification over the bodies of dead soliders,that you get an extra 50K a year reward for screwing your fellow citizens for an additional 2% profit?
I am certain you would not enjoy a "talk over drinks" experience with me.I do not enjoy watching grown men cry.
77 posted on 07/18/2003 5:42:35 PM PDT by sarasmom (Punish France.Ignore Germany.Forgive Russia.(Tell Turkey to lay off the hookah).)
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To: FoxPro
Happy to see you followed up on writing about this. You had brought it up on a prior thread, and that had some interesting stuff in ... I was wondering where that more personal stuff took place in this story?
78 posted on 07/18/2003 5:47:46 PM PDT by bvw
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To: FoxPro
This country still has not recovered from 911. The job market is still in shambles. The economy is barely keeping up.. It's scary how much of a paper tiger it actually is.

And I have a feeling the pause between 911 and whatever future attack they do will be timed to hit just when we do start to recover. Then we'll get knocked down again hard.

That's why I think D5's should've flown that day.
79 posted on 07/18/2003 5:49:51 PM PDT by Monty22
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To: FoxPro
First let me start by congratulating you. Every man should do what it takes to ensure he can provide for his family. Let me also congratulate you on expanding your skill set to include softer skills.

Please don't confuse sound economic decisions for you personally and that of the nation as a whole. Globalisation is relatively new on the economic scene and has many unknown pitfalls. The question is how will it unfold and how will it support the domestic economy? It is improbable at best that we will sustain the tax base our government has grown accustomed to if unemployment continues to rise in the middle class ranks.
80 posted on 07/18/2003 5:51:17 PM PDT by RockyMtnMan
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