CIA: Al-Qaeda worked with ex-Pak scientists [Al-Qaeda has nukes! ]

Hindustan Times.com ^ | 7/4/2003 | Staff Writers

[ex-Texan]

CIA: Al-Qaeda worked with ex-Pak scientists [Al-Qaeda has nukes! ]

Despite repeated Pakistani denials, US intelligence agency CIA has said international terrorist outfit al-Qaeda was working with two former Pakistani scientists and is currently capable of conducting attacks with chemical, biological, radiological or even nuclear weapons.

The CIA in a May 2003 report entitled 'Terrorist CBRN: Materials and Effects' named former scientists of the Pakistan Atomic Energy Commission as Bashir Ud-din Mahmood and Abdul Majeed saying al Qaeda was working with them. These charges have been denied by Pakistani officials.

Handwritten documents uncovered in Afghanistan suggest that Al-Qaeda's specialists did have nuclear physics and weaponisation knowledge that exceeded the type of information available via open and declassified sources, the study reported in 'Jane's Intelligence Digest' said.

The report said the Al-Qaeda, and to a lesser extent other terrorist groups, are currently capable of conducting attacks with biological or even nuclear weapons and that it was "a high probability" that it would be in the next two years.

The US assessment claims that any such CBRN attack would probably be "small-scale", incorporating relatively crude delivery means and easily produced or obtained chemicals, toxins or radiological substances.

Much of the evidence for these claims is drawn from documents, diagrams and other material found at around 40 sites in Afghanistan where Al-Qaeda operated training camps for its militants.

The authors of the CIA report believed Al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups to be capable of making an "improvised nuclear device" that would be "intended to cause a yield-producing nuclear explosion".

The report claims that the group's experts could make such a weapon with "diverted nuclear-weapons components", by modifying an already assembled nuclear weapon or by using a self-designed weapon.

As has been emphasised by both scientists and intelligence community sources, the nuclear threat from terrorists is more likely to be from radiological weapons than from a nuclear device, and that materials for such weapons - such as caesium 137, strontium 90 and cobalt 60 - are widely used in hospitals, universities and various industries.

Al-Qaeda is also claimed by the CIA report to have "crude procedures" for making mustard agent, sarin and VX, as well as access to toxic cyanides and less dangerous industrial materials, such as chlorine and phosgene.

Members of Al-Qaeda cells are alleged to have attempted to launch 'poison plot' attacks in Europe with chemicals and toxins. The relatively easy availability of many common chemicals which could have dual-use adds credibility to this assertion, the CIA report added.

[ex-Texan]

This really ought to be breaking news. First time the CIA has admitted that a-Q may have nukes. But we have speculated about this on FR for ages now.

[Paleo Conservative]

If they really had nukes, why have they not already been used?

[ex-Texan]

Maybe they have been testing our security? Who knows?

[Brad’s Gramma]

I don't know, either, but aren't you glad they HAVEN'T?

[Mo1]

Has any of our press reported on this CIA Report?

[chance33_98]

Well, it is not on the CIA website anymore. But you can get the cached version :)

Terrorist CBRN: Materials and Effects
... extremist groups have a wide variety of potential agents and delivery means to choose from for chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear (CBRN) attacks. ...
www.cia.gov/cia/publications/terrorist_cbrn/ terrorist_CBRN.htm - 19k - Cached

[chance33_98]

ps, I use http://www.google.com/unclesam for searching government sites, which is how I found it.

[Mo1]

Al-Qa'ida is interested in radiological dispersal devices (RDDs) or "dirty bombs."

Oh ok .. this we have heard about

I got this impression from this article, they were talking about a real nuclear bomb

With that said .. either one in the hands of terrorists is bad news

[Paleo Conservative]

I don't know, either, but aren't you glad they HAVEN'T?

Yes, I am glad that they haven't, but I think it is for lack of capability not lack of desire. I think that if Al Qaeda had had a nuclear weapon on September 11, 2001, they would have used it then.

[chance33_98]

A rather interesting read on the subject from the us embassy in tokyo web site.

[John_11_25]

If they really had nukes, why have they not already been used?

There attacks should be at their time of choosing not ours.

Everyday we still discuss 9/11 and the aftermath, the ecomomy is starting to pick up, although 9/11 gave a lot of big companies the opportunity to fire employees and blame it on 9/11, the real fact is the wanted to improve their bottom line and in turn their bonus.

When we are complacent enough and drop our guard, as we think the warnings from Al Quida are just hype, just as the little boy who cried wolf found to his peril, Al Quida will stike. It took them years to plan 9/11 and with the exta secuity measures it may take longer for the next attack, but it will come, but from their point of view why should they rush, "fear" is what it is all about.

How many people in the US since 9/11 have decided not to fly or even to travel outisde of the US since 9/11, I do not know the figure, but I can tell you from the number of serious problems the airlines are having in the US as well as around the world (BA cancelled the Concorde which previously did a good trade between the US and London) it is a lot.

[jaykay]

If they do have a nuke, it is of great value to them. They cannot risk having it discovered. Their top priority is to position it where it will be most effective. Their favorite targets have been New York City and Washington D.C. The added security in those cities and the preciousness of the nuke must make them desperately nervous. They must choose another city or wait for NY and DC to relax.

[Dave S]

First time the CIA has admitted that a-Q may have nukes.

Neither the CIA nor the article says any such thing. Do you know the difference between a radiological device and a nuke. A nuke is a thermonuclear bomb that kills primarily by creating a huge whole in the ground and incinerating anyone within so many miles of ground zero. This is what we had to worry about throughout the Cold War.

A radiologicl device which is what this article refers to is a dirty bomb. Its a regular bomb (dynamite, C-4, whatever) with radioactive waste mixed in. When the blast goes off, the amount of physical damage is controlled by the conventional explosive. Typically it will take down a building, not a block much less a city. The only thing that makes it a WMD is that the radioactive waste that gets thrown up by explosion will contaminate a couple mile area around the blast site and in places like NYC it might be near impossible to adequately clean up the area contaminated. There is no mushroom cloud.

Also if I remember correctly, these Pakistani scientists were captured during the Afghan war so its OLD news.

[Dave S]

Even if they had the plans and parts for a nuclear weapon, they would have to obtain plutonium which while not impossible to get, is not easily obtained. Then they would have to process it. North Korea has been screwing around with this for years and at best the CIA is giving them credit for a handful of nukes. You expect some camel jockies to to do better? I would be much more concerned about them working with Iran than trying to do this on their own.

[meenie]

The problem is not the camel jocks. The problem is the nation that decides to use the camel jock to deliver the weapon. There are plenty of countries that would love to let the camel jocks do the delivery if they could keep it concealed and hidden so retaliation would not come their way.

[philman_36]

For some of the very reasons you've given, and more besides, I'll discount those two areas.
I'm looking for another "Heartland" area strike myself.
There is a lot more to America than NYC and DC.
And if you want morbidity then think of wind patterns and the fallout from a big "dirty" bomb.
And there has been time enough aplenty for "coordinating" too.

[holyh2o]

Yep, I believe it, we have many enemies, there will come a point when they will work secretly together to attack us. They know we will rule the world more so than now, in the future, if they do not plan for a massive attack. Not trying to scare ya'll, but these folks aren't ignorant even though they are brutal(which to me is a form of ignorance). What they learned from this last encounter was to not come in the open and try to punch superman in the stomach. Next time, God forbid, it will be much worse and widespread.
They know they can affect the world economy, and will do so every where they can, it would not surprise me to see a massive influx of immigrants from S. America due to starvation so much so our economy will near collapse between the social aid and the world war.
If it was only the muslims in that day we could prevail, but I suspect China and Russia will play a part and seemingly so appears to already be involved even though they are now being attacked. Islam will accept their partnerships as did Al Queda with Iraq, with the intent of destroying them later. Imagine 10 or so N. Koreas all with nuclear rhetoric, spread us out so thin that fighting on all fronts will be impossible. Fact, thugs and governments are smuggling tons of narcotics into this country daily, either by paying off our officials or by their mules, if they can do this, getting a nuke or bio in is no problem.

I know this is a gloomy scenario, but I think a very realistic one. Biblical in its form for those with Christian faith.

On the up side, we too have friends. All will culminate at Jerusalem, but the days of a nice world to live in are dwindling rapidly as economies and govrnments are attacked.. Be strong, Long live America and Israel, come Lord Jesus!!! God help us.

But take heart, when all comes to pass we will be better people in a world tired of pain and suffering, ready to hear the Lord and live in the Lord's way.


PS, I hope with all my heart that the suffering I see coming is not real, but I think we are on the edge of a terrible war.

[eno_]

I think that if Al Qaeda had had a nuclear weapon on September 11, 2001, they would have used it then.

They took a long time to plan and execute the 9/11 hijackings. If they had a nuke, the project to use it could take years.

[Gabrielle Reilly]

>>>>>>>Even if they had the plans and parts for a nuclear weapon, they would have to obtain plutonium which while not impossible to get, is not easily obtained. Then they would have to process it. North Korea has been screwing around with this for years and at best the CIA is giving them credit for a handful of nukes. You expect some camel jockies to to do better? I would be much more concerned about them working with Iran than trying to do this on their own.>>>>>>>

Hopefully Sadam did not hand any WMD over right before the war. If the WMD left the country were did they go and who did they give them to?

The anthrax sent to Congress was State made quality suspected to have originated from Russia or Iraq. If it was Iraq...