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To: freedumb2003
Don't have kids if you can't afford them. Sacrifice if you do.

Thank you for living up to your screen name by verbalizing the ultimate in self-destructive philosophies. Children, who needs children? They are just a personal choice, society doesn't need a next generation. Are you really unable to see any societal value in having a next generation of Americans, or perhaps I am misunderstanding you, and you were being sarcastic?

Virtually every western nation is facing a social security crisis because there are not enough young people to support the retirees. America is about the best off compared to any developed country because of our immigration. Italy, Japan, Germany, France, they're all facing bankruptcy in their retirement programs. Personally I find that the least of the reasons for wanting to produce a next generation of human beings, but for selfish pragmatic reasons alone, it should be clear that society cannot function when everyone wants to live off someone else's children.

By the time you factor in the costs (2nd car, wardrobe, having strangers raise the kids, etc.) of a 2nd income, the 2nd income is pretty much eaten up.

You make a very valid point on this one. Virtually all second jobs produce a negative return for the family, unless the wife is in the tiny percentage of high-paying jobs like doctor or lawyer. In addition to the costs you've already mentioned, don't forget taxes (the second income is taxed at a much higher rate since you've already used up your deductions) and food (2-income families spend enormous amounts of money on prepared food, affecting not only their budget but contributing to the obesity epidemic in America).

34 posted on 07/05/2003 2:35:29 PM PDT by Maximilian
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To: Maximilian
>>. Children, who needs children? They are just a personal choice, society doesn't need a next generation. Are you really unable to see any societal value in having a next generation of Americans, or perhaps I am misunderstanding you, and you were being sarcastic? <<

Of all the stupid things I have seen on FR, this may be the stupidest. Animals reproduce mindlessly to produce the next generation. Thinking beings consider the results of their actions before procreation. That's what seperates us from the Muslims.

As far as the next (and most important) part of the post goes -- if someone can't afford kids, they shouldn't have them. This is a philisophical statement: I have no idea whether you are sponging off me or not (although your presence in FR suggests you are taking care of yourself).

The myth of the "we need 2 incomes to have kids" infuriates me. The suggestion "the taxpayers have to pay for my kids" drives me through the roof. The statement "we should have kids because we can" is just idiotic.
42 posted on 07/05/2003 3:03:54 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Peace through Strength)
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To: Maximilian
The advent of "women's liberation", where women are expected, instead of having a choice, to work, the labor market has been flooded, which depresses wages. Now we have a situation where if women didn't work, wages would be higher.

All women's liberation into the job market has done is to make everyone earn less.

The same is true as to unlimited immigration. More people, fewer jobs; fewer job applicants, more and higher-paying jobs.

Supply and Demand. Supply and Demand.

46 posted on 07/05/2003 3:53:41 PM PDT by Dec31,1999
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To: Maximilian
You make a very valid point on this one. Virtually all second jobs produce a negative return for the family, unless the wife is in the tiny percentage of high-paying jobs like doctor or lawyer. In addition to the costs you've already mentioned, don't forget taxes (the second income is taxed at a much higher rate since you've already used up your deductions) and food (2-income families spend enormous amounts of money on prepared food, affecting not only their budget but contributing to the obesity epidemic in America).

But the government and the Left likes having 2-income families, because it provides work for the low-skill people who staff the eateries, cleaners, etc that such a family needs to use

66 posted on 07/05/2003 6:31:44 PM PDT by SauronOfMordor (Java/C++/Unix/Web Developer looking for next gig)
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To: Maximilian
Virtually every western nation is facing a social security crisis because there are not enough young people to support the retirees.

So you seem to think the major function of the next generation of Americans is to be the slaves of the retired? We're facing a social security crisis because politicians have fostered this idiot Ponzi scheme and it must inevitably fail. Short of a never ending exponential increase in population the Social Security system was BOUND to fail. Blaming responsible child bearing practices of limited family size ( by the way how many kids I have is MY buisness) is ridiculous.
88 posted on 07/05/2003 11:22:20 PM PDT by Kozak (" No mans life liberty or property is safe when the legislature is in session." Mark Twain)
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