Posted on 06/08/2003 12:38:11 PM PDT by sinkspur
A top Vatican official has said that Palestinians expelled from their property in what is today Israel following conflicts in 1948 and 1967 have the right to return, or at least to be compensated for their loss.
"If you expel me from my home, then in justice you need to let me come back, or at least give me something," said Cardinal Angelo Sodano, the Vatican's Secretary of State.
Sodano suggested that Europeans have a special sensitivity to the question, since at various points of the 20th century Poles, Germans, French and Italians have been driven from areas traditionally considered theirs.
Sodano also suggested that in order to bring peace to the Middle East, Israel will have to sacrifice at least some of its settlements in the occupied territories. He said that a "Gruyere state" for the Palestinians is unacceptable, referring to a kind of cheese full of holes - a metaphor for the settlements.
Both comments reflect standing Vatican positions, but were delivered in unusually frank terms.
Sodano's comments came aboard a catamaran carrying Pope John Paul II and his entourage from the airport in Krk to the island of Rijeka. He took questions on international affairs for the better part of a half-hour.
Asked by NCR if U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell had pressed the Vatican for a concrete commitment on Jerusalem in his meetings last Monday at the Vatican, Sodano responded, "We're the ones who should be asking for a commitment from him."
Sodano reiterated the Vatican's long-standing position in favor of international jurisdiction for the holy sites in Jerusalem.
NCR also asked Sodano if he believes the U.S. commitment to the so-called "road map" for peace in the Middle East is genuine.
"In international diplomacy, you have to take people at their word," Sodano said. "They tell us they are committed, so we accept that they are committed. I believe there is hope."
In a freewheeling reflection on Christianity and Islam, Sodano acknowledged that the Arab world is a "little unknown to us," but said there are encouraging examples of a "tolerant, dialogue-ready Islam" in various places around the globe.
He cited the example of Senegal, where he said that on the occasion of John Paul's February 1992 trip, the president, a Muslim, praised the pope "in extravagant terms that heads of state in the West would not be able to use."
Sodano also pointed to Indonesia, the world's most populous Muslim nation, where at one stage four ministers of the federal government, including the defense minister, were Christians. He acknowledged, however, that Christian/Muslim relations have deteriorated in recent months.
"This tolerant, dialogue-ready Islam still has to arrive in the Arab world," Sodano said.
The Vatican will put up with any number of scofflaws in positions of authority rather than allow even the appearance that the laity can muscle these guys out of power.
The only leverage laymen have in the Catholic Church is to shut their checkbooks, and let the hierarchs know why they're shutting the financial spigot.
Clericalism is alive and well, and likely always will be.
Tell me about it. I am also sick of these people who claim to be Christians, yet speak with forked tongues. There is often not much charitable about their words or actions towards others. Jesus had some strong words for such people. I was about to write an e-mail to all the Catholics that I have kept friendly contact with over the years about my frustration with the spirit of the dialogue on FR concerning religion. Instead of bringing out the best in people, it often brings out the most ugly. I was thinking about taking a sabbatical from the Religion forum, because at this point in my spiritual development, I thought that I really didn't need to deal with all this junk. I have sympathies for the traditionalists and their points, and I have sympathies for those who have stuck with the Church. But with the true radicals on the Left who want to destroy the Church with their evils of abortion and "sexual freedom," and the schismatics and their questionable words at times, I have often felt frustrated. I want to say to a lot of people "Let he is without sin cast the first stone." But the tenacious spirit in me overcame my thoughts to take a break from the Religion forum. Because there should be no break from our mission for the conversion of souls for Jesus, and we should all let God sort things out. We must put trust in Him and pray for the defense of the Church. He will answer our prayers if enough people pray for it.
Not if there's some advantage to be gained. The Church has always weighed in on the side of the Palestinians, I think, because it knows Christians can be subject to persecution in Arab countries if it doesn't!
An Italian foreign policy expert who advises the Vatican said as much a month ago. He opined that the Church can rip the West because It knows it can, without repercussion. Notice, Bush pats the Pope on the head, praises him as a great moral leader, and ignores every political plea he makes because John Paul II has a different agenda than Bush does.
It's already realizing it.
Our parish bulletin had a notice today that, of 4307 registered families, only 1938 (44%) had contributed anything in the last TWO years! Of course, with Mass attendance at 30-50%, that figure looks pretty good. But, the amount of donations has taken a 10% nosedive.
And we've had no scandal in our parish or surrounding parishes. But a lack of trust wafts out to touch even those who are trustworthy.
I suppose that's true, politically at least. But I imagine there are Catholics in the West who are tiring of it, and it's certainly not helpful in recruiting converts or raising donations in America.
Dog, I'd be surprised if 5% of American Catholics even knew the Pope opposed the war on Iraq. They just don't pay attention to what comes out of the Vatican. Many are still angry over the sexual abuse scandals, and will likely remain so for a very long time.
Dallas had to sell most of its holdings, including a historic school in downtown Dallas, to pay off the victims of ONE PRIEST, Rudy Kos.
No new high school in Plano (north Dallas), no new parishes for a while....it's really sad to watch.
And still, the crusty old Bishop, Charles Grahmann, won't take the hint and get out of Dodge.
If so, that demonstrates a stunning lack of moral courage.
Oh. That surprises me.
Well, I guess I'll quit being as disturbed by some of the things coming out of the Vatican. I thought they might be shaping the opinions of churchmembers.
If so, that demonstrates a stunning lack of moral courage.
That's just my surmise. But it's been widely reported that the Pope pushed for inspections in Iraq because he was concerned about a wider Muslim-Christian war. He also,pointedly, never had a word to say about Hussein's human rights abuses because he feared the repercussions to Chaldean Catholics in Iraq.
That's good for the Chaldean Catholics, but, you're right. It doesn't exhibit much moral courage.
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