New study pits Neurologists vs. Chiropractors

BostonGlobe ^ | 5/27/2003 | Stephen Smith

[Jimmyclyde]

It is the medical world's equivalent of the Hatfields and McCoys: Neurologists vs. chiropractors, conventional vs. alternative medicine.

And the feud just got a little nastier this month, with the brain specialists using a freshly minted study by university researchers to load their slingshots with new ammunition aimed at chiropractors. That research links strokes in younger patients to chiropractic neck manipulations.

[Trust but Verify]

Which school of Chiropractic did you graduate from? Just curious.

[longshadow]

...and that this field cannot adequately define or describe the basic pathology they treat or the treatment for it.

"Chiropractic" is a example of a closed, self-referential system. As such, it is not susceptible to disproof, which means it fails the cardinal test of what it takes to be considered a "scientific" theory.

Chiropractic "theory" hypothesizes the existence of disturbances in mysterious (and undetectable) "energy flows" in the body and then relies upon skeletal "manipulations" to restore the proper balance in the "energy flows." But this is intellectually equivalent to hypothesizing that when you feel bad, it is because of invisible (and undetectable) gremlins inside your head, but after massaging your head with magnetic gloves for an hour (at $250/hr)) I can make the invisible gremlins go away. At the end of the hour, I say "They're all gone! Feel better?" And of course you'll say "Yes!" (An hour of massage will make anybody feel better, unless they are profoundly ill.) I'll be $250 richer, you'll be $250 poorer, but you'll "feel better" especially knowing that the invisble gremlins are gone from your head.

That's not practicing medicine.... it's practicing witchcraft -- and fraud.

[js1138]

I'v always wanted to combine Acupuncture (the kind done with hot needles) with Chiropractic. This multidisciplinary approach would be called Pyroquacktic.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

I loved your MD comments!

According to JAMA, Doctors are the THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH in America! The MD-kind!

This is simply why we ALL must be informed about our health and not blindly follow any medical practioner's advice.

AMPU

[TomB]

According to JAMA, Doctors are the THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH in America! The MD-kind!

Do you have a link to that on the JAMA website? I've heard it alleged many times, but never referenced.

[longshadow]

This multidisciplinary approach would be called Pyroquacktic.

Now you've done it! I wonder how long it will take the goon squad to show up to harass you for your temerity to make fun of alternative medicine.

;-)

[Trust but Verify]

Right. And perfectly healthy people walk into hospitals where they are maliciously murdered by homicidal doctors who took years off their own lives for that privilege. What a bunch of bull.

[wardaddy]

Go for the near total meridian trip with about 50 needles...and they might "charge" the needles.

Feels pretty damn good.

First time was a total shock to me...I was very skeptical.

[who knows what evil?]

Can't help with a link, but the article addressing that topic appeared in the July 26, 2000 issue of the JAMA. The author of the article was Dr. Barbara Starfield of the Johns Hopkins School of Hygiene and Public Health. She broke it down as follows:

• Unnecessary Surgery 12,000 dead
• Medical Errors in Hospitals 7,000 dead
• Other Hospital Errors 20,000 dead
• Negative Effects of Drugs 106,000 dead

• Total deaths from iatrogenic causes (ALL instances) 225,000 dead.

  This data was derived from study of HOSPITALIZED patients only...implying that the numbers are probably much higher. You take your chances either way, but you, and you alone, should be the one to make an informed choice, and the responsibility that goes with it. Personally, I haven't had to see a medical doctor in forty years. Just lucky, I guess.

  
  

[Trust but Verify]

And from something like this list you claim that doctors are the third leading cause of death? How many of these deaths could be attributed to persons other than doctors? How many were on their deathbeds already? How many died from unexpected and unpredictable reactions to treatment?

For someone who hasn't been to a doctor in 40 years, you sure seem to be an expert.

[who knows what evil?]

Right. And perfectly healthy people walk into hospitals where they are maliciously murdered by homicidal doctors who took years off their own lives for that privilege. What a bunch of bull.

Lighten up. No such statement was implied by that post. These are deaths that occurred due to ERROR, not malicious intent. Geez...

[Trust but Verify]

Whose error?

[who knows what evil?]

Don't kill the messenger...your gripe is with JAMA, not me. I am just posting portions of the article. Draw your own conclusions. I made no claims about being an expert on anything. Someone asked for some info; I passed along what I had access to. If that individual poster wishes to dig further, they now have the information necessary to do so.

[Woahhs]

Why does the mere mention of chiropractic make me want to laugh out loud?

Because you've never suffered with a debilitating chronic pain condition for several years which allopaths insist they can treat, but you never got any relief.

Not even lab rats have to pay for the experiments done on them. I've learned you can trust exactly one thing from a degree in allopathic medicine...this person has a good memory.

[TomB]

What webiste did you get this information from? Could you provide a link please?

[Trust but Verify]

The implications in your post is that it's DANGEROUS, that you're taking a chance with your life to go to a doctor. And just to prove how right you are, you haven't seen a doctor in 40 years! That MAY be the only reason YOU'RE not dead, right?

You cite a study, but you cannot cite what is in the study. How the conclusions were reached, or what extenuating circumstances existed. For all we know, if somebody didn't get their tylenol on time and later died, it gets blamed on some doctor.

[Trust but Verify]

Well, I know people with bad backs who should get them fixed but instead throw their money away at chiropractors getting temporary relief but never solving the problem. Instead of being honest with these people and telling them they should get the problem fixed surgically, they just keep taking the patient's money.

[who knows what evil?]

Whose error? I'm sure it could be any number of people involved in the medical profession; not always the doctor. Once again, from JAMA...48,000 people die each year from unnecessary surgeries (from a Johns Hopkins study). In addition, 35 to 45% of DOCTOR's diagnoses were proven INCORRECT when autopsies were done. (I would assume surgeries were being performed by doctors.)

[Petronski]

Why does the mere mention of chiropractic make me want to laugh out loud?

Actually, this was a rhetorical question. The mention of chriropractic makes me laugh because it is a sham that works by coincidence and almost always only for a short while.

[who knows what evil?]

This information is not from a website...it is from the ACTUAL publication. You might check the Journal of the American Medical Association's website to see if they have the articles archived there.