Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: biblewonk
The idea that they can intercede for us is not there.

There is no passage in Scripture which specifically says that Christians enjoying eternal life can intercede for Christians who are living in this world.

Of course, there is no passage in Scripture which says they cannot.

What Scripture does say is as follows:

(1) That the faithful can intercede for others - i.e. offer up prayers on their behalf. cf. Stephen's prayers for his persecutors, Abraham's prayer for Abimelech, etc., etc.

(2) Scripture also says that the saints in heaven offer up prayers to God. cf. Revelation 8.

(3) Scripture also says that the Church is one, cf. John 10 and

(4) that believers make up the body of Christ, cf. 1 Corinthians 12 and

(5) that the sign of Christian unity and identity is mutual love, cf. John 13, and

(6) that nothing can separate us from the love of Christ, cf. Romans 8.

Given this Scriptural evidence, St. Jerome - a cherisher of the Bible if there ever was one - drew the inference that since (a) both the faithful departed and the living faithful are part of the same Church, (b) that they all had the ability to pray for one another in life, (c) that eternal life with Christ does not weaken or diminish the faculties of the faithful departed at all, but strengthens them and that (d) the saints in heaven pray then it makes eminent good sense that the faithful departed can listen and respond to our brotherly requests for intercession.

So Scripture does authorize intercessory prayer. It does assert that the saints pray. It does assert that the Church is one body.

The one piece of the puzzle that is not explicitly there is that the saints can hear us.

Catholics believe that the mutual love in Christ which Christians share with the glorified saints makes this feasible.

Others perhaps believe, with St. Jerome's interlocutor Vigilantius, that the saints in heaven are somehow less capable in their glory rather than more.

Catholics believe that this does not follow the logic of Scripture, which teaches that the glorified state of eternal life is superior in all respects to earthly life.

79 posted on 05/28/2003 1:15:18 PM PDT by wideawake (Support our troops and their Commander-in-Chief)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 78 | View Replies ]


To: wideawake
Of course, there is no passage in Scripture which says they cannot.

And that is precisely how RC's "use" the bible. It's all a matter of "what can we get away with because it is not expressly forbidden".

80 posted on 05/28/2003 1:31:50 PM PDT by biblewonk (Spose to be a Chrissssstian)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies ]

To: wideawake
 
The Bible says that there is ONE intercessor between man and God - Christ Jesus.
 
Why should we pray to a Saint, who will then pray to the Father???
 
 
It ain't biblical or logical.
 
 
 
1 Timothy 2
 1.  I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone--
 2.  for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness.
 3.  This is good, and pleases God our Savior,
 4.  who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
 5.  For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
 6.  who gave himself as a ransom for all men--the testimony given in its proper time.

82 posted on 05/28/2003 2:13:30 PM PDT by Elsie (Don't believe every prophecy you read - ESPECIALLY *** ones)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies ]

To: wideawake
(2) Scripture also says that the saints in heaven offer up prayers to God. cf. Revelation 8.
 
While this is technically true....
Revelation 8
 
 1.  When he opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour.
 2.  And I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and to them were given seven trumpets.
 3.  Another angel, who had a golden censer, came and stood at the altar. He was given much incense to offer, with the prayers of all the saints, on the golden altar before the throne.
 4.  The smoke of the incense, together with the prayers of the saints, went up before God from the angel's hand.
 
No where does it indicate that these are DEAD Saints.  How the 'church' managed to grab a perfectly good word that was used to describe ANY believer and change it to mean some dead person who had done some great things while on Earth is something I don't understand.  Therefore, the confusion we are now seeing in this thread.
 
 
The MORMON's have some screwy theology, but at LEAST they've got the definition of 'saint' right!
 
 
 

 
Revelation 5:8
And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.
 

 


83 posted on 05/28/2003 2:22:49 PM PDT by Elsie (Don't believe every prophecy you read - ESPECIALLY *** ones)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson