Posted on 05/17/2003 8:08:32 AM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection
PatriotPetitions. US has launched a national campaign entreating our President, House of Representatives and Senate to reject legislation renewing the 1994 Clinton-Feinstein-Schumer Gun-Control Act. Please read this brief description of the campaign and let your voice be heard on this matter. Though House Majority Leader Tom DeLay says "The votes in the House are not there" to renew the measure, Feinstein and Schumer just introduced a bill in the Senate to renew the law, and they will press the House for a roll call vote in the upcoming election year. Unfortunately, President Bush has reiterated that he SUPPORTS the gun-ban -- an affront to the Constitutional right of all law abiding citizens to own semi-automatic sporting rifles for lawful purposes. Feinstein and Schumer even applauded President Bush, saying: "We welcome your support and look forward to working with you to gain swift passage of this legislation. With your assistance, we will be able to pass legislation to continue the ban and help make America's streets safer." "Safer"? For whom? Such laws claim, ostensibly, to protect law-abiding citizens. Of course, only law-abiding citizens comply with these restrictions -- and at their own peril. Criminals don't care if the weapon they are using comport with the 23,000 federal, state and local gun restrictions already on the books. The Democrat's "incremental encroachment" on the Second Amendment is a thinly-veiled strategy to achieve their ultimate goal of gun confiscation, as Ms. Feinstein made clear after passage of her 1994 legislation: "If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate...for an outright ban, picking up every one of them, Mr. and Mrs. America, turn them all in, I would have done it!" Please join fellow Patriots on the frontlines in defense of our Constitutional liberties. Link to -- http://patriotpetitions.us/nogunban.
the training circuliar from the fort benning AMU is CORRECT!
i don't currently load anything but 38HBWC & HOT 357mag for my model 27 6", as M2 is cheap from CMP (the GREEK M2 is going to be even less expensive-i've heard about 6 cents/round!!!!), as is Danish from Dan's @ 84 bucks/400rounds on enblocs. (i don't use enough SP to make it worth buying '06 dies;wallyworld sells a Winchester HPBT that is a ballistic near-clone of M2 @2760FPS and loads SLICK in garands, CHEAP!)
i AM going to start loading some lead 90grain SWC for my new MAKs though, on a lee press a friend gave me last week.
Free dixie,sw
What's the Winchester order number [*box number*] of the HPBT/M2 load? It sounds like just the ticket for use in my granddad's old M1903. I've been using target ammunition loaded with 168-grain Match Kings, which shoot near enough to the same point of aim as black-tipped 168-grain M2 AP or M72 172-grain match. But that's not a particularly good choice for use as a hunting load, no better than ball ammo really, though at least legal for use where a SP/HP bullet has to be used, and worked dandy the only time I've shot an elk with one. [headshot] Besides the 20-to-the-box Winchester packing should go nicely with the 5-shot stripper clips in the cartridge belt that goes with the old rifle. 90 in the belt, 5 in the magazine and one up tha spout and I should be all set for a good while, with the leftovers either added to any remaining from the first box used for confirming zero or tried out in a Garand or for fieldtesting bullet performance on Whitetails.
The Greek M2 should be worth a try for paper-punching too- I've used the 175-grain .308 bullets they load in the HXP-headstamped Greek .303 British loads, which not unsurprisingly aren't all that accurate down an Enfield's .311/.312 bore. But they work fine in 7,62 Nato and .30-06 reloads, and a bullet pulled from 7,62x53r Russian, 7,7 Jap or 7,65 Argentine Mauser works just fine in the .303 case, as does the 124-grain bullet of the 7,62x39mm M43 cartridge used in the AK and SKS rifles. You know those Russian 7,62x39mm hollowpoints that don't really expand from an AK's 16-inch barrel? Try some out of the 25-inch barrel of a SMLE or #4 Enfield...or as kinder, gentler loads in a #5 *Jungle Carbine*.
-archy-/-
That's very close but not identical to the loads developed by the Navy match shop at Crane for use with the 155-grain Sierra *Palma Match* bullet in .30-06 for use in originally chambered Garands for use in the Palma Match shot at 1000 yards, though most Navy competitors used model 70s in .300 Winchester. The load was a little hard on the Garand, often requiring replacement of the operating rod after the Camp Perry festivities had concluded, though the rifles were rebuilt every season for the most part anyway.
I can't recall any of the rifles actually failing during competition, though rear and front sights would sometimes shoot loose in practice. But after production of the M72 .30 caliber match ammo was discontinued in 1968, handloaded ammo became the only game in town for the serious Garand match shooters using original caliber rifles, though the Navy match Garands in 7,62 NATO shot the 600-yard NM course quite well and M118 match ammo was available for them. But not on the 1000-yard lines....
And 1974 wasn't so *long ago* for the Columbus College of Footsoldier Knowledge at Benning to those of us who recall the place from 1965.
-archy-/-
SHEESH!
the ARMY TC is hardly an obscure source, as they are printed by the millions & widely distributed in both military & civilian circles.
just because YOU don't know something does NOT mean it is UN-important, false and/or obscure.
you are beginning to look SILLY! quit while you're ahead.
FRee dixie,sw
i throw away the boxes,after i load the enblocs for my garands, so i can't just look on a box at home.
YEP, it's a great,slick-loading,superior load for black bear, deer, aoudad,blackbuck,feral hogs,etc for these >50YO GI rifles. AND it's about the same recoil as M2 as well.
FRee dixie,sw
i'm not anywhere near home, so i can't look at the guide, but the edition is SECOND,printed 02/2003.sorry, can't remember the page number.
BTW, there is a 160 grain CAST BULLET load listed at near 2500FPS, which is near the FMJ load. i wonder how bad the bore is leaded, even with a shot of liquid ALOX & a copper gas check????
MY POINT was that MUCH HOTTER rounds than the standard loads listed in the TC have been USED SUCESSFULLY in the garand by MILITARY shooters for a LONG time, including some "168 grain specialty" (READ: HOT LOADS!)rounds that were issued in the early '60s in RVN to "selected marksmen" & snipers.
BTW, i think 170grains (an occasional 180grain SilverTip may be OK in season! i've DONE that.)is about the SAFE limit for garands, as the newest of these are about 1/2 a century old.
my 220GR & 250GR MAX HANDLOADS for the Model 700BDL-LH in 30.06IMP are kept in a SEPARATE locked container (these rounds look TOO SIMILAR to M2 & commerial clones to do otherwise!) from the stuff that's suitable for GI rifles! i won't tell you what THOSE are loaded to, by my buddy, but the 700 shoots them FINE, with NO SIGNS of pressure/primer problems/headsplits!
think .318 Wesley-Richards Nitro Express POWER/velocity! ELK/MOOSE fall as if pole-axed with any sort of a decent hit with either the Barnes or Nosler Partition; i've NEVER has to trail a wounded one with THAT LOAD!
free dixie,sw
ONCE again, the TCs are NOT obscure;you don't know about them as you are LIKELY too young to have ever seen one and NOT a veteran.end of msg.
FRee dixie,sw
And shooters hot rod the M14 for the Palma Matches to 1000 yards, so what is your point? You tried to claim some numbers that aren't there and I called you on it. If you don't think the army manual is obscure, then I would like to buy one this weekend. I need the complete name and numbers. I should be able to get on the phone and see which of the five gunshops in the area that have it or order it online. As far as the Lee book is concerned I have access to two Second Editions and I'll wait for you to give me the page number.
look, see, LEARN!
Free dixie,sw
unless you are blind as well as hateful, the info is there.
why are you so ANGRY??? your posts DRIP with VENOM.
could it be that you don't like the fact that you seem to have NO credentials as a marksman/veteran, know things only from books AND that i called you on it????
sorry, i';m not buying any.
Free dixie,sw
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