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Surgery use for rare gas
SMH.com.au ^ | May 6 2003

Posted on 05/05/2003 3:33:21 PM PDT by realpatriot

A rare Russian anaesthetic that allows patients to snap awake without any sort of hangover may protect stroke and cardiac patients from brain damage.

The gas, Xenon, was thought to have been used by Russian authorities to end a hostage crisis last October.

(Excerpt) Read more at smh.com.au ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: xenon
Interesting comment regarding the Russians.

And I thought xenon was just for overpriced light bulds.

Maybe a new source for drug abuse? Guard your high priced light bulbs!

1 posted on 05/05/2003 3:33:21 PM PDT by realpatriot
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To: realpatriot
And the bright side is, the surgeons don't need those big, aluminum reflectors over their heads to do the procedure any more!
2 posted on 05/05/2003 3:35:35 PM PDT by strela ("... you're lucky you still have your brown paper bag, small change ...")
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To: realpatriot
Dr Dingley said he had invented a machine which would reduce the cost of using Xenon.

No bias here...

3 posted on 05/05/2003 3:37:52 PM PDT by null and void
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To: realpatriot
Actually the Russians used an air dispersed opiate similar to heroine, morphine. In a lower cieling structure it would have been more effective and contolable. In the vast theater some people got too much and some too little.

Any anesthesia agent is a pretty dicey situation. You are on the edge of an overdose and kept there with close monitoring. I've had seventeen surgeries requiring general anesthesia. It's evolved pharmaceutical wise in the past decade. I've still never dealt with the after nausea well. They've piggy backed phenergan, compazine, and others I'm unaware of and it still leaves me quite sick to my stomach for about 12 hours. With the post op morphine though.....who cares?

4 posted on 05/05/2003 4:06:14 PM PDT by blackdog (Peace, love, and understanding.....$10 bucks a hit in America.)
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To: blackdog
Actually the Russians used an air dispersed opiate similar to heroine, morphine.

It was N-Phenyl-N-(1-2-phenylethyl-4-piperidyl) propanamide also known as Fentanyl.
5 posted on 05/05/2003 4:22:13 PM PDT by SpaceBar
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To: blackdog
Is it comforting to know that the anesthesiologist during your 17 surgeries did not know how anesthetics work?

Not their fault, I understand no one does.

6 posted on 05/05/2003 4:53:21 PM PDT by realpatriot
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To: realpatriot
Xenon is a noble gas, and my intital thought when someone told me the Russians used it for an anaesthetic was 'hogwash'.

However.

I work out with a retired pain-management M.D. He confirmed that both isofluorane and Xenon are anaesthetics. Isofluorane, says my rough chemistry, is a chlorofluorocarbon (like freon). Both 'ought' to act as simple asphyxiants--certainly not as anaesthetics.

I was wrong. He said nobody really understands how either gas 'works'. The current theory is that they form clathrates in the brain which somehow induce unconsciousness. Removing the supply reduces the partial pressure of the agent in the blood; the clathrates dissolve, et voila, the patient, he is awake!

I dunno. I'm just a dumb engineer.

--Boris

7 posted on 05/05/2003 6:24:29 PM PDT by boris (Education is always painful; pain is always educational)
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To: Carry_Okie
ping
8 posted on 05/05/2003 6:27:04 PM PDT by farmfriend ( Isaiah 55:10,11)
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To: realpatriot


The Dread Boston Salty (pictured above) produces a gas that has been known to knock over a cow at a hundred yards.

It is, sadly, not at ALL rare.

(What happened to the 71?)
9 posted on 05/05/2003 6:33:45 PM PDT by Xenalyte (I may not agree with your bumper sticker, but I'll defend to the death your right to stick it)
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To: Xenalyte
LOL! Great picture, too.

Not a rare gas, and not an anaesthetic, either. Please, someone, put me out of my pain.
10 posted on 05/05/2003 6:45:10 PM PDT by Rocky
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To: boris
I dunno. I'm just a dumb engineer.

Me too, boris.

I thought maybe this thread had something to do with exploration for alternative sources of methane based on other recent scientific developments (Powered by panda poop).

I guess I was wrong.

11 posted on 05/05/2003 6:54:39 PM PDT by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
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To: boris
Xenon is a noble gas, and my intital thought when someone told me the Russians used it for an anaesthetic was 'hogwash'.

That was my first thought as well, and my first reaction to seeing this article was to look for the Pravda sourcing. I'm glad I checked back on this thread - I just learned something, not an unusual occurrence on FR.

12 posted on 05/05/2003 7:04:52 PM PDT by CFC__VRWC
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To: realpatriot
I used to be out instantly. Now I can feel anesthesia burning badly when it starts flowing. They had to hold me down for about five seconds before it knocked me out last time. It's like I'm developing a tolerance to what they use.

They don't give you those big-n-juicy valium shots in the butt during pre-op like they used to. Those took away that hyper-alert feel you get during that skin to stainless steel feel in the O.R. Instead you are left full of anxiety, making small talk with a bunch of masked cast members who are waiting for you to pass out so they can tape up a peter bottle on your pecker and go on about their job. I prefer the valium introduction........

13 posted on 05/05/2003 7:11:43 PM PDT by blackdog (Peace, love, and understanding.....$10 bucks a hit in America.)
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To: blackdog
"They don't give you those big-n-juicy valium shots in the butt during pre-op like they used to."

When I go in for my periodic colonoscopies (don't ask), they give me 'kickapoo joy juice' which is mostly Versed. Intravenous. It makes you feel marvelous--cloud 11 or so.

"Hey doc, you wanna stick a TV camera where? Hey, go right ahead, I don't care!"

The interesting thing is that they also have some kind of antagonist for the Versed that drops you back to reality in a couple of heartbeats. "Hey! I was just getting to really enjoying things up there!"

Fortunately it must be administered intravenously and is not available (yet) 'on the street'. Otherwise I'd be an addict!

--Boris

14 posted on 05/06/2003 7:42:06 AM PDT by boris (Education is always painful; pain is always educational)
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To: boris
When I go in for my periodic colonoscopies (don't ask), they give me 'kickapoo joy juice' which is mostly Versed. Intravenous. It makes you feel marvelous--cloud 11 or so.

Versed. Yeah, ha ha ha. I told them not to dose me so heavily for the colonoscopy so I was awake for the whole thing. It was just as you said. I felt a little pressure and could move around as the doctor ordered as he was snaking the colonoscope through but I just didn't care. And at the end when they were retracting it they turned it around so I could have a turd's-eye view of the exit. That was pretty funny.
15 posted on 05/06/2003 7:49:22 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: boris
I got food poisoning really bad in '91. I was hospitalized for weeks. I had one of those damn things done and the part I hated was watching the monitor.

I had several areas of intestine which had died and had to be removed. The camera adventure was done preliminary to abdominal surgery.

The best weight loss program I ever had.

That shot they give you to "relax you"(like that's possible with a camera up your butt), is a real woozy wobbler. I was too sick to enjoy it though. Pain I can take. Nausea I can't.

I never again will dine at buffet's, salad bars, road side stands, gas stations, and other culinary time-bombs.

16 posted on 05/06/2003 8:44:29 AM PDT by blackdog (Peace, love, and understanding.....$10 bucks a hit in America.)
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