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To: SJackson
If this Road Map is a road to hell - - and I'm not taking a position on it -- what IS the answer to the Israeli/Palestinian thing? I hear a lot of carping against Bush for pushing this plan (and it's interesting how he suddenly becomes a villain for folks who were praising him when he was beating Iraq) --- but I NEVER HEAR A SUGGESTED SOLUTION TO THE MIDEAST PROBLEM. If you don't like Bush's roadmap, what's yours?
5 posted on 05/02/2003 11:59:46 AM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: churchillbuff
I beleive that this is indeed the roadmap to hell.

THe Palestinians have a country, it is called Jordon.

I think that the Israelis should take a small chunk for themselves, send the Palestinians to the other part, and give it to Jordan.

THen let Jordan deal with them.

Then Israel will have a little bit more land then they do now, the Palestinians will be part of their TRUE homeland and we can be done with this crap.

The Palestinians are terrorist sympathizers and of coure terrorists themselves.

Giving them their own country is rewarding terrorism, which is unacceptable to me.
6 posted on 05/02/2003 12:10:31 PM PDT by Aric2000 (Are you on Grampa Dave's team? I am!! $5 a month is all it takes, come join!!!)
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To: churchillbuff
What ever the solution is, this will not be it. The Palestinians still have the absolute destruction of Israel in their charter. They have also trained up an entire generation of people, beginning in early childhood, to hate Jews. There is no way that they can simply turn them off.
10 posted on 05/02/2003 12:30:45 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Even if the government took all your earnings, you wouldn’t be, in its eyes, a slave.)
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To: churchillbuff
It's not clear to me this is GWB's plan, in fact the methodology of implementation is in clear opposition to GWB's June, 2001 speech and many of his public statements, including yesterdays:

"Any outlaw regime that has ties to terrorist groups, and seeks or possesses weapons of mass destruction, is a grave danger to the civilized world, and will be confronted," he said, outlining the principles of the US war on terror.

"Any person, organization, or government that supports, protects or harbours terrorists is complicit in the murder of the innocent, and equally guilty of terrorist crimes."

Since Sharon and GWB seem to agree on the establishment of a state. What's missing is acceptance of Israel by the Arab world, which includes an abandonment of the right of return, without which peace is impossible. That’s the untouchable third rail.

Without recognition, we're essentially talking about an agreement between warring parties, actions verified by a trusted party are essential, not just words. That’s what Sharon has asked for, and that’s what GWB has asked for. I suspect over the next few months we'll see a disagreement or two between the State Dept and the White House and either compliance will be demanded of the PA, or we'll simply mosey on down the road to the next war.

BTW, over time not only will a terrorist state in the territories, and that's what the road map is heading toward, not contribute to regional stability, but will vindicate Sadaam and earn him a place as a revered martyr of the palestinian cause.

11 posted on 05/02/2003 12:30:49 PM PDT by SJackson
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To: churchillbuff
Below is a comment I made in response to an earlier Arutz Sheva article which stated:

"Tourism Minister Benny Elon has proposed a new outline for peace in the Middle East, entitled: 'In the Wake of the War in Iraq - A Historic Opportunity for a Regional Solution to the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict.'

"Elon, successor to the assassinated Rehavam Ze'evi as head of the Moledet Party in the National Union, conceived the plan as an alternative to the Road Map currently under consideration. He says that the Road Map is merely a "rehashing of the decades-old goal of trying to seat two peoples on the western side of the Jordan River" - an objective he calls "unworkable" and "dangerous." Giving the Arabs of Yesha a quasi-state will not solve the fundamental problems of borders and refugees, Elon says, but will instead guarantee the next round of terrorism and warfare.

"Elon's plan offers what he calls 'the genuine and original two-state solution,' proposing that it encompass the full extent of Mandatory Palestine on both sides of the Jordan River. ..."

MY COMMENT...

I believe a plan such as this is the only kind that will work

This family feud has been going on for millenia... (see Genesis chapters 12 through 21 regarding Ishmael and Isaac).

Both parties have historically valid claims in their connection to Abraham. Both have rightful claims to long residency in the land. Both were guaranteed a national homeland by recent occupying powers ( British Balfour Declaration of 1917). Both claim the same holy religious site (al Aqsa Mosque sits on the location of Israel's Holy Temple site - above the "wailing wall").

The problem is and always has been the desperate nature of the struggle each side perceives.

From the Crusades, to the pogroms of Eastern Europe to Hitler's final solution, the Jewish people have been in a struggle to preserve the existence of their race/people. The pan-Arab peoples of the region, through agencies such as the PLO and similar organizations have vowed "to drive the Jews into the sea." Despite later repudiation the obvious passion of that oath continues.

Israel's former Prime Minister Golda Meir revealed the power of their determination, "We Jews have a secret weapon in our struggle with the Arabs - we have no place to go."

Regarding Palestinian claims, since the conquest of the Muslim Caliph Omar in 638 a.d. Arab groups have lived on the land. This has been their home. A familiar sense of the Palestinian claim might be found in our American Indians. However, for the Palestinians it wasn't 350 years ago that their land was invaded (as when people began displacing American Indians) ...it was only 60 years ago!

The UN attempt to bring about a solution in 1947 was, as with most things stamped "UN," unrealistic, ineffective, and without moral capital. However fair the division may appear on a map (UN's patchwork division of Israel), the animosity of blood feud has proven too powerful. Mix oxygen and fire and it consumes everything in proximity.

This is why I believe Elon's plan is the only, even remotely, managable solution. Put the brothers on either side of the Jordan river...if you cross it, you are a legitimate target. Now, let's talk peace.

(Not mentioned is the sticky solution to Jerusalem. I suggest a massive engineering challenge: relocate the al Aqsa Mosque since it is both more recent and right where the Jews would likely rebuild their temple. Move the Mosque, Dome of the Rock and all, surrounding dirt and all, and rebuild it on the other side of the river.)

12 posted on 05/02/2003 12:32:35 PM PDT by kritikos (Truly true truth)
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