Officer exonerated in theater gun incident

WTNH ^ | 4/17/2003 | AP

[always vigilant]

(Hartford-AP Apr. 17, 2003 11:35 AM)_ An off-duty state Capitol police officer has been exonerated in a gun incident at the Bushnell Center.

An investigation began in February after Officer Paul Warren's personal gun went off accidentally inside the crowded theater.

The incident occurred during intermission of "The Tale of the Allergist's Wife" starring Valerie Harper.

The gun, a .380-caliber Browning automatic handgun was in his shoulder holster when it went off as he and his wife were returning to their seats at the end of intermission.

Both Hartford police and state Capitol police could not determine why the gun went off and found no negligence on Warren's part.

They also determined he did not violate any laws or department policy.

[MineralMan]

"Are you so adept at cycling your weapon during the draw that your hand will never slip or otherwise have any hint of fumbling, even under a stress condition?"

Hasn't happened yet. I've never had to draw my pistol in any stress situation, so I couldn't say about that. I don't carry on the street, in any case, so it's unlikely to come up. I only carry at my place of business.

[TC Rider]

Would you rather be in close proximity of gun that gets dropped with a chambered shell, or an empty chamber? An automatic pistol with an unchambered shell is safe, it is a club. It takes only a moment to chamber. You certainly wouldn't champion carrying a shotgun around with a chambered shell while driving, would you? It's illegal in the states I've lived in. I can't see the logic in making pistols the exception, as the range of a pistol's lethality is far greater than a shotguns.

Most new pistols on the market today have survived being tumbled in a cement mixer without going off. If you pack an old Single Action Army revolver, (or a mid century Ruger Blackhawk), it will likely go off when dropped, with the hammer down.

Most modern revolvers now have a transfer bar to prevent that.

You are welcome to carry your weapon any way you like. Why not completely empty with the magazine out. It'll only take another 'moment' to top it off.

I'm unwilling to give a potential assailant another 'moment' to pop me while I'm stroking a slide.

What if your assailant gets in the first shot and nails your strong arm? Are prepared to rack your slide with one hand?

The cop screwed up, big time. You may wish to update your tactical skills.

[Djarum]

If the suspect had to arm the pistol, there is at least a 50% chance that 1 of the 3 wounded officers could have shot him.

How are the officers supposed to fire on him when they have to chamber a round first? He'd be shooting while they are occupied with their weapons.

There is not always a moment to spare when lethal force is needed. Sometimes assaults occur without warning, and in that moment, each second is critical.

[Blue Jays]

Good Evening All-

"Why, I wish Major Rathbone had brought a loaded sidearm to the theater."

~ President Abraham Lincoln ~

[Mulder]

However, we all know that an armed gun will occassionally discharge when dropped, bumped or when going about life (like in a theater).

Would you explain *how* this happens in a modern firearm?

BTW, you may want to reconsider your use of the word *we* in your asertion, since I don't know a SINGLE person familiar with modern firearms who would agree with that statement.

Therefore, I cannot make an arguement to always carry a pistol with round chambered. It's an accident just waiting to happen.

I'm not aware of ANY CCW instructor, firearms expert, state or federal weapons expert who would agree with that. Granted, there may be a few out there, but 99% of the folks who have studied the matter as their life's work, disagree.

[Blue Jays]

Good Evening All-

The fact-of-the-matter is that many fine people employed in law enforcement (while great at the job) are not "into" their firearms. It is a tool that the officer brings to work, much like a salesperson may utilize a laptop computer for work. The salesperson may not be able to reinstall the operating system on their machine in much the same way that the law enforcement officer doesn't intimately understand the operations of his or her sidearm.

Statistically, I would have to believe the hardcore pro-RKBA population and hardcore pro-RKBA law enforcement personnnel are very unlikely to have a negligent/accidental discharge either on-duty or in their personal lives.

~ Blue Jays ~

[Hodar]

Would you explain *how* this happens in a modern firearm?

Define 'modern firearm'. Pistols usually do not wear out. A great number of the pistols I own, or have fired are easily over 20 years old. These do not have the same safety features you will find in a brand new pistol (depending, of course upon the make/model we are talking about). As a large number of pistol owners do not go through a box of shells every month, and the pistols are cleaned and stored in a dry, safe place these pistols last for decades.

But more to the point, I do not trust a safety mechanism to be my primary accident deterrant, any more than using my seatbelt in place of defensive driving. I have seen a pistol dropped, and discharge (lucky in a direction that didn't hit the owner, his family or me). On another occassion, the owner dropped his pistol while crossing a fence, and the pistol's trigger caught a branch as it fell. The gun discharged into the ground, about a foot from owners boot. This is usually followed by humiliation, horror and a re-installment of respect for a weapon with only one true purpose.

If you insist in keeping your weapon armed full time, and wish to place the safety of your loved ones, and other people around you soley upon the safety mechanism of your pistol; I wish you well. I think it is foolish, and hopefully you never regret your decision. Because, IF something ever did happen, you will no doubt remember arguing this point with me. With my proceedure, a dropped pistol will mean nothing more than an unwanted scratch on a prized possession.

Again, it only takes a moment to arm an auto, and I have never heard of a 'quick-draw' event in which a pistol is drawn and fired without time to arm it. I think those who suppose this situation would occur are deluding themselves. Cops pulling over a stolen car, know the car is stolen, and prepare themselves when approaching it. But, sitting in a theater with a cocked and chambered pistol?

[YoungKentuckyConservative]

Maybe a little thing like safety. Nothing like blowing your wife's brains out to remind you that guns are dangerous. Or maybe you will luck out and only shoot yourself. If one would bother to think before spouting, would you rather simply pull your gun out and shoot a potential target; or give him the opportunity to reappraise his situation by showing the gun, and then chambering a shell? The time difference between chambering an auto, and drawing one is neglible.

Your argument makes little sense to me. If you aren't prepared to defeat a threat as quickly as possible, don't bother carrying a gun at all. And if you are concerned about your ability to restrain yourself and/or accidentally blow your wife's brains out, do everyone a favor and don't EVER carry a weapon. I just don't follow your logic. An gun that is not prepared to be fired, as soon as it is drawn, is a waste. I specifically carry a Keltec P-32 because the trigger is so heavy to pull. There is no way I could accidentally fire a chambered round. It takes 6 pounds of pressure to do so.

[Hodar]

If you aren't prepared to defeat a threat as quickly as possible, don't bother carrying a gun at all.

Have you ever, or could you imagine a case where you will need to 'quick draw'? Do you wonder if your judgement in this kind of situation would be a wise judgement? I wonder how many people currently in jail for manslaughter simply pulled a gun and fired, before thinking their way though the consequences of their actions.

If nothing else, spending the time to chamber a round, will provide a moment of 'clarity' that things are going to become intense. There are more than one case of a spouse over-reacting and shooting a 'burglar', only to find that they shot their son, daughter, wife or pet. NOTHING sounds like an action jaming a round into a chamber. And the realization that the gun is armed provides both the shooter and potential target with a moment of 'clarity'.

And if you are concerned about your ability to restrain yourself and/or accidentally blow your wife's brains out, do everyone a favor and don't EVER carry a weapon.

And if you would read the complete post, you would see that I'm referring to accidental discharges, as demonstrated by a 'trained expert' in the field, with years experience, that by pure blind luck did not blow someone's brains out. I have no problem constaining myself, and am somewhat offended by your accusation. If anything, I am erroring on the side of safety. Your logic follows that by keeping a constantly armed weapon at your side, you are somewhat safer. Then, a hunter who is driving with a chambered round must be a better hunter, even though travelling with a weapon in that condition is illegal in every state I have lived in. I'm certain they have safety's on shotguns too.

[Hodar]

Not all modern guns are created equal. So, does a live round in the chamber apply to all modern guns, or only a list of certain modern guns. My rules apply to ALL guns.

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