As I Predicted, George W. Bush Is Backing Bill Clinton's Gun Ban

Toogood Reports ^ | April 15, 2003 | By Chuck Baldwin

[wardaddy]

Read Madison's many letters and written comments on the second amendment.

You absolutely must.

[Mulder]

And just when did the BEDROCK of our God-given rights become a "peripheral" issue? When did self defense and defense of freedom get put on the back burner? You are looney-tunes!

Very well stated.

You summed it up better than I could have.

[ApesForEvolution]

Anyone who starts with "I know a lot..." usually, as in your case, doesn't know squat.

[Mini-14]

"And why shouldn't I be allowed to defend myself and my family if and when JBTs or foreign invaders hit my doorstep? Kazillions of pounds of dope make it into America, but those with no regard for life or law don't get full-autos? Either a man is responsible with a firearm or his is not."

I agree with you -- you must have me confused with one of the gun grabbers.

[diamond6]

You're talking about one liberal legislature - not the whole nation.

[Ford Fairlane]

The sunset date is (i believe) sept. 2004

That means the primaries will already be over, and we will be stuck with our candidates.

I predict it wont even be voted on until after the primaries, and we wont like the result when they do hold the vote, because the republicans will say "gunowners will never vote for democrats"

[B Knotts]

Heh...no kidding. I mean...the intent of the Founding Fathers is quite clear to anyone willing to read what they wrote:

"A militia when properly formed are in fact the people themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms...To preserve liberty it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms..."

-Richard Henry Lee, Additional Letters From the Federal Farmer 53, 1788

"The Constitution of the United States shall never be construed to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms."

-Samuel Adams, During the Massachusetts U.S. Constitution ratification convention, 1788

"I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people...To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."

-George Mason, during Virginia's ratification convention, 1788

"The right of the people to keep and bear ... arms shall not be infringed. A well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the best and most natural defense of a free country ...."

- James Madison, I Annuals of Congress 434 (June 8, 1789)

[ez]

Do you really think it'll be allowed to sunset? Talk about a media shitstorm if it looks plausible.

And a shitstorm in the middle of a Presidential race is better? 90 percent of all House seats are safe. Let the House kill this bill and Tom Delay take the heat, who doesn't have a worry about losing in 2004 for supporting the 2A.

It's the smart thing to do.

[OOPisforLiberals]

Oh, so its not a fantabulous precedent for other states? Think California, Massachusets, NY, NJ are far behind once this happens? What about when they bust out "well, we banned shotguns and AW's - and GUESS WHAT - handguns kill more than 5x as many people as them. Its only logical that we ban them too". :/

Seriously - if you can't see the 'slippery slope' here, you're bonkers.

[Deb]

Every single time one of these stories comes over the wire the usual group shows up, runs around screaming and vows to vote for their goldfish over Bush. It almost never turns out to be the truth, and I say "almost" even though I can't think of a single time these fainting goats have been right.

I can tell by the title that this is another phony scare thread. Anyone who really cared about the issue would want to change the president's mind, not smear him by tying him to Clinton. That's classic Demorcat dirty trickery.

[ApesForEvolution]

Sorry, my blood boiled over into my reserve tank and I read you wrong. Can't promise it won't happen again. Thank God I gave up booze. The Constitution was written for a remedial level of literacy, and yet far too many on this thread are either too stupid or intellectually dishonest (if not outright communist gun-grabbers) to understand "Shall not infringe...".

[Cultural Jihad]

"You are looney-tunes!"

[ez]

. That is where the right to bear arms came from. I also had a year course in Constitutional Law in law school from a conservative professor.

Your "conservative" professor misled you.

[wardaddy]

Your views on the second amendment as a state-run militia/the national guard then imply by default that the amendment in question reflects a "right of the government and not the people"

Have you really thought that out?

[Mulder]

Talk about a media shitstorm if it looks plausible.

So? Let them make a big deal out of it. Bush won at least two states (West Virginia and Tennessee) primarily because of the gun issue. In 1994, several senior democrats lost their House seats solely on the gun issue.

Having the leftist media make a big deal would be a blessing in disguise for Bush. Especially when you consider that every minute the media spends on "assualt weapons" is one less minute they'll have to spend on massive budget deficits, a sour economy and huge increases in the federal gov't.

[diamond6]

The people of the United States do, indeed have unlimited rights.

Then why do we have laws?

[PuNcH]

Clinton won by surfing the middle. Perhaps you helped his cause by voting for Perot. Clinton won again despite his tax increases and support of gun control.

Clinton won because of "read my lips" and a 1989 gun ban by Bush from out of the blue. I'll leave those as the strongest reasons why Bush lost support from conservatives.

Clinton downplayed his liberal side including gun control and ran as a moderate.

[ApesForEvolution]

You have a 'loon' infatuation. Seek counseling. However, when prepared right, loons taste an awful lot like bald eagle.

[Dan from Michigan]

Most importantly, I can read ENGLISH and understand that you don't need to know legalize to understand this. The Founders intended it that way.

I also have read the fed papers(29 and 46 in particular) and anti-fed papers. I also read US CODE on this issue. I took a course on the Federalist Papers from a conservative prof. I've read several law reviews on the subject from people ranging to your gun grabbing buddy Andrew Herz to David Kopel to Don Kates to Joyce Malcolm, not to mention court cases.

1. The National Guard is not THE militia. It's one aspect of it. That is by US Code as well as the constitution.
2. The Militia is the common citizenry. I don't mean the so called "Michigan Militia". I mean the common folk.
3. "Right of the People" means the same in the first as it does the 2nd amendment. Supreme Court backs me up there.

[Deb]

You still didn't defend your statement that he was "soft on guns". How is he soft?