How to Hate the French: A User's Guide: Michael Lewis

Bloomberg ^ | April 9, 2003 | Michael Lewis

[WaveThatFlag]

Berkeley, California, April 9 (Bloomberg) -- It's astonishing how much easier it has become in America in just the last few weeks to hate the French, even for those who shouldn't.

A random sampling of three friends who disapprove of the war in Iraq and enjoy a good Burgundy reveals that all of them are inclined more than ever to detest our former ally. Trouble is, they don't know how to do it.

[Stay the course]

The French are wittier than us.

That would explain their reverence for Jerry Lewis. (Not!)

[hawkaw]

You hate all French Canadians???

I am an English Canadian. Sure there are really mean people who take their independence to the absolute insane level. But you know what? I have met some in the southern USA who still take their independence to an absolute insane level too. So why "strawman" an entire population?

Point is that the hatred expressed on this board lately is not right. If you are telling me that you live in the United States of America and boast about it allowing people to freely take a position against a government without having to worry about reprisals, then why oh why are some United States people on this board slaming those people who took pro war stances in countries whose governments who did not "officially" support the war and those people who excersized their free rights to not support the war.

Its not right if you are country that is practicing and boasting about "freedom".

hawk

[dark_lord]

If you are telling me that you live in the United States of America and boast about it allowing people to freely take a position against a government without having to worry about reprisals... You didn't address this point to me, but -- the 1st amendment doesn't mean that if you express your opinion that you are free from reprisals. It means the government is not permitted to take reprisals against you. However, the citizenry may freely choose to (a) not buy stuff from you, (b) mock you, (c) despise you, and (d) choose not to associate with you.

Those are their rights also as identified by the 9th amendment -- The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

[Doug Loss]

The problem with Canada just now is that it appears to be (perhaps) irretrievably broken as a country. I don't think there's much chance of a federal gov't there that would satisfy the westerners, the Liberal belt in Ontario, and the Quebecois. I won't be surprised if the Dominion dissolved in the next 10 years.

As for the French, we should ignore them almost completely, just noticing them enough to laugh derisively at the occassionally.

[WaveThatFlag]

Hawk, I think you need to lighten up a little.

[stumpy]

The true way to wound a frenchman's pride is to ask him how long it took for his mother's hair to grow back at the end of WWII.

[ohioman]

Everyone I know HATES the French (myself included)and I doubt anything will change that anytime soon.

I'd like to see somedody makes us like the French. Left alone, us real Americans are a nice bunch. But, if you side against us, we have a long memory. And as far as your slam against Southerners, please remember that per capita, they are the only "truly" over-represented group in the armed services. In fact, during war is the only time the media considers nationalistic and overtly patriotic Southerners as Politically Correct. Even our liberal dishrag here in Dayton admits to that.

[flashbunny]

Agreed. France just doesn't matter anymore.

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

that is everyone has the right to chose and voice his or her opinion without the fear of reprisals.

Excuse me, what are you trying to talk about? I understand your Canadian and probably never read the Constitution, but the 1st Amendment prevents CONGRESS from preventing Free Speech. This reprisals nonsense is Judicial Activism at best, purposeful misrepresentation at worst. The 1st Amendment actively protects our right to critisize governments and foreign people. The only hypocracy there is foreigners trying to use said Amendment to guilt us into silence.

You guys are practicing hatred against ALL people from a countries who didn't do anything to you guys. Some of these people (like me) even supported the war effort and hated our government's stance.

You want a cookie? Seriously, I'm pleased you saw the logic in going to war despite the CBC and BBC's best efforts to brainwash you, but that does not excuse the duplicitous actions of your ELECTED government. In fact, in a democracy there is more responsiblity of the leaders actions by the people than less.

In my mind what you some of you people are doing is not right and needs to stop if you truly believe in what American "freedom" is all about.

Diagram this sentence... It is you who do not understand what Freedom is all about. In America we have the right to not only criticize our government, but YOUR'S and your people TOO if we deem it desirable. I notice a logical arguement made against the French here, not hate. I realize you are smarting because you think Americans are turning on all countries, including your's, that tried to stop us from protecting ourselves. Do I hate the Germans? Only the Left. Do I hate the Russians? No, I don't trust them. Canadians? Only the Left. I hate America's Left too, it isn't nationalism, its a lack of respect for your voters ability to restrain these radicals if nothing else. You must comprehend that France is a very seperate animal in this, its not left or right issue. Finally America has woken up to their De Gaulist active desire to damage America and her citizens by any means necessary. They are a threat, we are dealing with it.

Vive le French Boycott!

[tuna_battle_slight_return]

"He wanted importance, or its illusion, and the way to create the illusion of importance was to oppose the war."

More and more these French "leaders" are reminding me of other "leaders" who oppress their own people (I'm not naming any names). However, thanks to De Villepin and Chirac, the French economy is going to end up on life support, at best. And these two "leaders" did this to their own people. Even if 1/3 did support Hussein's regime, the other 2/3 who didn't will suffer as well (again, thanks to the French gov't opposition).

[hawkaw]

You seem to be missing my point.

Criticizing is one thing and believe me, you and I have that right. Boycotting is no problem too.

But what is going on here on this board in some cases by some posters (maybe not you) is outright "hate" and discrimination of entire populations. I don't like it and its not what your country is about.

Its just like what happened with the PeeWee hockey team up here. That was hate and it wasn't right. As far as I and an overwhelming majority of Canadians believe the people who did it near Montreal should be thrown in jail.

And its just like my 15 friends who have gone over to Watertown, New York in the past three weeks who have had their cars vandalized, been spit at and threatened. Again its not right to practice this type of hate on both sides of the border and I would assume that most Americans would agree.

hawk

[Right Wing Professor]

What you are doing here was practiced in Iraq and what the United States has tried to stop over and over again - that is everyone has the right to chose and voice his or her opinion without the fear of reprisals.

Nonsense.

The first amendment reads 'Congress shall make no law...". In other words, it protects citizens from government reprisals for non-criminal speech. On the other hand I, as a free citizen, have every right to privately retaliate against you if I don't like what you say or even how you say it.

[PeoplesRep_of_LA]

Yes I would agree that that spiting and vandalism is uncalled for. A larger publicity needs to be made of the pro American rallies being made in Canada. (I only hear about it from FR) That will ease this feeling of a northern "Enemy" since our exposure is the Liberal MPs calling us bastards and Cretien doing the long list of things we don't need to get into. The Montreal thing with the kids and the anthem booing got play here, that's what is happening to your friends cars. I don't think its in any way related to the French hate (which is real in many areas, the other countries its just reactionary). It may not seem fair since they were against the Montreal actions, but the best thing your 15 friends can do is organize politically and unite the conservatives up there to stop the Liberal party from winning in their divide and conquer method.

[Right Wing Professor]

And its just like my 15 friends who have gone over to Watertown, New York in the past three weeks who have had their cars vandalized, been spit at and threatened.

These are criminal acts and should be prosecuted. On the other hand, I hope you don't expect to visit the US and not hear vigorous criticism of your government and perhaps the behavior of your compatriots.

[bfree]

In my mind what you some of you people are doing is not right and needs to stop if you truly believe in what American "freedom" is all about

Maybe this will clear up any misperception of my thinking--F**K FRANCE AND THE FRENCH. Hopefully, that is clear to you. Just exercising my right to free speech.

[hawkaw]

Dr. Right Wing,

Please read my other posts. I am not talking about criticizing and boycotting. I fully support it.

What I am talking about is the "hate" and discrimination being displayed on this db against entire populations by certain posters. That's not right and is not what your country or mine stands for.

hawk

[hawkaw]

US and not hear vigorous criticism of your government and perhaps the behavior of your compatriots.

I fully support that and if you don't want to serve me gas to make a point - yeah that is fine too.

But practicing "hate" such as was written above (F**K France and the French) that isn't cool.

hawk

[longtermmemmory]

Defund french language education in high schools and colleges. If you want to learn french there are always those six week private courses.

Hurt the french? eliminate the french language.

[Right Wing Professor]

But practicing "hate" such as was written above (F**K France and the French) that isn't cool.

This is where our two countries differ. In the US, it's entirely legal to write' F- France and the French'. The concept of 'hate speech' has no legal basis. In Canada, hate speech can be proscribed; in fact some energetic compatriots of yours have successfully prosecuted your fellow citizens for quoting certain verses from the Bible said to malign gays. In the US, if bfree says 'F- France and the French', you can deplore the sweeping nature of his statement, you can condemn his crudity, but you can't shut him up. Thank God.

And by the way, a pox on France and the French.

[WaveThatFlag]

What about Palestinians. I'm sure on a case-by-case basis there are some delightful Palestinians. But as a rule, I hate Palestinians. Does that make me unAmerican?