***Operation Iraqi Freedom - Situation Room - Day 26

To: Air Force Born

1,141 posted on 04/14/2003 8:30:16 PM PDT by amom

Two U.S Soldiers Die In Baghdad Grenade Accident

It happened earlier today; the report is timed at 2:07 p.m. ET; but I'm at work all day, and wasn't online much, and I haven't heard about this on the news, just through FR a little bit ago.

1,142 posted on 04/14/2003 8:31:00 PM PDT by nicmarlo

To: StayAt HomeMother

"Others?" Wankers?

1,143 posted on 04/14/2003 8:33:10 PM PDT by sheikdetailfeather

need to get some sleep; good night all. Prayers that our military stays safe.

1,144 posted on 04/14/2003 8:33:45 PM PDT by nicmarlo

1,145 posted on 04/14/2003 8:34:35 PM PDT by najida (Yes I have a truck, and no I won't help you move.)

1,146 posted on 04/14/2003 8:35:07 PM PDT by amom

To: sheikdetailfeather

Covered in 1117 and 1118.

1,147 posted on 04/14/2003 8:36:28 PM PDT by Consort (Use only un-hyphenated words when posting.)

To: nicmarlo; All

Just checking in.

I have been wondering what was going on underground in Baghdad so I found this article. Anyone got anything interesting? This, it seems to me, would be a very likely place to find some of the things we are looking for.

Troops work to infiltrate a Baghdad underground

Tunnels probed for weapons, escape routes

Sunday, April 13, 2003

BY KEVIN COUGHLIN
Star-Ledger Staff

As American soldiers and Marines fought their way through Baghdad while a worldwide television audience watched last week, comrades waged an unseen war of hide-and-seek in the bowels of the city.

Probing for Saddam Hussein, his Republican Guards and their alleged stockpiles of deadly weapons, U.S. forces hoped to unravel the enduring mystery of just what's buried below Baghdad. Analysts expect they will find an incredible labyrinth of tunnels, perhaps linking palaces and bunkers.

"For the type of regime we're dealing with, the tunnels represent an ideal spot to conceal weapons and serve as a hide-out and in some cases an escape route," said Lt. Mark Kitchens, a spokesman for U.S. Central Command.

One tunnel coughed up an Iraqi colonel, who was directing artillery fire from his lair.

At the airport, soldiers from the 101st Airborne Division descended into a cave with 12 rooms, white marble floors and fluorescent lights. They found some tea bags and cigarette butts, but no Iraqis. Through a "staff only" doorway under the baggage claim area, another search team found empty tunnels in all directions.

Just how far they go is anyone's guess.

"They've got enormous miles and miles of underground tunneling," said U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld in December, arguing against further United Nations weapons inspections. U.N. inspectors suspected a vast network tunnel but never proved it.

From cosmic rays to infrared sensors, scientists have struggled to ferret out the tunnels, a favorite tool of American adversaries from the Viet Cong to the North Koreans to Osama bin Laden.

"We don't have the technology to find these tunnels, let alone examine them," said Richard A. Muller, a physicist at the University of California at Berkeley.

"We depend completely on people telling us, on human intelligence. It's the only way to find out."

Iraq's former top nuclear scientist claims Saddam ordered his military to convert plans for a Baghdad subway into more than 60 miles of tunnels for secreting weapons of mass destruction.

"We can hide them, we can move them around," he said, according to Hussein Shahristani in an interview on "60 Minutes" in February.

At least one of the tunnels may be hardened against nuclear attack, said the scientist, who was jailed and tortured for refusing Saddam's order for an atomic bomb. Shahristani's knowledge of the tunnels was not first-hand, however.

A California firm, the Parsons Corp. of Pasadena, was involved in Iraq's subway project in the early 1980s. U.S. officials reportedly grabbed the company's blueprints during the 1991 Persian Gulf War.

A man claiming to be a former Saddam bodyguard contends weapons of mass destruction lurk below Baghdad, and in sand-dune bunkers at Ouja, near Saddam's hometown of Tikrit.

"Saddam built an entire area under (Baghdad's) main streets, and that's where the weapons are," Jassem Abdullah -- the name is an alias -- told Debka.com, an Israeli Web site devoted to military matters.

Muller said infrared equipment sometimes can spot tunnels by the heat they emit. Gravimeters sift clues by comparing differences in gravitational fields at varying depths. Ground-penetrating radar actually led inspectors to some missile parts smuggled into Iraq.

But such measures work much better in the desert than in cluttered cities, said Muller.

"We don't know much about them at all," retired Army Gen. John Reppert said of Iraq's tunnels. "But we are working with the locals, people who run the sewers and tunnels, and they are being very helpful. We will know a lot more."

Reppert doubts Saddam stashed his banned weapons beneath Baghdad; tunnels pose too many security headaches. But that won't stop coalition forces from searching. It's not a coveted assignment.

"Most people aren't comfortable in tunnels, and not just people with claustrophobia," said Reppert, now at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government.

"It's very disorienting ... you can't even tell what's up or down," Bill Manofsky of the Navy's Tunnel Warfare Center told a military publication.

Tunnels might serve as an equalizer for technically inferior Iraqi troops, Reppert said. The coalition's night-vision equipment won't work in total darkness. Most radars are useless underground; so is global positioning system technology for pinpointing locations.

"You can't call in air or artillery support. If you're shot at, you have to shoot back at them with your individual weapons," Reppert said.

Robotic devices may be helpful for peering around corners. Other gear amplifies faint sounds. "Shock and flash" grenades temporarily blind anyone creeping in the shadows. Tear gas is an option for soldiers with gas masks.

U.S. forces also have superior systems for communicating underground, Reppert said.

Since Sept. 11 and the Afghanistan campaign, he added, U.S. forces are better prepared for urban combat. "We will use some of those same techniques" in Baghdad, Reppert said.

http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/index.ssf?/base/news-8/1050215010157930.xml

1,148 posted on 04/14/2003 8:37:26 PM PDT by TheLion

Debka has been reporting for several days that there has been an intense, ongoing battle between US and Iraqi forces in those undeground tunnels. Who knows if it is true or not.

1,149 posted on 04/14/2003 8:40:40 PM PDT by overtaxed_canadian

My quick calculation indicates the total number of posts for "Operation Iraqi Freedom - Situation Room - LIVE THREADS" from Day One to now is a little over 97,250. We can't quit now - we must give Poser a chance to hit 100,000.

1,150 posted on 04/14/2003 8:41:18 PM PDT by StayAt HomeMother

To: overtaxed_canadian

It will take some time to find and explore the entire underground network. Who knows what's in them ready to be detonated or unleashed in some kind of doomsday scenario.

1,151 posted on 04/14/2003 8:43:51 PM PDT by Consort (Use only un-hyphenated words when posting.)

To: overtaxed_canadian

I was just reading this one.

Troops work to infiltrate a Baghdad underground

http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/index.ssf?/base/news-8/1050215010157930.xml

1,152 posted on 04/14/2003 8:46:24 PM PDT by TheLion

To: StayAt HomeMother

Well, I have to say goodnight, G.W.B needs more of my money and I have to figure out how much more tomorrow. G'night all. Bless the name of our Lord. He has wrought mighty works.

1,153 posted on 04/14/2003 8:46:36 PM PDT by Air Force Born

To: StayAt HomeMother

1,154 posted on 04/14/2003 8:47:16 PM PDT by Lauratealeaf (Iraqis say, Good, Very Good, Bush Good!)

To: Lauratealeaf

That is why it is unforgiveable for Eagleberger to say what he did.

I agree. I missed seeing him tonight to hear it with my own ears, but have read the freeper accounts and I agree. One does not toss that word around like that.

And I'd like to know just what George W. Bush has done to indicate he would ever do something outside the bounds of honorable and ethical conduct. After what we've all been through he still hasn't earned the trust of some, so they feel the need to issue warnings. Fine, but this one crosses the line.

And I do not have blind faith in a president or man, but there is nothing to support the notion that this "warning" or "advice" needed issuing in the first place.

Ah, Rick Levanthal talking about plenty of chow. Do we all remember the MRE supply crisis??!! (that wasn't a crisis!)

1,155 posted on 04/14/2003 8:47:58 PM PDT by cyncooper (thousands of cheering Iraqis yelled, "America, America, America," and "Bush, Bush, Bush.")

I agree. Eagleburger needs a slap on the hand at least.

And I love to see Rick Levanthal mixing it up with the troops.

1,156 posted on 04/14/2003 8:51:32 PM PDT by Lauratealeaf (Iraqis say, Good, Very Good, Bush Good!)

I think as long as our embedded reporters like Levanthal and Dr. Bob are reporting from Iraq we should keep the thread going. That would give a place to post their reports from the field. It won't be the long thread in the thousands, and if it dwindles to nothing on its own, fine. But I say give it a few days to see if it becomes a clearing house of sorts for the aftermath.

When I look at the calendar it is something to remember that the pool for when the war would begin had several guesses of it starting after today's date! And here the combat phase has been completed.

1,157 posted on 04/14/2003 8:53:19 PM PDT by cyncooper (thousands of cheering Iraqis yelled, "America, America, America," and "Bush, Bush, Bush.")

To: StayAt HomeMother

I agree, keep the "Situation Room" live threads going. I would have missed some very important doings had I not had a heads up on these threads regarding breaking news. And I loved our comments as we heard people on the Baghcams talking as if nobody could hear them (or see them, in some cases).

I'm not always able to get to a computer connection, so I missed a lot, but I'll not soon forget when the troops took the palace in Baghdad, for example, one of many moments which was monumental as it was happening. And Baghdad Bob, Pretty Chicken, and all the supporting cast.

Just thinking about being able to converse with people from my home while watching and hearing a street scene on the other side of the world is humbling. Imagine having been able to view WWII like this...there's a thousand books waiting to be written here.

1,158 posted on 04/14/2003 8:56:05 PM PDT by Mjaye

I am both deeply saddened and disappointed that our situation room willl soon close,,the War is over. It will be sad. We need a memorial service and closure and a group hug!

I'm open to sugestions...

{{{{{cajungirl}}}}}

1,159 posted on 04/14/2003 8:56:12 PM PDT by null and void

I learned so much here...I will miss everyone.

I'm never more than a FReepmail away. Or you can visit the current FReeoples thread, it's a bit like this without the war theme...

1,160 posted on 04/14/2003 8:57:50 PM PDT by null and void

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Operation Iraqi Freedom

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