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Jewish lawmakers threaten walk-out over reference to Jesus
WorldNetDaily.com ^ | April 3, 2003 | Diana Lynne

Posted on 04/03/2003 6:25:58 PM PST by honway

A Maryland minister was barred from giving the opening prayer in the state Senate after he refused to drop a reference to Jesus.

The Rev. David N. Hughes of the Trinity and Evangelical Church of Adamstown, Md., intended to round out his invocation yesterday with the line, "In Jesus' name, Amen." But the sergeant at arms – on the orders of Senate President Thomas Mike Miller Jr. – shut the reverend out of the body's chambers.

Miller issued the orders after two Jewish lawmakers threatened to stage a boycott of the legislative session if the phrase was not removed.

"I'm shocked by the response. I've never had this happen in 26 years," Hughes told the Frederick News-Post. "It just makes me feel that they've taken away my right as an American to pray, and this is the seat of government, and that's scary."

The pastor – a Vietnam veteran – was invited to give the prayer by Republican Sen. Alex Mooney. Hughes was Mooney's fourth guest. The other three were Jewish rabbis.

Opening up legislative sessions with prayer is a longstanding tradition in Maryland, as it is in states across the country. Mooney told WorldNetDaily no one had been barred from giving an invocation before. He sees irony in yesterday's "censorship."

Maryland state Republican Rep. Alex Mooney

"We were the first state to address religious tolerance in our state charter," he told WorldNetDaily. "This just shows a lack of tolerance for peoples' religious views."

Mooney recalled numerous instances of invocations referencing Jesus throughout the four years that he has been in office.

But at the beginning of the session this year, a string of invocations by Baptist preachers invoking the name Jesus Christ sparked debate on the issue. Miller appealed to lawmakers for tolerance and urged they stick to guidelines that call for invocations to be of an ecumenical nature and respectful of all faiths.

Webster's New World Dictionary defines ecumenical as "promoting cooperation or better understanding among differing religious faiths."

Since the debate, the Senate clerk screens prayers ahead of time and flagged the written text submitted by Hughes.

When Sens. Ida Ruben and Gloria Hollinger – both of whom are Jewish – heard of the reference, they asked Mooney to strike it.

"I said, 'Hey, I'll let him pray however he wants to pray. I'm not going to censor him and tell him how he needs to pray,'" Mooney told WND.

Ruben told the Frederick News-Post she then urged Hughes to substitute "messiah" for Jesus, telling him the reference could offend non-Christians and goes against the guidelines.

Neither Ruben nor Miller returned calls seeking comment.

"This is part of my faith," Hughes responded, according to Mooney. "The Gospel says when you pray, pray in Jesus' name."

The senators next asked to be excused from the floor during the prayer.

Paradoxically, a walk-out over a Muslim cleric's prayer opening a Washington state legislative session last month backfired on one Christian lawmaker.

Washington state Republican Rep. Lois McMahan

As WorldNetDaily reported, Rep. Lois McMahan, a Republican from Gig Harbor, Wash., refused to participate in the prayer and declared, "My god is not Muhammed."

"The Islamic religion is so ... part and parcel with the attack on America. I just didn't want to be there, be a part of that," she said in an interview with the Seattle Post Intelligencer. "Even though the mainstream Islamic religion doesn't profess to hate America, nonetheless it spawns the groups that hate America."

But a day later, McMahan apologized on the floor of the state House of Representatives amid mounting furor over her stance.

Debate over invocations is raging elsewhere in the country. As WorldNetDaily reported, several Southern California cities are grappling with threats from both sides of the issue.

Under pressure from the American Civil Liberties Union to quit using the name Jesus Christ in invocations, the city of Lake Elsinore, in Riverside County, decided to eliminate mention of "religious figures." The decree subsequently had the apparent effect of eliminating the prayer altogether, as no local pastors would accept invitations to deliver the prayer, and city councilors adopted moments of silence instead.

The ACLU contends that praying at the request of a government entity is a violation of the First Amendment's prohibition against the establishment of religion.

But the nonprofit United States Justice Foundation, which threatened to sue the city if it failed to reverse its decision, maintains telling a pastor what to pray is a violation of his First Amendment rights to freedom of speech and religion.

The notion of "separation of church and state" is derived from the dissenting opinion of the 1946 Supreme Court case Everson vs. Board of Education, which upheld a program allowing parents to be repaid from state funds for the costs of transportation to private religious schools. The court required only that the state maintain neutrality in its relations with various groups of religious believers.

"The decision in Everson does not rise to the level of being a battle cry for those who would wish to remove every vestige of religion from the public forum," USJF litigation counsel Richard Ackerman asserts.

"There's a push in this country to remove religion from society," Mooney echoed, "from the Supreme Court's decision on the Pledge to the ACLU going after all the Ten Commandments posted across the country. ... Nothing in the church-state relationship allows censorship and the removal of religious values from society."


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events; US: Maryland
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; christians; ecumenical; hypocrites; jews; liberals; maryland; silliness; watereddown
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To: ET(end tyranny)
I could almost find that offensive, but that would require me to care.

As for perversion, I probably am considered a prevert, I happen to be a man who enjoys the company of women, a good bottle of scotch and high capacity magazines and I believe in GOD. To some aberrant segments of the populous, that is perversion.

Last post to this thread, I've lost interest. Goodnight.
521 posted on 04/03/2003 11:52:35 PM PST by Rasputin_TheMadMonk (Yes I am a bastard, but I'm a free, white, gun owning bastard. Just ask my exwife.)
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To: TopQuark
I've read the whole thread and that's exactly the meaning. If the United States isn't a Christian nation because we have Jews, Muslims, etc as citizens then Israel can't be a Jewish nation because there are Christians and Muslims who live there.
522 posted on 04/03/2003 11:55:08 PM PST by SendShaqtoIraq
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To: Rasputin_TheMadMonk
Well your screen name IS Rasputin. I merely commented to another poster about their comment to you. And Rasputin WAS a pervert!

So get all bothered at me, you chose your screen name.

523 posted on 04/03/2003 11:55:44 PM PST by ET(end tyranny) (Heavenly Father, please embrace, and protect, our Pres., our troops and those of our true allies.)
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To: LaineyDee
Gets your dander up, doesn't it? *chuckle*

Sure does :-)
524 posted on 04/03/2003 11:55:55 PM PST by so_real
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To: so_real
Thank you. Others on this list are too stupid to get that.
525 posted on 04/03/2003 11:56:59 PM PST by SendShaqtoIraq
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To: Illbay
SORRY, the Truth doesn't change depending on the audience.
526 posted on 04/03/2003 11:58:16 PM PST by newguy357
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To: SendShaqtoIraq
The point has been made that this is a nation founded on God, not christianity. Check your currency. In God We Trust. Not, In Jesus We Trust. In GOD We Trust. I think the founders were ever so wise to make the distinction.
527 posted on 04/03/2003 11:58:25 PM PST by ET(end tyranny) (Heavenly Father, please embrace, and protect, our Pres., our troops and those of our true allies.)
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To: ET(end tyranny)
"Someone posted that Christians pray ONLY to Jesus"

No we pray to the Father THROUGH Jesus.
528 posted on 04/03/2003 11:58:26 PM PST by SendShaqtoIraq
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To: ET(end tyranny)
So how can it be that Christians are supposed to pray ONLY to Jesus????

If someone has made such a statement, I would happily disagree. But Christians *do* pray in Christ's name. That's a big part of our religion and there's no reason to try and wrestle it away from us.
529 posted on 04/04/2003 12:01:04 AM PST by so_real
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To: ET(end tyranny)
The point has been made that this is a nation founded on God, not christianity. Check your currency. In God We Trust. Not, In Jesus We Trust. In GOD We Trust. I think the founders were ever so wise to make the distinction.

Jesus gave glory to God, and our founding fathers were ever so wise to follow suit. If you check your history books, you'll find the founding father's had abundant Christians.
530 posted on 04/04/2003 12:09:28 AM PST by so_real
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To: Illbay
Nothing chaps my hide more than someone trying to PUSH their beliefs on someone else when it isn't invited or appropriate.

I'm under the impression he WAS invited!

The pastor – a Vietnam veteran – was invited to give the prayer by Republican Sen. Alex Mooney. Hughes was Mooney's fourth guest. The other three were Jewish rabbis.

531 posted on 04/04/2003 12:10:23 AM PST by F-117A
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To: TopQuark
If you are in a mixed company, you seek a common ground. If you pray to G-d, you do not jeopardize any of your Christian beliefs and remain on common ground with Christians of all denominations, Jews, Muslims, and Hindu.

Thanks for the insult in preface to your response to me. I won't respond in kind.

If the minister's conscience bids him to pray "in Jesus name" anytime he prays (and we're not debating whether or not that in itself is appropriate), then to expect him to DROP the "in Jesus name" is to make the minister violate his own conscience.

Personally, in this situation if it were me, I would seek common ground, and pray to God, because my conscience is not bothered by saying the name "God", and omitting the ending of "in Jesus name." But maybe this minister is different. I know that there are some fundamentalist Christians (as well as Christians of other stripes) who would feel that it was a form of denying Christ NOT to finish a prayer with those words.

Maybe had the minister been aware of the fact that he wasn't supposed to say Jesus name, he would have declined the offer to lead the prayer, due to a violation of his conscience.

532 posted on 04/04/2003 12:10:28 AM PST by Proud2BAmerican
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To: SendShaqtoIraq
No we pray to the Father THROUGH Jesus.

Hey, I'm not the one that said Christians pray only to Jesus. But, I did retrieve the post for you. Better tell them!!

Ditto! It;s time for others to show some respect and tolerance. It is ONLY to Jesus that Christians pray. They have NO choice but to reference His name. To suggest otherwise would void the prayer.

327 posted on 04/03/2003 11:22 PM EST by nmh
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533 posted on 04/04/2003 12:11:59 AM PST by ET(end tyranny) (Heavenly Father, please embrace, and protect, our Pres., our troops and those of our true allies.)
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To: so_real
Jesus gave glory to God, and our founding fathers were ever so wise to follow suit. If you check your history books, you'll find the founding father's had abundant Christians.

No doubt they were, I didn't say they weren't, only that they CHOSE to put God on our currency not Jesus.

534 posted on 04/04/2003 12:19:42 AM PST by ET(end tyranny) (Heavenly Father, please embrace, and protect, our Pres., our troops and those of our true allies.)
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To: SendShaqtoIraq
If you are interested, this is a good read: Were the Founding Fathers Christian?
535 posted on 04/04/2003 12:28:02 AM PST by so_real
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To: so_real
Thank you oh thank you oh thank you. Nice to have so much proof in ONE place.
536 posted on 04/04/2003 1:22:54 AM PST by SendShaqtoIraq
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To: wardaddy
That my view. American Jews should speak up for Israel and Jewish interests but there is not enough respect shown for Christian interests in a Christian founded, Christian inspired nation. In this case a very simple Christian interest of using Jesus' name in a public prayer. America and Israel are the best nations for Jews to live.  

It's not as though the minister was going on for 20 minutes about Jesus. 

I would possibly walk out on public Muslim prayers since this is not a Muslim founded nation, thank heavens.

537 posted on 04/04/2003 4:22:40 AM PST by dennisw
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To: Delphinium
It's pretty self explanatory. Who says the Jews are the ones making the trouble. The flip side is that the Christian is making trouble...
538 posted on 04/04/2003 4:24:55 AM PST by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
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To: wardaddy
Also this seems to be an attempt to limit ministers to the Old Testament in public prayers. It's very nice this is the general practice but exceptions are no big deal.
539 posted on 04/04/2003 4:25:24 AM PST by dennisw
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To: Thinkin' Gal
Baruch Haba Bashem Adonai Yeshua HaMoshiach
540 posted on 04/04/2003 4:47:00 AM PST by Jeremiah Jr
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