'We didn't fly to Baghdad to drink coffee' (Former Russian Generals help Iraq prepare for war)

Gazeta.ru ^ | 04/02/03 | Alexander Kornilov

[Smogger]

Gazeta.Ru has obtained sensational evidence proving the involvement of a group of former Soviet generals in preparing the Iraqi army for war against the United States. The generals in question refused to discuss their degree of involvement, but admitted that just before the beginning of the US-led campaign against Iraq they received state awards from the Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

Photos, which Gazeta.Ru has acquired, show an awards ceremony (namely awards, our sources emphasized, and not gifts), involving two very prominent Russian generals.

They are retired Soviet officers, Col.-Gen. Vladimir Achalov and Col.-Gen. Igor Maltsev. The former completed his military career as the Soviet deputy defence minister, after being the Air-Borne Troops commander and the first and last Soviet commander-in-chief of the rapid-reaction forces. The latter resigned from the post of the chief of the Main Staff of the Soviet Air Defence. In 1991 both generals backed the GKChP, (the State Committee for the State of Emergency, set up by a group of Gorbachev opponents with the goal of supplanting him and preventing the disintegration of the USSR) and were consequently dismissed from military service.

The photos show Achalov and Maltsev receiving awards from Iraqi Defence Minister Sultan Hashim Akhmed. Another photo commemorating the event features the Russian generals in the company of the head of the General Staff of the Iraqi Army Izzat Ibragim and his deputies. On the photo published above the Iraqi official is standing between Achalov and Maltsev.

According to our source who provided the photos, the ceremony was held ''less than 10 days before the beginning of the war'' in a building that was destroyed by US cruise missiles in the first few hours of air raids on Baghdad.

[Stavka2]

My attacks? Have you gone senial? Read what I wrote, while you splatter off your usual racism. Where in my post did I attack the US? And in other posts, if putting some unpleasant facts into the discussion is attacking, then not only are you thin skinned but living in fantasy land...you keep up your racism. If you blathered half as much racism against Jews, you'd have been banned a long time ago...or blacks or most any other race...but I guess its green light on Slavs.

[Grampa Dave]

You hate America, and 99% of your posts show that hatred.

I have no racism. I have deep contempt of those who hate my country and what it stands for.

So go pester someone else who might care. You are not worth a single electron of response to your hatred and slams against our country.

[Grampa Dave]

When Fox News announces that we have seized the airports, we will know how close we are to them.

[Stavka2]

Attack America? If pointing out hypocracy like the US still backing the KLA is attacking, fine I'm guilty. I expect elected officials to hold their promises and if you declare a war on terror, it had better be against all terror, and not excuse the "useful" terrorists like Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, the Chechins, IRA, KLA...if you can't handle that to damned bad.

[js1138]

Think of it this way, if the GPS blocker attracts HARM missiles...it makes a great defense. A $300 box for a $40,000 missile...

You still peddling this $hit? How much do you think the Iraqis paid for these $300 boxes, and how much value did they get? How many bombs missed their targets while they were in operation?

[Stavka2]

I'm not peddling crap. I'm pointing out possible uses on a defense of equipment...as it draws HARM type missiles in. If you have problems in critical thinking along military lines, that's not my problem.

[js1138]

I don't do critical thinking along military lines. I observe results.

[Stavka2]

Just because an item doesn't work the way it is described doesn't mean it's useless, there are often other uses, by thinking outside the box. If a $300 gadget can attrack to itself a $40,000 missile, that is a good pay off.

[js1138]

You have yet to prove that Iraq paid only $300 dollars for the devices. I can assure you that the manufacturing cost of a $3000 computer is under $50, but that is not the selling price.

[thrcanbonly1]

I guess that explains why Asscroft was in Moscow a while back.

[plusone]

Thanks for your reply. Didn't know the movie was based on a book. I saw the movie Stalingrad, it is interesting to compare the two side by side. The problem that the Germans faced was that by bombing out the city prior to their attemtp at occupation, it plugged the streets with rubble and prevented their tanks from maneuvering around. Bombing the buildings gave the defenders a million fox holed to fight from, putting the Nazis at a disadvantage.

[Stavka2]

The book was written in 1971. The guy had permition to travel all over the Soviet Union and gathered interviews from Russian military/civilians, Germans, Italians, Romanians and Hungarians and backed it up with official documents. It is trully an excellent read and flows really smoothly. In the end, you even start to feel sorry for the Germans. But the Russian army never attacked like in the movie...past the first 15 minutes of the movie it all goes fantasy..about as realistic as the Patriot. Zatsov was already a renowned sniper when he got to Stalingrad. The hunt with the German was only about 2 weeks long and ended with the German getting a bullet in the eye...but a stupid commisar did provide a nice target for the German to expose himself.

The Russian army fought hard battles close in...in the accounts dozens of men from both sides died in single corridors or stairwells, throwing grenades at each other or rushing each other with pistols and blades.

The strongest check to the Germans in the north came from several defending workers battalions, who walked off the assembly lines with anti-tank rifles and machine guns and stopped 3 armored Wehrmact brigades cold...and really mauled one of them. They held for about 2 weeks till releaved by regulars.

Of course the German mistakes were legion...namely not knowing how to fight in urban centers where maneuver is not an option.

Excellent book. As a matter of fact, the Red Army perfected kill sacks in Stalingrad. They'd let the German tanks by, slaughter the infantry and then hit the tanks from the rear when they tried backing up.

Russian troops would come through sewers and take up positions in the German rear.."cleared" areas.

[plusone]

Thanks for the info, looks like a fascinating read. Yes, movies, even based on true events, are not usually very accurate. But keep in mind that the movie is trying to tell the events of possibly several months in a two hour time frame. But evenso, some movies are more true to the facts than others. Another interesting thing about Stalingrad. There was a documentary about the siege of the city, and why Hitler refused to give up on it. It is commonly thought that it was because of its name, that Hitler would look bad by retreating from a city named for Stalin. Hitler's public announcement for his reluctance to withdraw troops was that it tied up the Red Army and left open the route for the Caspian oil fields, which the German army needed. In private, however, he stated that he feared public support for the war would collapse (and with it the 'legitimacy'of the Nazi regime) if they gave up on the city. The real problem the Nazis had was that they had been spoiled earlier on with the easy battles of western Europe. But then they attacked the Russians...

[Stavka2]

Whether the Iraqies paid for it that much or more, they got to test it for free.

[Stavka2]

Not to mention that Hitler was in his own reality. He wanted to relieve the seige with a Brigade of Tiger 1s...against 2 Soviet armies...his generals couldn't get him to see the absurdity of it.

[ko_kyi]

"..OK guys, here is what we did in June of 1941. I will tell you how it comes out in my return visit in 2004. Good luck."

[UCANSEE2]

I sure hope that GW will put a stop to his chumming up with Putin and quit extending those cozy little invites to his ranch and Camp David.

No, you don't. Luckily, our PRESIDENT is very well educated and very experienced and knows this:
Keep your friends close, but keep your ENEMIES CLOSER.

[dljordan]

Didn't our Homeland Security Department just hire Gen. Yevginy Primikov, a former KGB general, to "advise" them on security? I'd say the only thing he's experienced in is maintaining a police state. So what does that make us? Or am I a "traitor" for even mentioning this?

[plusone]

Along those lines, I read on another site one possible motivation for this current war. The protestors have it worng. It isn't about oil, but how it is priced. The general agreement now is that oil is paid for and priced in US dollars. This gives the US an enormous advantage. The huge world wide consumption of oil by necessity creates a huge demand for US dollars to pay for it. This helps to prop up the demand for the currency, and gives a boost to the American economy, which relies heavily on foreign investors to pump money into the American economy to make up for shortfalls in domestic savings. Iraq had started to accept Euros for payment, and other oil producers were considering doing the same. Sin ce the US can't print Euros to pay for oil, if the region went Euro exclusive, it would doom the US dollar. It is an interesting theory.

[plusone]

True, but the overall world price for oil results from the last few thousand barrels pumped 'at the margin' as economists call it. So no matter where our oil comes from, the price is set by the total world production over and above consumption. If the Saudis or whoever pump a few thousand barrels more than is needed at that time, the marginal price will drop, dragging down the value of all world production. That is why OPEC was such a force to be reckoned with for so long, they controlled that last little bit of surplus production, helping to boost prices above what they would have been otherwise. So even if our oil is from Mexico, what happens in the middle east will affect the world price.