IRAQI GENERAL CAPTURED

Sky News ^ | March 30, 2003

[Dog Gone]

It's nice to see the Brits keeping their dry wit, even during this dangerous operation.

[Pern]

Targets were given names including Pussy Galore,...

Sounds like a raid on Basra's Cat House. Maybe that's were they captured the General!

[jellybean]

The name is Bond, James Bond...

[68skylark]

Around 22 Iraqi T55 tanks were destroyed in an artillery bombardment...

I have some experience as a U. S. Army field artillery officer, and I'm not aware that field artillery can destroy tanks. Does anyone get the feeling that sometimes the troops on the ground are just feeding crazy stories to journalists for their own amusement, to see what will get printed?

[shezza]

Now I have that theme song running through my head. (Dum-da-daaa-da-da-da dum-da-daaaa-da ...Ba-daaaaaa)

"Here's to you, Royal Marines! Cheers...."

[Lonesome in Massachussets]

I'm not aware that field artillery can destroy tanks.

During the Battle of the Bulge US 8" self-propelled guns were employed "direct fire" to kill Royal Tigers, I am told by someone who was there and has the decorations to prove it. I don't know of a field artillery armor piercing round, but I suppose a contact fuze HE round would do enough damage, direct fire.

[68skylark]

Yeah, artillery can be used in a direct fire mode to take out armored vehicles, but it a very rare and dangerous tactic, and this only works against vehicles with relatively light armor like APC's -- I suspect that even a T-55 is modern enough to absorb a direct hit.

I remain highly sceptical about the report that the Brits used artillery to take out a significant number of T-55's -- they most likely used other weapons that are meant to do this job, like direct fire from tanks and TOW missles, or laser-guided bombs.

And when I read reports that seem to have some facts wrong, it makes me wonder about the truth of the other details in the report.

I still suspect troops on the ground are having some fun by feeding misleading info to reporters to see what will get into print, and to keep the enemy guessing about what we're really doing.

[Mister Baredog]

Does anyone get the feeling that sometimes the troops on the ground are just feeding crazy stories to journalists for their own amusement, to see what will get printed?

could by PSY-OPS. But some poor grunt complained he was hungry the other day and the PRESS turned it into a DISASTER of monumental proportion

[SamAdams76]

Maybe not an Abrams or a British Challenger. But we're talking T-55s and T-72s here. My son could probably take some of them out with his slingshot. Ok, so maybe I'm exaggerating just a bit.

[GRANGER]

You might have seen the video tape of Brit. 155s firing at high angle. They may have been using terminally guided AT rounds that have a shaped charge and radar terminal guidance. They kill through the relatively thin top armor.

[been_lurking]

Around 22 Iraqi T55 tanks were destroyed in an artillery bombardment...

I'm not aware that field artillery can destroy tanks.

Another possibility -- the reporters don't know the difference between field artillery and SP guns.

[rageaholic]

How do they know he's a General and not some homeless bum who put on the General's uniform after he traded it for civilian disguise?

[KneelBeforeZod]

I don't know if they are deployed, or if the Brits have something similar, but copperhead artillery shells are made specifically to destroy tanks.

Copphead info

[KneelBeforeZod]

Sequence of telemetered Copperhead round (without warhead) during test firing at White Sands, Dec. 9, 1977. In other tests the warhead was tested as well.

Copperhead, the Army's M712 Cannon-Launched Guided Projectile, was a precision guided 155mm, indirect fire weapon capable of destroying small, static or moving, hard point targets. Operationally, an artillery forward observer was equipped with a laser designator which he would use to pinpoint the target after he directed the artillery to launch a Copperhead into the selected area. As the projectile approached the target area, it picked up the laser signal and homed in on the target.

Copperhead was fired from a conventional 155mm howitser. It was 54 inches long and weighed 138 pounds. It carried a shaped charge capable of penetrating tank armor.

[Lancey Howard]

I remember at Camp Geiger (Marines ITS) we used an old tank for LAAW target practice. We must have hit that thing a hundred times and it was still standing there.

[KneelBeforeZod]

The M109A6 basic load is 37 complete conventional rounds and two Copperhead rounds. The CATV basic load is 96 conventional rounds and four Copperhead rounds. The CATV may average one to five rearming moves per day in addition to tactical and survivability moves. A section, consisting of a howitzer and a CATV, normally operates as one of three sections in a platoon but may operate alone in a fire area.

[bootyist-monk]

Probably the greatest anti-tank gun ever was the German 88, which started its life as an anti-aircraft flak weapon.

[tet68]

Do you remember the spiel about, "Gentlemen, someday we will have weapons with this capability."

A rifle man with a M-14 shoots at a tank downrange.
Kablooie, they set off a case of tnt in the turret.

It was awesome.

Mad minute Bump.

[Joe 6-pack]

"I have some experience as a U. S. Army field artillery officer, and I'm not aware that field artillery can destroy tanks."

As others have alluded to above, the copperhead is a highly effective round, but requires an FO on the ground to point a laser. Cluster munitions delivered by MLRS and other systems may not, "destroy," armor, per se; however, it can seriously degrade armor operations by creating mobility kills by disabling a tank's track, damaging external optics, etc.