PATRIOTIC CONSERVATIVES DURING “SHOCK AND AWE”

Chronicles Magazine ^ | 3/25/2003 | Thomas Fleming

[JohnGalt]

...

[ohioman]

All against the war can go to hell. It is that simple.

[m1911]

"We reserve our contempt for the little buglers and drummer boys, unleashing the dogs of war from the safety of their weblogs and chatrooms, but we offer our prayers for the American troops and for the people of Iraq."

Some snippets from AMERICA'S FLAILING FRANCOPHOBES
by Thomas Fleming

"I succeeded in staying out of the military during the Vietnam War, and I would never assume the right to tell others to do a “duty” that I shirked."

Naw, but you'll assume to tell those who've never enjoyed your freedom to spout pointless crap that they should just take their rapes, tortures, and murders like good little foreigners.
Just have to post another line from that one, even though it's not on point:

"I love my country, knowing all the limitations and frailties of the American people, and I respect and admire the French, who have been a far greater nation than we shall ever be, that is, if greatness means anything loftier than money and bombs."

[JohnGalt]

The neo-Wilsonians and Canadian conservatives will never be in agreement with American conservatives. Thats a fair point, and FR has no borders.

[Wavyhill]

We reserve our contempt for the little buglers and drummer boys, unleashing the dogs of war from the safety of their weblogs and chatrooms...I served in the Corps, and I support the war. I expect that most veterans do as well. A good percentage of the counterprotesters in Reno last Saturday were veterans. Fleming is arguing by lies and slurs, not by facts. He is, quite simply, unleashing the dogs of anti-Semitic hatred from the safety of his web column. What a stud.

[JohnGalt]

Thought you might like this...

[JohnGalt]

"unleashing the dogs of anti-Semitic hatred from the safety of his web column."

Compare his line with what other folks are saying about France. Or is French hatred okay and noble and manly?

And how "little buglers and drummer boys," can be read as code for anti-semitism is from the far reaches of the Chomsky school of linguistics.

[lodwick]

...they are paid so well.

What has dude been smoking?

Consider what a young airman writes to Cindy Williams:

I just had the pleasure of reading your column, "Our GIs earn enough" and I am a bit confused. Frankly, I'm wondering where this vaunted overpayment is going, because as far as I can tell, it disappears every month between DFAS (The Defense Finance and Accounting Service) and my bank account. Checking my latest leave and earnings statement (LES), I see that I make $1,117.80 before taxes. After taxes, I take home $874.20. When I run that through Windows' Calculator, I come up with an annual salary of $13,413.60 before taxes, and $10,490.40 after.

I work in the Air Force Network Control Center (AFNCC), where I am part of the team responsible for the administration of a 5,000-host computer network.

I am involved with infrastructure segments, specifically with Cisco Systems equipment. A quick check under jobs for Network Technicians in the Washington, D.C. area reveals a position in my career field, requiring three years experience with my job. Amazingly, this job does NOT pay $13,413.60 a year, nor does it pay less than this. No, this job is being offered at $70,000 to $80,000 per annum. I'm sure you can draw the obvious conclusions.

Also, you tout increases to Basic Allowance for Housing and Basic Allowance for Subsistence (housing and food allowances, respectively) as being a further boon to an already overcompensated force. Again, I'm curious as to where this money has gone, as BAH and BAS were both slashed 15% in the Hill AFB area effective in January 00.

Given the tenor of your column, I would assume that you have NEVER had the pleasure of serving your country in her armed forces. Before you take it upon yourself to once more castigate congressional and DOD leadership for attempting to get the families in the military's lowest pay brackets off AFDC, WIC, and food stamps, I suggest that you join a group of deploying soldiers headed for AFGHANISTAN, I leave the choice of service branch up to you. Whatever choice you make, though, opt for the SIX month rotation: it will guarantee you the longest possible time away from your family and friends, thus giving you full "deployment experience."

As your group prepares to board the plane, make sure to note the spouses and children who are saying good-bye to their loved ones. Also take care to note that several families are still unsure of how they'll be able to make ends meet while the primary breadwinner is gone -- obviously they've been squandering the vast piles of cash the DOD has been giving them.

Try to deploy over a major holiday; Christmas and Thanksgiving are perennial favorites.

And when you're actually over there, sitting in a DFP (Defensive Fire Position, the modern-day foxhole), shivering against the cold desert night; and the flight sergeant tells you that there aren't enough people on shift to relieve you for chow, remember this: trade whatever MRE (meal-ready-to-eat) you manage to get for the tuna noodle casserole or cheese tortellini, and add Tabasco to everything. This gives some flavor.

Talk to your loved ones as often as you are permitted; it won't nearly be long enough or often enough, but take what you can get and be thankful for it. You may have picked up on the fact that I disagree with most of the points you present in your op-ed piece.

But, tomorrow from KABUL, I will defend to the death your right to say it. You see, I am an American fighting man, a guarantor of your First Amendment rights and every other right you cherish. On a daily basis, my brother and sister soldiers worldwide ensure that you and people like you can thumb your collective nose at us, all on a salary that is nothing short of pitiful and under conditions that would make most people cringe.

We hemorrhage our best and brightest into the private sector because we can't offer the stability and pay of civilian companies. And you, Ms Williams, have the gall to say that we make more than we deserve?

Rubbish!

A1C Michael Bragg, Hill AFB AFNCC"

[Wavyhill]

Fine, you got me on the anti-Semitic part. Nevertheless, my main point stands--that he has no business accusing the neocons or other supporters of the war of cowardice for communicating via email, when he himself communicates via email. It isn't as if all the supporters of this war are people who've never served; indeed, there are far more veterans at protests in favor of the war than against. As for France, how is it unmanly to say that France has betrayed our trust? They have--as have Germany and Mexico, among others.

[ohioman]

Thanks. I believe this is not the time for debate on the why's of war. We should be more concerned about our boys fighting an evil regime. I am afraid the chemicals will come out soon.

[JohnGalt]

What are you talking about; Fleming didn't ask me to post this article. I 'stole' it from his website and posted it here for patriotic conservatives who were against the war to think about.

Clearly, its not for your consumption, but you should respect that one can be a conservative and disagree on the wisdom of a particular tactic.

[Wavyhill]

When Frum calls paleocons "unpatriotic," it's not because they oppose the war. It is because many of them display such vitriol toward supporters of the war that "unpatriotic" is a reasonable term. For instance, Georgie Anne Geyer is opposed to this war, but I doubt if Frum would call her unpatriotic; I certainly wouldn't. Misguided, but not unpatriotic. But the catalyst for Frum's article was another article in The American Conservative which accused neocons of having engineered the war to help Israel, knowing that it would be harmful to America but not caring because they were unpatriotic. Two points: first, Buchanan, who inspired Frum's article, has a long history of writing crypto-anti-Semitic columns, then saying they were misinterpreted, then writing more crypto-anti-Semitic columns. Second, if paleocons are going to accuse neocons of treason: what goes around comes around.

[JohnGalt]

Again, if you like Frum's style and can stomach a Canadian Yalie, who's daddy paid for prep school all the way though to his MBA, as your 'goto guy,' all power to you.

[JohnGalt]

Saw you on Irishman's thread, thought you might like this article as something to read, not necesarily a reflection of your views.

[Wavyhill]

What does that have to do with his arguments? Do you honestly think all paleocon writers worked their way through school as night janitors? Many neocon, paleocon, and liberal writers come from wealthy families. They are successful based on how well their arguments resonate with people who are not as rich as they are. "He's a sissy and I can kick his ass" is generally not considered a valid argument. (Even if I have used that argument against Michael Moore).:)

[JohnGalt]

And you are free to choose your intellectual heros.

[JohnGalt]

Mostly, his arguments were lies and distortions being fed to an audience that buys into 'Buchanan as crypto-anti-Semite.'

[Wavyhill]

Listen, it isn't as if Buchanan were ousted from respectable conservative circles by a bunch of sneaky neocons overnight. Rather, they gave him chance after chance, and he kept saying he was misinterpreted and then biting at the anti-Semitic bait again. Case in point: much has been said about his column on the "amen corner" for Israel. In my view, while calling Israel's American supporters this might not show much class, it clearly is not anti-Semitic. But the rest of the article is!!! He states that men with names like Murphy, blah blah blah, and Leroy Brown will die in Iraq, and he carefully picks ethnically associated names. He just as carefully leaves any Jewish names out of the list. This was not only anti-Semitic, but cowardly. Nevertheless, conservatives generally let it go. Then, a few years later, he stated that we'd have been better off not getting into WWII. Some of them still let it go. Then, right after 9/11, he wrote that if we hadn't supported Israel, this wouldn't have happened. The man only gets so many chances.

[JohnGalt]

Is "crypto-anti-Semitism" worse than out-right anti-Frankism?