US, Backers Responsible Before God on Iraq - Vatican

Reuters | 3/18/03

[kattracks]

March 18

— VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Vatican said Tuesday that countries which decided to wage war on Iraq without the consensus of the international community were assuming great responsibility before God and history.

"Those who decide that all peaceful means that international law makes available are exhausted assume a grave responsibility before God, their conscience and history," said Vatican spokesman Joaquin Navarro-Valls.

Navarro-Valls comment was the Vatican's first official reaction to Washington's ultimatum to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein to go into exile within 48 hours or face war.

[hope]

This pro-Saddam body and with it's pedophilia co-dependants makes you wonder why they even get an audience in America.

[FITZ]

What does it mean when the Pope suggests that we must follow international law?

I'm not against the Pope, at one time I think he was on the level of Reagan ---but neither one is at that same level today. Reagan rode into the sunset (he is still riding into the sunset), maybe it's better to step down at some point.

[Jimmyclyde]

read later...

[American Blood]

They are doing the same thing to us as they do to Israel.

Our support for Israel is probably the one factor that causes most anti-American sentiment around the world. It's the price we pay for defending freedom.

[laz17]

They need to be condemning the UN for it's abortion policies.

The UN is a manifestation of the Beast and a precursor of the Antichrist. It is no coincidence that the Left, which denies God and opposes the Gospel, worships at the altar of the UN. The UN is their false god, promising a man-made, secular humanist, socialist utopia in place of the Kingdom of Heaven promised by God. Anyone who dares call himself a Christian should be able to recognize that the man behind the curtain at the UN is Satan. So for the Vatican to insist that we must obey the will of the UN is tantamount to insisting that we submit to the will of Satan. Is this what the Church is for? Is this the purpose for which Christ founded the Church? To instruct the flock to believe that nothing is legitimate unless it has the UN's stamp of approval? To accept the rule of a socialist, godless mafia which turns the other way when Christians are slaughtered and seeks to protect Muslim terrorists? To bow before an organization which promotes everything that is contrary to the Word of God and seeks to replace Judeo-Christianity will all sorts of ancient pagan beliefs? I think not!

[Sam Cree]

"Those who decide that all peaceful means that international law makes available are exhausted assume a grave responsibility before God, their conscience and history," said Vatican spokesman Joaquin Navarro-Valls."

"There is nothing wrong, and everything right, with this statement."

Sure, the statement is accurate and right. I just can't help feeling that it's primary purpose was negative criticism of Bush and Blair. If I am wrong and you are right, I will be happy.

I am also kind of doubtful that "all the peaceful means that international law make available" are even remotely sufficient for dealing with a monster such as Hussein.

[FITZ]

And if the Pope really did say we need to follow "international law" then I would guess he really is at the same level as Reagan is today ---and it wasn't he but someone else who prompted him to say it. There might be people with their own agenda who are taking advantage of his age and medical conditions.

[CasearianDaoist]

I am not criticising Israel, I am suggesting that we prepare for the same sort of irrationaly and hypocracy that Israel receives from "world opinion." We need to be at least as agressive in countering it.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Giving hope to a WMD-coveting sadist madman and his sons is very vile. It ought to be considered aiding and abetting in the mass murder of innocents. Isn't that a mortal sin?

I would say "yes".

[vaudine]

That is because the church is much like the UN--filled with bureaucrats jockeying for position, and those carried away with their lofty importance.

Also, like the UN, they share the blame for not identifying and condemning evil in Iraq, Sudan, etc.

vaudine

[FITZ]

To instruct the flock to believe that nothing is legitimate unless it has the UN's stamp of approval?

I don't think this Pope would have said something like this in his good days. Even Reagan could probably be coached to say it today.

[Cap'n Crunch]

Yes, Caesar must have his way doesn't he? Here, raise your voice: "We have no King but Caesar!"

I believe in St. Augustine's City of God he points out the two cities, the city of the world and the city of God.

I'll listen to the words of the Pope and trust him as the Vicar of Christ.

[cyncooper]

I do not see where the Pope said we "need to follow" international law. He said those who decide all peaceful means provided by international law have been exhausted.

[Sam Cree]

"Our support for Israel is probably the one factor that causes most anti-American sentiment around the world"

That is part of the picture, IMO. I read in another thread a thought with which I also agree, that the wrath of radical Islam (and I suppose much of "mainstream" Islam, if there is such a thing) is turned toward America primarily because she stands in the way of their hopes for the destruction of Israel.

[F16Fighter]

Sadly, the evidence suggests the Vatican has now totally lost its moral compass.

[cyncooper]

Correction: Exact wording is

"all peaceful means that international law makes available"

Makes available does = must follow.

[cyncooper]

does NOT = must follow

[Eastbound]

"He said those who decide all peaceful means provided by international law have been exhausted."

I think the question on this thread is whether the Pope is just generalizing or agreeing that all peaceful means have been exhausted -- or not. Maybe he should have made that clear.

[Cap'n Crunch]

You said a mouthful about the UN brother. I think the United States is a greater member of the UN than the Vatican. I don't think the Vatican has a permanent seat in the UN, but the US does. A few years ago people were lobbying to get the Vatican thrown out of the UN because of their abortion stance.

Isn't it funny that our own country is giving our rights away to the UN more and more yet on this issue they rail against the Vatican about the UN.

Didn't our own government give Army soldier Michael New a dishonorable discharge for refusing to wear the UN emblem on his uniform?

[Kevin Curry]

Yes, Caesar must have his way doesn't he?

Yes, he must. Jesus Christ never taught otherwise. In a broken world, until the King comes to rule directly and personally, we must contend as best we can in Caesar's realm. Any foolish attempt to jumpstart the process will cause only far more misery.