He knew His destiny and His work and the effect it was supposed to have, which effect it did have and so proves the preordination. I don't believe God intiates events that may or may not work. Precise human agency would have to be forseen. 
Posted on 03/07/2003 10:46:15 PM PST by Pharmboy
LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - A prominent Jewish leader on Friday asked actor Mel Gibson (news) to make certain that his new film on the last 12 hours in the life of Christ does not portray the Jews as collectively responsible for the crucifixion.
Rabbi Marvin Hier, dean and founder of the Simon Wiesenthal Center, said he was concerned because an article to be published in the New York Times Magazine portrays Gibson as a traditionalist Catholic opposed to the reforms of Vatican (news - web sites) II.
Heir said, "Obviously, no one has seen 'The Passion' and I certainly have no problem with Mel Gibson's right to believe as he sees fit or make any movie he wants to. What concerns me, however is when I read that the film's purpose is to undo the changes made by Vatican II."
He said that Vatican conclave was convened to deal with several critical issues, including the rejection of the notion that the Jews were collectively responsible for the death of Jesus.
"If the new film seeks to undo Vatican II ... it would unleash more of the scurrilous charges of deicide directed against the Jewish people, which took the Catholic Church 20 centuries to finally repudiate," he said.
Gibson is completing the self-financed film on the last 12 hours in the life of Christ and a friend of the Gibson family is quoted as telling the Times that Gibson will graphically portray the intense suffering of Christ, "perhaps as no film has done before." Gibson is directing the film.
The friend, Gary Giuffre, a traditionalist Catholic, also said that the film will lay the blame for the death of Christ where it belongs -- a reference that some traditionalists believe means the Jewish authorities who presided over his trial, the article said.
A spokesman for Gibson had no comment, saying he had not seen the article. Sources close to the actor said Gibson's religious views and those of his family were known.
Discussing his film in a recent TV interview, Gibson was asked whether his account might particularly upset Jews. He said, "It may. It's not meant to. I think it's meant to just tell the truth."
Hell no! Everybody knows it was the fault of those greedy,imperialist Americans anyway. What's wrong with that Rabbi? Doesn't he listen to that famous Talmudic Scholar Barbra S?
I did.
For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. - Romans 5:6-8
Me too, but he's telling it in Amaraic, a language that very few people speak (if any). I'd appreciate some english subtitles at the very least.
Too bad, I usually like anything with Gibson in it.
And that is the perfectly true answer. He who has ears, let him hear.
A friend of the Gibson family has his own ideas about how traditionalist thought is informing ''The Passion.'' Gary Giuffre, a founder of the traditionalist St. Jude Chapel in Texas, says Gibson told him about his plans for ''The Passion'' on a recent visit. ''It will graphically portray the intense suffering of Christ, perhaps as no film has done before.'' Most important, he says, the film will lay the blame for the death of Christ where it belongs -- which some traditionalists believe means the Jewish authorities who presided over his trial and delivered him to the Romans to be crucified.
In his conversation with Bill O'Reilly (who prefaced the interview by disclosing that Gibson's production company has optioned the rights to O'Reilly's mystery novel), Gibson was asked whether his account might particularly upset Jews. ''It may,'' he said. ''It's not meant to. I think it's meant to just tell the truth. I want to be as truthful as possible. But when you look at the reasons why Christ came, why he was crucified -- he died for all mankind and he suffered for all mankind. So that, really, anyone who transgresses has to look at their own part or look at their own culpability.''
Well done.
John 14:6
Amen friend.
Gibson is notorious for saying it "how it is", as it should be. And as usual, the thin skinned power whiners always manage to have their feelings hurt for no good reason.
Like Mel said when asked if this movie will offend some people, he said "It might, but it's not meant to."
Christ died for ALL of us, Jews included. Anyone who reads The Gospels know that the Pharasies are the ones who had him arrested. His own diciples turned their back on him (except John), and they still didn't "get it".
As you said, PD, "go Mel go." I'm all over that.
And lorrainer, have I missed the obligatory "eye candy" supplement that usually accompanies any Mel Gibson thread?
Hmmmmm????
I look at Christ's story in a more positive light. Yes Jesus was a Jew. And yes, there were prominent Jews who viewed him as a blasphemer back then who could be considered responsible for his death.
But if it weren't for the events that took place, no matter who is to blame, we'd never know of the love of Jesus Christ and that he was God's gift to us. Christianity was born of his death. And for that, I am grateful.
If I had been there, I would have crafted the cross, I would have driven the nails, I would have mocked and scorned Him, I would have thrust the spear into His side.
The depths of depravity know no end, we are all vile, filthy, sinners who hated Him with a hatred that is all consuming. It is only due to the fact that He has transformed us by His love that we are able to fellowship with Him.
He knew His destiny and His work and the effect it was supposed to have, which effect it did have and so proves the preordination. I don't believe God intiates events that may or may not work. Precise human agency would have to be forseen.
So, God preordains the actions of the Jews so they can be condemed? They must really have pissed Him off.
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