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U.S. Warplanes Face Down Iraqi Jet Over Saudi
Yahoo News ^ | Sun Mar 2, 7:48 AM ET | Mariam Isa

Posted on 03/02/2003 10:39:49 AM PST by Kev-Head

PRINCE SULTAN AIRBASE, Saudi Arabia (Reuters) - U.S. warplanes were within two minutes of firing at an Iraqi Mig-25 fighter jet when it sneaked into Saudi airspace in an intensifying cat-and-mouse game between Western and Iraqi warplanes, U.S. air force pilots say.

The daring probe on Thursday by Iraq's fastest warplane -- a move apparently rarely attempted since the 1991 Gulf War -- indicated Baghdad was willing to take risks to test U.S.-led forces rapidly building up planes and troops in Saudi Arabia.

"He came 15-20 miles into Saudi airspace and went nose-to-nose with us at 70,000 feet," F-15C fighter pilot Lt. Col. Matt "Zap" Molloy told Reuters in an interview.

"He wisely turned around when we gave him a good hard radar lock ... We were two minutes away from firing an air-to-air missile in his direction," he said.

Saudi officials said they had no knowledge of any such incursion.

The MiG-25, code-named Foxbat by NATO allies, is an interceptor aircraft developed for the former Soviet airforce capable of flying at three times the speed of sound. It can also be used for reconnaissance.

U.S. pilots say that in the past two months they have encountered these planes more frequently in a "no-fly" zone over Iraq, set up after the Gulf War, while Iraqi troop activity has also intensified.

"They are stepping it up and trying to see what's out there ... listening and looking more," Molloy said.

"But we give them the benefit of the doubt -- when threatened we have to make a difficult call, and we coordinate with coalition forces in a measured way."

At present, coalition planes based at the Prince Sultan Airbase in Saudi Arabia are only allowed to take "defensive" action as part of strict rules of engagement agreed with authorities in the kingdom.

What this means is that Western planes could fire back only if under a "continuing" threat from Iraqi planes or missiles.

The Iraqi plane had posed a clear threat, U.S. pilots said.

As shots from the ground are normally wild and sporadic, Saudi-based U.S. warplanes just veer away when attacked, then call in jets based in Kuwait or from aircraft carriers to attack the guns on Iraqi soil.

"It's quite a dance, the rules are very strict. We don't want to act in an irrational way and we don't want to be doing anything illegal or politically untenable," Air Force Colonel James Moschgat, vice commander of U.S. planes patrolling a no-fly zone over southern Iraq, told Reuters.

AIR BASE ROLE CONTENTIOUS ISSUE

The issue of what foreign troops on Prince Sultan Airbase, 50 miles southeast of Riyadh, will do if war with Iraq breaks out has become increasingly contentious as Washington builds up its forces in the region.

Saudi authorities have repeatedly said they are against an attack on Iraq and will not allow U.S. forces to launch any invasion of the country from their territory.

In the event of war the role of the airbase -- which until recently was off limits to journalists -- remains unclear.

"The real question is whether we will be able to do direct attacks from here. We will have the capability to do that from here but that option is still being discussed by our governments," Moschgat said.

"Our mission will be to deny Iraq offensive capability by having as robust a force as possible."

He said U.S. and British forces at the base were being built up to ensure that in the event of war, the existing coalition would be able to patrol southern Iraqi skies round-the-clock instead of several hours a day as at present.

He added that regardless of what happened, a command and control center at the base would probably remain in charge of all the coalition air forces in the region.

Moschgat said the number of foreign troops -- mostly American -- at the base had reached 7,200 from 5,000 in early January. More U.S. troops were arriving by air every other day.

The normal 90-day period for U.S. soldiers to stay was suspended in late January. The U.S. military is erecting a tent city for the extra troops and Moschgat said there would be room for 14,000 foreign soldiers when it was ready in about a week.

The base would be able to take about 200 aircraft when the buildup was complete, he added.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: iraq; jetfighters; sadamhussein; saudiarabia
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To: Paraclete
The MIG-25 is a fast pig, our ancient F4's have a tighter turning radius.

Good info here.

21 posted on 03/02/2003 11:20:12 AM PST by KKing
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Comment #22 Removed by Moderator

Comment #23 Removed by Moderator

To: AmericanBabe
After all, if we hadn't protected them 12 years ago, they'd all be speaking Iraqi now. >

While I know what you mean, Saudi's and Iraqis, along with all the rest of the Arabs, from all along the African shore of the med to the western shore of the Persian Gulf, speak Arabic. I imagine they speak with different accents, colloquiallisms and such, but they can understand each other at least as well as Brooklynites and Texans can.

24 posted on 03/02/2003 11:32:28 AM PST by El Gato
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To: Paraclete
Just out of curiosity, how does an F-15 stack up against the "Foxbat," from a performance perspective?

F-15 is an air superiority fighter, Foxbot is a strategic interceptor, in particular one designed to intercept the Mach 3 US B-70, which we never built beyond the 3 prototypes. The F-15 is more manueverable, but the Foxbat is way faster. The Foxbat doesn't turn very well, even at slower speeds just below Mach 1, where most dogfights occurr. Depending on how equiped, the Foxbat probably has shorter range eyes but longer range missles. They are so fast that intercepting them is very difficult. IIRC, the Israelies never managed to intercept and shootdown any of the Mig-25s which were making high speeds runs from Syria to Egypt (or vice versa). Although they didn't have F-15s at the time, nor AMRAAMS. A better combination than an F-15 and AMRAAM (slammer) would be an F-14 with Phoenix missles. The F-14 was designed as a Fleet Air Defense fighter, a mission with many of the same requirements as a strategic interceptor, save that the FAD fighter also needs the ability to loiter, which is part of the reason the F-14 has a swing wing. Only the US Navy, and maybe the Iranians, fly the F-14. (We, or at least I, don't know if any of the Iranian F-14s are still flyable, having been deliered before the fall of the Shah, the Iranian hostage crisis, and spare parts having become a tad hard to come by after the Iranian hostage crisis under Mr. Peanut)

25 posted on 03/02/2003 11:43:05 AM PST by El Gato
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To: Kev-Head
I have wondered if we are closing in on the main terrorist cells in the US and Saddam is tring to bait us into starting the war so he can use them before they are caught. Use it or lose it.
26 posted on 03/02/2003 11:48:42 AM PST by Diana Rose (I hate all things french)
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To: onedoug
We should state the obvious, and stage from Israel.

Nah, it's more preferable to keep a close eye on these rag-headed mental midgets.

27 posted on 03/02/2003 11:57:10 AM PST by Caipirabob (Democrats.. Socialists..Commies..Traitors...Who can tell the difference?)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Wonder how many Mig 25's they've got ?

I don't know how many they've currently got but, if they keep doing crap like this, they'll certainly have 1 less than they do now. :=)

28 posted on 03/02/2003 11:57:50 AM PST by Bob
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To: El Gato
70,000 feet? What's the F-15s ceiling?
29 posted on 03/02/2003 12:00:04 PM PST by RoughDobermann
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To: El Gato
Sorry, just being lazy. F-15 has a ceiling of 65,000 feet.
30 posted on 03/02/2003 12:01:40 PM PST by RoughDobermann
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To: ruiner
According to an earlier post, they've been doing this for two weeks. I'm very concerned about my friends over there.
31 posted on 03/02/2003 12:21:25 PM PST by Beck_isright (going to war without the French is like duck hunting without an accordian)
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To: nomorecameljocks
Please, please do not remind me. I was in Southern Iraq in 91 and watched the choppers buzz around. It was sickening. We all looked at each other and said what dumb (expletive deleted numerous times) allowed this?
32 posted on 03/02/2003 12:22:45 PM PST by Beck_isright (going to war without the French is like duck hunting without an accordian)
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Any idea if we are going tonight?
33 posted on 03/02/2003 1:19:10 PM PST by Diana Rose (I hate all things french)
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To: Dog Gone
I believe this is a different incident...or are you refering to the fact that this is NOT in Breaking News?
34 posted on 03/02/2003 3:19:51 PM PST by craig_eddy
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To: craig_eddy
Never mind...I should read closer...my bad: same incident but more clarification.
35 posted on 03/02/2003 3:20:43 PM PST by craig_eddy
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To: craig_eddy
It was in Breaking News at the time I made my comment. I didn't complain to the mods, because it was an interesting article, but putting more information about an old incident in Breaking News isn't an editorial decision I would make.
36 posted on 03/02/2003 3:36:26 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Kev-Head
face down
37 posted on 03/02/2003 4:56:33 PM PST by SMEDLEYBUTLER
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