Why Does the Left Hate Israel?

www.chronwatch.com ^ | 2/21/03 | Cinnamon Stillwell

[dennisw]

Several homes which Israel claims belonged to militants were destroyed. Excellent!!!

So much for trial by jury, just compensation, and the rest of the common human rights. Why are we subsidizing a police state?

These Palestinian scum murdered Jews. Instead of killing his family Israel killed their house. Leveled it. The Jews lost people and the Arabs lost a house or two. Boo freakin' hoo.

[SteveH]

You are spewing slogans and propaganda from the Hamas machine

Sorry, I've never paid attention to them.

Why does Israel deserve $3B/year of USA tax dollars? They have enough apaches and nukes already. And they can make and sell their own assault rifles and fighters.

Clearly you have issues with anyone who dares approach Israeli government policy with a critical perspective. You can't separate criticism of government policy from your emotional screening. Best of luck to you.

[SteveH]

Boo freakin' hoo.

So much for due process of law. Police state, fed by welfare courtesy USG to $3B/year. No thanks.

[dennisw]

There is the slight matter of curfews, lack of trials, checkpoints, property confiscation without compensation, and so on. Yes, the Palestinians are alive. No, the Israeli government has not guaranteed common human rights. 

Palestinians have forfeited some of their rights by going on a spree of Jew killing. By making war against Israel. Outrages such as suicide bombings. You live in fantasy land if you think the Jews won't institute a clampdown to minimize such terrorism

lack of trials, 

That's a lie. Pallies get trials all the time. Go search google for Marwan Bargouti

Defund them.

I'm happy to see some of my taxes go to Israel to defend against the Muslims. So are many other Americans

[dennisw]

So much for due process of law. 

Moron. When you make war against the United States, Israel or any other nation you are a combatant and get dealt with differently.

Police state, 

You are a liar. Israel is not  a police state. But many Arab nations are

fed by welfare courtesy USG to $3B/year. No thanks.

So we help the Israelis defend themselves against the Jihadists. Sounds OK to me.

[Alouette]

Clearly you have issues with anyone who dares approach Israeli government policy with a critical perspective.

I haven't seen any coherent criticism of Israeli government policy from you in this entire thread. Just hysterical shrieks of Apartheid! Genocide! and personal attacks on everyone who disagrees with you.

[SteveH]

Moron.

People who have something useful to say do not need to say it with insults. Apparently you belong to a different category.

When you make war against the United States, Israel or any other nation you are a combatant and get dealt with differently.

Oh yeah, because might makes right? Or we are anointed or something? Sheesh. Talk about religious fanatacism.

You are a liar. Israel is not a police state.

You just stated homes were leveled as punishment. Did they or did they not have jury trials? No jury trials -> police state. Defund them.

But many Arab nations are

This keeps coming up. Two wrongs do not make a right. It is no excuse for not agreeing to fundamental human rights.

So we help the Israelis defend themselves against the Jihadists. Sounds OK to me.

Sounds like more than just some Arabs are on a Jihad, to me. And what about Washington's warning of entangling alliances? Apparently that does *not* sound OK to you.

[SteveH]

I haven't seen any coherent criticism of Israeli government policy from you in this entire thread.

Then let us agree that the US should not enter into entangling alliances. Can you agree to that?

[SteveH]

Or is the notion of avoiding entangling alliances just another example of my "hysterical shrieking" in your estimation?

BTW I don't have a hystera so I am physically not capable of getting hysterical :-).

[EGPWS]

Self-sufficient? What proof do you have of this...do they not receive aid from us? I think you better do some research on the billions of dollars of American aid that comes from our country. By the way,IMHO I think it's money well spent.

OK granted. Let me go with they are 100% capable of going it alone and would do a fine job of it. He!!, I could most likely count on my fingers the number of countries that don't get aid from us in one way or another.
It works both ways, we aren't throwing money at them and watching it go into a bottomless pit. They have, in the past, done a fine job of coming up with some superb ideas for our upgrading of military aircraft because of their experience with them in the field. Also I work for a 15 Billion/yr company that bought IAI, and believe me they build a fine business aircraft. At least with them it is beneficial in both directions, which is why they are an ally.

[DianeDePoitiers]

I agree. The left has a tradition of anti-Semitism going back to the 19th century. They accepted the anti-Semitic canard that the Jews, through their money-making activities, were reponsible for capitalism and its attendant "abuses." You only need to look at leftist literature at the time of the revolutions of 1848 to see the blatant anti-Semitism. Karl Marx himself wrote an essay on "the Jewish problem."

[dennisw]

You are a simple minded anti-Semite who demands that Jews not fight back against those who murder them. You demand Israelis to submit to the Islamics. Your absurd demands are the same as those of the terrorists.

[dennisw]

You leftists really show your true colors when you make common cause with the barbaric Jihadists of Islam. Islam is the only religion that gets the commie stamp of approval. Curious is it not?

[Stultis]

Arafat has outlasted his opponents by decades, and kneecaps anyone who dares oppose him

If they're lucky. If they're not so lucky they're beaten, lynched (or shot) and then (the corspe is) hung by the feet in the city square and eviscerated. It's not even necessary to "oppose" Arafat to receive this treatment. If you're a Palestinian businessman and don't keep up your payments to the local Tanzim/Fatah/etc thugs, or if one of the local thugs or a Palestinian Authority official decides to steal your business, you might be labeled as a "collaborator" and get the same treatment.

Palestinian "collaborators" (a couple among many dozens, maybe hundreds by this time):

This women, Ikhlas Khouli, a 53 year old mother of seven, was beaten then shot as a "collaborator," one among many women both young and old that have recieved this treatment.

Her bullet ridden body was then dumped in the street. Her eldest son provided the "evidence" against her, after he was beaten, whipped and tortured by the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, a terrorist militia loyal to Terrorfat. More info here.

Please note, iamnotaradical, that this little sample is the merest tip of a great iceberg.

[SJackson]

but I’m not aware of any treaty Israel has signed obligating her unilaterally to either abandon or cease construction of settlements

That’s because there aren’t any (the treaty with Egypt excepted). You were wrong.

I am not an expert at all the negotiations that had taken place (who is?) but it was at least my impression from news reports that there was a treaty signed which had a widespread expectation that Israel was at a minimum to stop the settlements, which were a major if not the primary sticking point at a point in time (before the assassination of one of the Israeli leaders).

See my last answer, fiction.

Things seemed to go downhill once the settlement-making resumed. One can say that the treaty was broken by terrorism but at least it was my impression that the particular terrorism at the time was not state-sponsored (or Arafat-sponsored, or whatever).

Amazing. You acknowledge there was no treaty, then blame Israel for violating a non-existant treaty. The biggest settlement Arafat wants to get rid of is Tel Aviv. Hamas says they can go back to Eastern Europe where they came from.

I thought there was a general concensus on halting further settlements. At some point the progress ceased, leading to (ok--- my impression) more settlements, and then cascading, anarchy within the ranks of the Palestinian police.

Been there, done that.

The common expectation as I recall was the ceasing of new settlements. But the more general principle was a common expectation as I recall of the restoration of rights for all citizens. Don't have that? Forget peace.

The only “right” arab citizens of Israel are missing is the obligation to serve in the IDF. Lots enlist anyway. They own property, businesses, vote, and have representation in the Knesset.

Need restoration of rights as a prelude, or else you don't have squat.

What rights? Been there.

If the Israeli government is in power, only the Israeli government is in place to provide that. If they don't want to, then fine-- CUT OFF FUNDING. Why are we funding them anyway?

Because it was important to American foreign policy not the have the armies of Egypt and Syria destroyed in 1967 and 1973. They’re our friends. It was also important to America to see Israel leave Lebanon, as a favor to Syria.

I do not perceive that. I think there have been families waiting since 1947 for compensation for their homes taken at that time by the Israelis.

That was dealt with in 1953-54. They can sue, they can’t blow up civilians. It’s not nice.

I am referring to the accords in which the Palestinians were granted their own police (whatever it was named; sorry). My hope was that that could have continued. It seems as if it was undermined by belligerents within both camps.

It was undermined by the fact that they were terrorists, killing Israelis and Palestinians. No one disputes that.

Which means something happened after 1945. For 5 points, what could be the something that happened? If anything this proves that Arabs have the capability not to be inherently anti-Jew, as many have asserted.

Sure did, they threw all the Jew *astards out of their countries and confiscated their property. You’re right, shows me they’re not Jewhaters.

There is the slight matter of curfews, lack of trials, checkpoints, property confiscation without compensation, and so on. Yes, the Palestinians are alive. No, the Israeli government has not guaranteed common human rights. Defund them.

Nonsense. Before Arafat and Oslo emerged on the scene they had the highest standard of living in the Arab world. Rather than developing democratic political institutions they embraced Arafat and the destruction of Israel as their goal.

And what about Washington's warning of entangling alliances? Apparently that does *not* sound OK to you.

I won’t resond yet. Clearly you’ve never read Washington’s address. Go and read it. Read about the insulation our oceans provide us (gone by Monroe’s time, thus the doctrine). Particularly read his comments about America’s obligation to honor current commitments. Washington would clearly have taken Israel’s side.

[SJackson]

Good links, you should post them, I don't think either has been posted here.

[SteveH]

You leftists really show your true colors when you make common cause with the barbaric Jihadists of Islam...

So having one opinion in common, that of equal rights for all, is the true mark of a barbaric Jihadist? Rant ON, Dennisw! Your projection of guilt by association makes my point that so many confuse criticism of government policy with racism in an emotional whipped up frenzy.

Equal rights for all.

(Your turn to rant rant!!)

[SteveH]

You are a simple minded anti-Semite

As I have said before, you are a person who can't make a cogent argument and substitutes name calling in its place. (If you knew me, BTW, that's the ultimate insult to you.)