eBay Auction Fraud Spawns Vigilantism Trend. Bidders join to report fraud to law enforcement

auction bytes ^ | December 26, 2002 | Ina Steiner

[MissBaby]

eBay Auction Fraud Spawns Vigilantism Trend
By Ina Steiner
October 12, 2002
Vigilante: One who takes or advocates the taking of law enforcement into one's own hands

A new trend has emerged in online auctions: vigilantism. People are banding together to report auction fraud and are coordinating their efforts in contacting law enforcement officials.

Our story begins with Mark, the high bidder on an auction for a Toshiba Protege 2000 laptop computer on eBay. On August 10, 2002, Mark says he sent a cashier's check for $1,485 to eBay seller Tech-Surplus.

By September 1, after corresponding with the seller several times, Mark became concerned that he would never see his computer. He emailed other winning bidders to see if they had received their items from the seller. According to several buyers, it quickly became apparent that something was wrong – no one had yet received their computers.

Karen Christian replied to Mark that evening and volunteered to create a Web site to publish information about the seller, whom they worried was operating in bad faith. Karen had also purchased a laptop computer from Tech-Surplus on August 15 and had not yet received it.

Karen, with Mark's encouragement, set up a site on GeoCities and later moved it to http://www.techsurplusvictim.com. The job of Vigilante was full-time for Karen as she built the site. Another victim, Cory, set up a mailing list on Yahoo Groups so victims could keep in touch with each other. The list quickly grew to 83 members.

[MissBaby]

ebay has gotten really bad at stopping the obvious scam companies even when people repeatedly complain. Really bad when ebay with the power to stop a bunch of people from getting ripped off does not take action.

Worse is their claims that they provide insurance against fraud. The don't unless you want to wade through a very, very cumbersome process. That process usually ends in a denial of the claim and you have to be really persistant.

[MissBaby]

Oops. I forgot to note the article is an an except. The rest of article Here Sorry.

[Maedhros]

ping

[babylonian]

I am a full time ebay seller, and I can tell you this: Ebayers want their merchandise as fast as they want their burgers and fries. Right now! Like you're supposed to drop everything you're doing and RUSH to ship their stuff!
Nobody's patient anymore.

[Jason Kauppinen]

"Vigilante: One who takes or advocates the taking of law enforcement into one's own hands

A new trend has emerged in online auctions: vigilantism. People are banding together to report auction fraud and are coordinating their efforts in contacting law enforcement officials."

So clearly the trend does not fit the definition of "vigilante". They're only coordinating their efforts to contact the police.

Maybe this author thinks that Neighbourhood Watch programs are vigilante as well....

[Reaganwuzthebest]

So far I've had no problems purchasing mostly cds and videos on ebay, I stick to buying only from those who have a solid track record, even though that's still no guarantee. But if there's even a few negative feedback replies, I don't bother with them.

[RobRoy]

I've never actually bought anything there. I don't trust mail order much and have even gotten burned by a reputable company once. I check there a lot and noticed one seller had a star suggesting a lot of positive feedback. When I read it, it was ALL about him as a BUYER. No responses about his qualities as a seller. Maybe each person needs a "seller" comments star and "buyers" comments star.

Anyway, I don't trust paypal either (based on threads on FreeRepublic) so I just window shop EBAY.

[strela]

I am a full time ebay seller, and I can tell you this: Ebayers want their merchandise as fast as they want their burgers and fries. Right now! Like you're supposed to drop everything you're doing and RUSH to ship their stuff!

I would imagine that most buyers want their stuff just about as quickly as you and other sellers charge their credit card for their ordered merchandise. Isn't your providing the fastest possible order fulfillment for your customers part of the deal?

If I had ordered something from you, I too would appreciate a little bit of a soupcon of a sense of urgency on your part to get the merchandise I bought and paid for to me.

(And yes, I have been burned by 3 EBay sellers in the past, one a "full-time" EBayer whom I had to have my attorney threaten to sue to get my merchandise. The obscenity-filled little love letter she included with the order was very much appreciated and was duly passed onto the landshark).

[ChadsDad]

I sell and buy regularly on ebay. Never had a problem. From buying cheap stuff (like a fountain for the pool for 29.95 or a $10 memory card reader) to selling cars and motorcycles. I even sold a 68 barracuda to a bidder in another country (Nova Scotia). It went smooth as silk!

I also use paypal, and have yet to have any negative issues.

[strela]

re my previous post, that is "2", not "3" EBay sellers with whom I couldn't come to a meeting of the minds. And to be completely fair, I've had hundreds of transactions that went off without a hitch, both buyin' and sellin'.

[Hodar]

Yes, people do want their items RUSHed. What's the problem with that? The seller wants payments RUSHed, or PayPal for immediate deposit, why should the buyer wait? Heck, I pay a premium in S&H to get the items shipped immedaitely. You wouldn't put up with waiting at a Department Store, after paying in good faith. When I pay, I demand the item to be shipped within 24 hours. If that's not 'convenient' for you, I would suggest that you warn potential customers before they bid.

[RobRoy]

Yeah, there were a lot of posts like yours on the last paypal thread.

For me, it's mostly the hassle. If I am going to buy something, I want to see it, try it on, whatever. Then, if I don't like it, I either don't buy it or I return it to the store. Buying and selling is not something I do as a hobby - it is what I do to aquire stuff I want or need, or a way to make extra money. For me, that means the store (to buy) or a pawn shop (to sell). I may not get top dollar, but it takes me 10 minutes and I'm on to real life.

I do go to Oregon to buy expensive stuff (no sales tax). I used mail order to buy my bass speaker (acmebass.com) but it was the one I HAD TO HAVE so I was sort of stuck. The only thing that has made me want to use ebay was when they were auctioning off all the gear from my favorite band Genesis.

Although it doesn't float my boat, I DO think ebay is probably the wave of the future. I consider ALL shopping a hassle and will spend money to make it simpler, so mail order (or ebay) is a last resort for me, if I can find something somewhere where I can see it, touch it or try it on before I buy.

[martin_fierro]

I haven't experiences blatant fraud on Ebay (yet).

But I have to wonder how much "shill bidding" goes on to drive up bid prices. If Ebay is unwilling to prosecute even obvious fraud, I doubt it seriously monitors such bidding.

[cmsgop]

I got burned a couple of times. All together about $20. I would never make a big purchase on Ebay Ever!!!

I did make their lives a Living Hell though for a short period of time (hehe).

[babylonian]

I promise shipment within 72 hours of payment. Daily trips to the post office is a real drag. This eats up work time. I cluster my auctions, posting them only one day per week. This means 50 or 60 auctions expiring at the same time. By waiting to ship on the third day after the auctions, I have a decent number of paid customers to justify a trip to the PO. Otherwise, I'd be standing in line every day at the PO with only a few packages each day. What a waste of time. Still, I have 1200 positive, glowing feedbacks, and no negatives. And every one of my customers gets their merchandise, including the approximately three dozen or so which are "lost" in the mail, annually. I have to eat those situations, and ship more merchandise again, at my own expense.

[traditional1]

drop everything you're doing and RUSH to ship their stuff! Nobody's patient anymore.

Sellers don't hesitate or dilly-dally on accepting payment from the buyers, though, do they????

I've never had a seller tell me "that's okay, let me ship you the goods and just send the payment whenever you have a chance to do so".

[Jhoffa_]

The last guy who tried to rip me off (over a computer BTW) was foolish enough to give me his address and directions to his house (because I was going to pick it up initally) before changing his mind and deciding to cheat me.

Some people are just too stupid to be crooks.

[UnsinkableMollyBrown]

I love Ebay and Paypal. Two weeks ago I sold a book for $400, and the transaction went off without a hitch. As a seller, a offer a money back guarantee, so you can hold the merchandise in your hands, and if you're not happy, ship it back. I even pay shipping both ways. And Paypal, I can't say enough about their service. I was short on cash last week, and not all the Christmas shopping was done. All my auctions closed Saturday morning, half the buyers paid right away via Paypal, and I was in the stores by noon using my Paypal Credit Card. Lot's of Fun!!

[martin_fierro]

Yeah, I like PayPal too -- so far.

Some folks have vaguely told me of "problems" they've heard with it, but, heck, I'm even wondering if I can use it PayPal to pay my rent if I need to at the last minute.

[nothingnew]

I've never had a seller tell me "that's okay, let me ship you the goods and just send the payment whenever you have a chance to do so".

The only one I know of is Roy Masters at FHU.com

Ya gotta be into what he what he believes.

I don't think it would go over big here, but he's shown me a few things.

FMCDH