[Diddle E. Squat]

So much for the liberal utopian's dream of vanquishing the auto with the Segway.

[ijcr]

Lawmakers determined to clean up San Francisco are taking on the homeless who use the streets of one America's top tourist destinations as a public toilet.

Residents were surprised to learn that no ban exists on urinating and defecating in the streets.

An estimated 12,000 homeless people live in the city and police have until now had little success in preventing them from relieving themselves on the sidewalks.

Until now police have sought to prosecute offenders under anti-waste dumping laws but judges threw out most of the 1,100 citations issued to the homeless in 2000, ruling the laws applied to garbage, not to human waste.


Imagine the lawsuits if a Segway rider spun out in a pile of homeless droppings. Or the braking problems after whizzing thru a pool of yellow fluid. San Fransisco has made the right decision,it is for the children.

[Objective Reality]

While I'm no fan of anything SF does, I will go on-record as saying the Segway is a really bad idea, at least with regard to sidewalks.

Consider this. Here's the spec sheet on what seems to be the baseline model: http://www.segway.com/segway/specs_iseries.html

Top speed, 12.5 mph. Base weight, 83 pounds. Now, I go about 170 - 172 pounds, so combined, with me riding the thing at top speed, we have about 255 pounds traveling 12.5 miles per hour on a sidewalk.

So if I recall correctly from high school physics that Force = Mass x (Velocity squared), and convert the values to metric to do an actual mass calculation, we wind up with:

255 pounds = 116 kg
12.5 miles per hour = 20 kph

So we wind up with Force = 116 * (20 squared) = 46400 Newtons, I think. What does that equal? A sledgehammer swung full-strength by a lumberjack?

So what's going to happen the first time a yuppie answering a cell phone, getting distracted, impacts a pedestrian from behind at full speed? Look at the design of the thing - it's either going to smack them with that handlebar point somewhere in the region of the shoulder blades, easily snapping their spine or crushing their shoulder, and likely causing an impact arrythmia of the heart similar to what kids sometimes get from a fastball to the chest. Or, if the pedestrians somewhat more "lucky," it'll just clip them with the lower portion at around the region of the ankle-to-shin, leaving them with a probably fatal compound fracture.

I think this is a very likely scenario. How many times in the course of, say, a week, do you almost run smack-dab into someone else walking full speed, while rounding a corner, or because either of you were distracted? I know, usually you don't actually run into them, but only because your body is able to react in all manner of incredible ways to dodge the impact - and even then, ONLY if either or both of you actually look up and notice in time. So think about the amount of time, however miniscule, it takes to transmit, via leaning or whatever, your intention to this machine. What is it? A millionth of a second? Doubtful - probably at least 1/10th, and even then only if you're expert at it. More than enough time to leave a pedestrian a broken heap.

I expect at least $3000 of the asking price is for liability insurance alone. I won't ride the things, and don't think I'll feel too safe sharing the sidewalks with them.

[joesnuffy]

Its too bad Gary Larson is retired
He coulda had fun with a segeway cartoon

[mfulstone]

Nice piece of leftist bullcrap!

I have COPD*. I can't walk 50 yards without stopping for a breather. A Segway would increase my mobility and actually cause me to get more exercise.

We have to stop this kind of stupid legislation

*My COPD was caused by a double lungfull of Chlorine gas in 1994. (In January, 1993, I could run one and a half miles and finish the last 1/4 mile in a sprint - I was 53 years old then.)

[martin_fierro]

San Francisco supervisors today banned the use of the Segway Scooter on city sidewalks, agreeing with senior advocates that the new technology poses a threat to the old, the young, and the disabled.

Public urination, however, continues to be readily accepted.

[Revolting cat!]

It's all academic, methinks. There is nothing to ban and there won't be for a while. Who's gonna ride 'em $5K (plus steep California sales tax) things? The unemployed dotcommers from South of Market? Leather queens from the same area? Winoes, also from the same part of town? Odd, the skateboarders and bicycle messengers have been more of a menace, but hey, bitching about them that don't get ya on the 6 o'clock news!

[IronJack]

What? Something new? Find a way to regulate it, ban it, or tax it!

[Ditter]

Up to 17 MPH on the sidewalk seems dangerously fast to me & 17 MPH in the street is too slow. I think they would be fun to ride. I hope I get to try one.

[TXnMA]

nhoward14: "The problem I see with the Segway is the speed. 17 mph is more than 5 times the normal walking speed of humans. ...I put Segways in a similar class to the bicycle."

Objective Reality: "I will go on-record as saying the Segway is a really bad idea, at least with regard to sidewalks.
So we wind up with Force = 116 * (20 squared) = 46400 Newtons, I think. What does that equal? A sledgehammer swung full-strength by a lumberjack?"

B Knotts: "We're going to have to rethink cities!"

---------------------------------------------------------

IF the Segway and other 'personal transporters' become prevalent, we will face a need to accommodate the class of transportation whose speed and mass falls between that of the auto and the pedestrian.

So, "We're going to have to rethink cities!"

But -- it has already been done!

Over twenty-five years ago, Taipei, Taiwan, established special travel lanes for the 'personal transport' class of vehicles, such as bicycles, motorized bikes, mopeds, etc. The rightmost (closest to the curb) lane in the street is striped off, clearly marked (with white diamonds) and is strictly reserved for 'bike/Segway class' of vehicles. IIRC, the lane (which is deliberately made too narrow for an auto) is called (pardon my poor phonetics here) something like "Matsu-Dao".

In the small photo above, you can see what would be the 'Segway lane' just to the right of the curb. (BTW, Taiwan traffic drives on the right, just as we do here in the U.S.)

TXnMA (No Longer!!!)

[glc1173@aol.com]

Who'd buy a Segway for $5,000 anyhow - when you can buy a cheap used (or even new) moped) that will get you around at least as fast for 1/10 of that?

[gueroloco]

They forgot to mention their concern for the safety of their maggot infested bums who express their appreciation for the "homeless" checks by defecating/urinating/vomiting all over the sidewalks. Yup, ban the Segway while placating human filth. The San Francisco Way!

[BunnySlippers]

I'm in L.A. but my friend in Santa Monica bought one ... they are banned on the sidewalk (which is where Segway wants them) but okay on the street. Another problem ... where do you park them? Do you chain them to a post so that someone can't lift it onto another vehicle? They do start with a key but that is no guarantee against theft as anyone can tell you who has had a car stolen.

[GSWarrior]

Skateboards and bicycles are not allowed on sidewalks in SF. I don't see why Segways should be allowed.

[boris]

This shyster lawyer had a site up many months before Segway became available. He wants folks to sign up for a class-action suit against "IT" aka Segway aka "Ginger".

Me, I think it's a cool idea. I'd buy one for $300. Not for three grand plus.

--Boris

[CounterCounterCulture]

In the spirit of the "SKATEBOARDING IS NOT A CRIME" bumper stickers that permeate this region, the first "SEGWAY SCOOTING IS NOT A CRIME" can't be far behind.

[gracie1]

This in a city where the messenger bicycles of choice have no brakes and big hills.

[Tony in Hawaii]

Nearly a hundred responses and not one South Park reference.