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Canadian Soldiers fired before pilots bombed
Canada.com ^ | November 26 2002 | ALISON AULD

Posted on 11/26/2002 3:40:53 PM PST by knighthawk

HALIFAX -- Newly obtained evidence shows that Canadian soldiers involved in the friendly-fire incident in Afghanistan were firing their weapons into the air at the time of the tragedy.

Transcripts of testimony by two Canadian soldiers who survived the bombing last April indicate they aimed their weapons skyward as part of their night-training exercises near the Kandahar air base.

That fire was seen by the two American pilots who were flying overhead and misinterpreted the blasts as an enemy attack. Four died and eight were seriously injured in the bombing.

In testimony to a board of inquiry, Sgt. Lorne Ford of the Princess Patricia Canadian Light Infantry said there were definitely shots fired into the air from one position as he and his colleagues conducted live-fire exercises.

"There would have been rounds, like a short burst going into the air to begin with," Ford, who sustained wounds to his leg and eye, said in a statement to a joint Canadian-American board of inquiry.

"I don't know the degree of the angle, but it would have gone into the sky."

A transcript of the statement, as well as that of Cpl. Rene Paquette, was obtained by The Canadian Press.

Paquette also testified to the board, which produced a final report into the incident, that he fired rounds into the air as part of the late-night mission.

Paquette said he and another soldier were instructed to fire, but that only he had authorization to do so.

"So it was up to me and I fired two or three short bursts at the target. It was almost directly up," Paquette told the Canadian and American board members.

"And that was actually the only rounds that were aimed at an upward angle."

The testimony is not referred to in reports released publicly by American and Canadian officials investigating the tragedy.

The two soldiers said there was a near-steady stream of fire during the moonless night, as they moved from one position atop a hill to another.

The fire produced bright flashes either through ricochets or tracers from the weapons. Ford testified that the rounds could produce red and white sparks.

Paquette also testified that there was a "steady stream of tracer fire."

Overhead, American pilot Maj. Harry Schmidt was telling his lead pilot Maj. William Umbach that he was seeing flashes on the ground. Schmidt then requested permission to attack the target, but was reminded by Umbach that they should ensure they weren't friendly forces.

Schmidt was ordered to hold fire, but four minutes after seeing the ground fire he invoked self-defence and dropped a 225-kilogram laser-guided bomb on the soldiers.

In his testimony, Ford described hearing the "screaming of what I was pretty much sure was a bomb being launched."

He was thrown to his right, while Paquette said he saw a brilliant flash and was then "jack-knifed in the air."

The newly available testimony has led defence lawyers for the two American pilots to raise doubts about the culpability of their clients - and about the conduct of two boards of inquiry.

The two reports placed almost all the blame on the pilots, finding they breached protocol and acted rashly in dropping the bomb without first retreating to assess the situation.

"When you just go out to fix the blame like this board did, you don't get all the facts," Dave Beck, Umbach's lawyer, said from his office in Knoxville, Tenn. "This information was not in the reports."

Beck and Schmidt's lawyer, Charles Gittins, had asked that a new board be struck to examine the evidence after claiming that the first American board was biased and prejudicial to their clients. Their request was denied.

Gittins says much of the information that is trickling out, but which is not in the reports, will be presented when the pilots appear before a so-called Article 32 hearing in January.

The procedure, much like a grand jury hearing, will determine whether there is enough evidence to proceed to a court martial.

The pilots could each face 64 years in prison if convicted of the involuntary manslaughter, dereliction of duty and assault charges that have been recommended.

The reports also did not include the fact that a sentry had issued an order to the Canadians to stop firing while a plane either landed or took off from the nearby Kandahar Airport.

The order was either lost or scrambled.

Gittins argues that had the Canadians responded, the accident might have been prevented.

"The Canadian and American reports both ignore this testimony from a witness who was far away from the bomb impact and who actually was giving the order," Gittins said. "Amazing, but unconscionable to omit this reference."

Retired general Lewis MacKenzie agrees, saying the material should have been included in the reports if only to eliminate any perceptions that information was being concealed.

MacKenzie, who has been involved in several boards of inquiry, dismissed the threat the Canadians could have posed to the pilots from their location and armed with the type of weapons they were using to practise.

"When you're at 10,000 feet you don't really have to worry about a weapons system that has a capability of going out a few thousand metres getting anywhere close to you," MacKenzie said in an interview from Toronto.

"I don't think it's terribly significant. But if it was known and it was not included then I think that's an oversight. That's a mistake."

The Department of National Defence did not return calls about the issue.


TOPICS: Canada; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: afghanistan; bombed; canadiansoldiers; friendlyfire
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1 posted on 11/26/2002 3:40:53 PM PST by knighthawk
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To: MizSterious; rebdov; Nix 2; green lantern; BeOSUser; Brad's Gramma; dreadme; keri; Turk2; ...
Ping
2 posted on 11/26/2002 3:41:23 PM PST by knighthawk
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To: knighthawk
Too bad this postcript won't receive the attention that the tragedy originally did.
3 posted on 11/26/2002 3:45:16 PM PST by skeeter
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To: knighthawk
Gotta love our boys.

They see some tracers, they drop a laser-guided bomb on their heads.

They should be applauded for doing their jobs, no matter that it was a bunch of stupic canucks shooting rounds into the sky.

4 posted on 11/26/2002 3:45:41 PM PST by BuddhaBoy
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To: knighthawk
Talk about last minute training! Training in Afghanistan? Why were they shooting rifles in the air? Was it their first time shooting or something? Good heavans! I remember reading that they took a late boat out there. I'm sorry: I will take this moment to express my sympathies to the Canadian soldiers and their families. But good heavans. Shooting up in the air is kindergarten stuff, as best I can figure. Were they testing the rifles? Getting used to the sound? I am puzzled.
5 posted on 11/26/2002 3:50:13 PM PST by Arthur Wildfire! March
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March
I'm with you. Training in a combat area, at night, firing weapons skyward while jets are overhead (you can hear those jets), in an area where you know the only jets are on your side and are armed.

NO. I am not blaming the dead troopers. But the man who gave them their orders started a tragedy of errors.

I am grateful for Canadian support in the war in Afghanistan. Thanks, Canada.

6 posted on 11/26/2002 3:58:09 PM PST by LibKill
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To: skeeter
Canada's prime minister, isn't he the guy who keeps making juvenile insults about GW? If they need to shoot rifles in the air as training exercizes in a war zone, they are nothing but trouble anyway. Unless I'm mistaken, only the most tribalistic and primitive of soldiers waste their ammo that way anyhow, usually as an act of bravado.
7 posted on 11/26/2002 3:59:51 PM PST by Arthur Wildfire! March
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To: knighthawk
BTTT
8 posted on 11/26/2002 4:02:09 PM PST by facedown
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To: LibKill
NO. I am not blaming the dead troopers. But the man who gave them their orders started a tragedy of errors.

I'm not blaming them either. But I wonder how much liberal leadership has to do with such poor training prior to entering a war zone? It's like when, under FDR's New Deal, we had soldiers training with wooden guns. Not the soldiers' fault. But being skimpy with ammo beforehand, perhaps they needed to get used to the noise of a gun? I would not dare to say 'set up' here.

9 posted on 11/26/2002 4:03:05 PM PST by Arthur Wildfire! March
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To: knighthawk

10 posted on 11/26/2002 4:03:20 PM PST by inkling
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To: knighthawk
Case dismissed.
11 posted on 11/26/2002 4:09:57 PM PST by mgstarr
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To: BuddhaBoy
you are a moron.
12 posted on 11/26/2002 4:10:43 PM PST by albertabound
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To: LibKill
The point is that the Canadian soldiers are stepping up for the pilots.
13 posted on 11/26/2002 4:13:18 PM PST by albertabound
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March
Canada's prime minister, isn't he the guy who keeps making juvenile insults about GW? If they need to shoot rifles in the air as training exercizes in a war zone, they are nothing but trouble anyway. Unless I'm mistaken, only the most tribalistic and primitive of soldiers waste their ammo that way anyhow, usually as an act of bravado.

quite frankly, I'm tired of hearing anything, from, about, or who, in Canada has anything to say about the United States. Those people should just shut up and stay out of the way. They piss, moan, and whine about everything. It's a chronic disease in that snow-bound land of socialism.

Just go away. Do us a favor and import your friend Bill Clinton.

14 posted on 11/26/2002 4:14:09 PM PST by Cobra64
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March; LibKill
There are some techniques for engaging reverse-slope targets that require the shooters to fire at a fairly high angle above the ground. The area was posted as a training area well in advance.

The aircrew still gets the blame--they were well above the danger zone, they KNEW they were above the danger zone, they ignored a "weapons hold order" from the AWACS, they ignored the Air Tasking Order, and generally had a severe case of incontinent ordnance.
15 posted on 11/26/2002 4:14:32 PM PST by Poohbah
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To: Arthur Wildfire! March
Combat Veterans' Poll

My service was in peacetime, but it struck me from the beginning of this affair that it was very odd that they would be doing night-time live-fire training in a combat area. Sees to me stupid with a capital S. Has anyone ever heard of US forces going on a night live-fire exercise in a combat area. This is so bizarre. Comments please...

16 posted on 11/26/2002 4:21:40 PM PST by cookcounty
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To: Poohbah
The Canadians also didn't get orders not to shoot. Weren't our pilots shot at near the air bases before? There is no safe haven out there. Seeing tracer fire could be an indication that hostile forces are about to send something worse, don't you think? I would say this was a terrible tragedy that can't be pinned on any one person. As for shooting up in the air, using your rifle like a howitzer, I have trouble understanding the tactics behind that.
17 posted on 11/26/2002 4:22:58 PM PST by Arthur Wildfire! March
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To: cookcounty
This area was used by all the troops to practice live fire missions, including Americans.
18 posted on 11/26/2002 4:26:57 PM PST by albertabound
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To: cookcounty
This area was used by all the troops to practice live fire missions, including Americans.
19 posted on 11/26/2002 4:27:18 PM PST by albertabound
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To: cookcounty
The Benefits of "Unilateralism."

The more countries you have involved, the more "friendly fire" tragedies are likely to occur.

Different languages, different codes, different standard procedures, different communications channels, more communications nodes = dead friendlies.

20 posted on 11/26/2002 4:27:34 PM PST by cookcounty
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