Posted on 11/18/2002 7:26:58 AM PST by Jack Black
Well, that's true, Roscoe. Society has no rights."None that your cult will respect..."
You have a real problem with word meanings, Roscoe.
"Libertarian" is not a religion, it's a political ideology.
"...libertarian belief that rights must be honored; that all men are equal before the law; that the law must be based upon written standards and not upon judicial fiat; that the government must not arbitrarily take powers not granted to it..."To: exodus
Oh, yes indeed, those ARE libertarian principles! :-)
And by the way, libertarian principles say that all men should, by God-given right, be free.
Slavery is against libertarian principles.
You knew that, now didn't you? :-)
LOL
To: Roscoe"...Those aren't "libertarian principles..."
"...if not libertarian principles, what system of beliefs created our rule of law?"
Okay, nopardons, maybe you can answer my question, since Roscoe can't.
If, as you claim, our nation wasn't created by a belief in libertarian principles, what principles were followed in the creation of our country?
To: All
You didn't understand the premise behind the "Free State" proposal, chuckles.
The plan is to stay a member of the United States, but to run the government of the STATE they chose according to Constitutional guidelines.
They hope that if they succeed, other State governments would follow their lead, and thus over time return our nation to it's original libertarian principles, abandoning socialism in the process.
"...(libertarians believe) that the law must be based upon written standards and not upon judicial fiat..."To: exodus
You must be talking about un-Constitutional laws that violate God-given rights.
That's not "whining," Roscoe. That's asking the courts to rule on the Constitutionality of certain laws, something that our present court system refuses to do.
Apparently, the only way a citizen can challenge the Constitutionality of a law is in the Supreme Court, and the only way to get to the Supreme Court is through the lower courts, which refuse to hear Constitutional questions because Constitutional questions are only heard in the Supreme Court.
To: VaBthang4
Your link supports my assertion that the Founders were libertarians, Roscoe.
Freedom, limited government, the rule of law, those are libertarian values, and that's the values we share with the Founders of our nation.
Further quotes from your link-
"...The libertarian goal - and the goal of America's founders - is to limit government to some clearly defined tasks. National defense, but no empire. Provide for public works, but leave the economy to the efforts of a free people. Pass laws that punish people for harming others, but otherwise leave them to their own devices.
The libertarian political program is superior to the conservative one, because it measures its goals against constant and measurable ideas - freedom, limited government, the rule of law. Conservatism is forced to defend whatever the status quo is in society, whether it's a status quo of freedom, or a status quo of tyranny.
"...The libertarian political program is superior to the conservative one, because it measures its goals against constant and measurable ideas - freedom, limited government, the rule of law. Conservatism is forced to defend whatever the status quo is in society, whether it's a status quo of freedom, or a status quo of tyranny..."
That would also explain why liberals can change society, but conservatives can't change it back.
Ever notice how our government becomes more and more socialist over time? It's because liberals get socialist laws passed, and conservatives accept those socialist laws as something that can't be changed.
Conservatives fight against socialist changes, but once the change is make, the fight is over.
To: exodus
Jefferson ASKED for a Congressional Declaration of War.
His political opponent Hamilton, a believer in a strong central government, stated that a declaration of war wasn't necessary, as the United States had been attacked.
Hamilton won the political battle, leaving Jefferson in the position of going to war without a declaration, or failing to do his duty, as Commander-in-Chief, to protect American shipping from attack.
Jefferson went to war without a Declaration of War, but he did have a resolution from Congress authorizing action against the pirates, specifically naming the nation of Tripoli as our enemy.
It would look like Somalia.
If the hardcore anarcho capitalist had their way then yes. If minarchist/objectivist got control then there would be a government with the limited functions of running courts paving roads and law enforcement.
An exception to that is the "Homeland Security (tyranny) Bill". Conservatives and neo-conservatives are supporting the unnecessary increase of government and doing the lefts' bidding.
The fact that they need 20k to move to a state means that there aren't 20k existing in any of the mentioned states. That's only 2%. Take over a state with 2%?
Sure, sure...if you build it, they will come. LOL!
"...Conservatives fight against socialist changes..."To: exodus
Only if you consider Republicans to be conservatives, CWRWinger.
I believe that there is very little difference between the two major parties; they are both advocates of socialism.
The Patriot Act, and as you said, the Homeland "Security" Bill, give evidence that my belief is justified.
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