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To: davidosborne
I am little embarrassed to say I do not own a firearm.

I just have never gone out and got one. Mostly because I do not want to register the thing.

Anyway around that legally?

What gun would you suggest for a first time buyer. I have gone shooting many times, but do not know what would be best for home protection and the principle of it all.
14 posted on 11/01/2002 10:37:13 AM PST by CyberCowboy777
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To: CyberCowboy777
I suggest you go with something that you are comfortable with.. A revolver is good for starters.. Work you way up to a 9MM or .40Cal Semi-auto.. requires a little extra training to get comfortable with... You local gun dealer can help you pick the model that is right for you..

David
18 posted on 11/01/2002 10:40:13 AM PST by davidosborne
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To: CyberCowboy777
"but do not know what would be best for home protection and the principle of it all."

If you are considering a purchase just for home protection and not for CC, you may want to consider a good, old fashioned 12 or 20 gauge shotgun.

Note to recreational shooters: check your local pumpkin patch for left-over halloween pumpkins---we got a great deal on 20 of them...taking them to the range this weekend!

21 posted on 11/01/2002 11:03:22 AM PST by aeronca
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To: CyberCowboy777
One way around the current background check requirement is to be licensed to carry a concealed handgun in some of the states, where a background check is not required.
I don't know about other states, but in Texas a CCW license holder can walk in and buy any weapon without either a background check or a waiting period.
The only other legal methods I know of are through inheritance, gift, or private transactions. And the gun control freaks - like the Brady bunch - are working on those now.
28 posted on 11/01/2002 12:34:47 PM PST by Marauder
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To: CyberCowboy777
For home defense I generally recommend a pump shotgun, ranging from 20 gage to 12 gage (depending on what recoil you can comfortably handle) loaded with bird shot and no choke. At confrontation distances, birdshot will turn whoever you tag into so much hamburger, but it has far less risk of overpenetrating (the perp, a wall, etc...) than a shotgun slug or a bullet from a rifled barrel. It is also useful as a club and makes a most intimidating sound when you shuck the pump.
For personal carry, if you are not intimately familiar with automatics and their quirks, I suggest a 5-6 shot .38 cal revolver in a J-frame. It don't get more reliable and simple than that.
In selecting a weapon, the most critical factors are reliability, robustness, ease of operation, sufficient f*ck-em-up power (there is no such animal as "knock-down power") and comfortable fit and heft.
In OWNING a firearm, the most important factors are regular use, regular maintenance, and rationally secure storage.
It is my practice to remove essential subassemblies from weapons I am not actively using and store them separate from the weapon. This is my advice to ANY gun-owners with children. ONLY the gun you are relying on for defense should be functional, and it should remain within arm's reach at all times.
Hope that helps.
36 posted on 11/01/2002 1:47:20 PM PST by demosthenes the elder
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To: CyberCowboy777
"I just have never gone out and got one. Mostly because I do not want to register the thing. Anyway around that legally?"

Yes! It is perfectly LEGAL to purchase from a non-dealer in your own state with NO record keeping or government knowledge. It is nice to have a firearms-familiar friend to help you, but not necessary. Here is what I advise you do:

First, find a range near you that rents guns (I'd guess you plan to start with a pistol) and offers courses. Rent something ordinary for the course (like a Glock). You will learn enough to get comfortable with shooting, safety, etc. I'd guess that you will want an autoo-loading pistol, and not a revolver, but don't rule anything out.

Second, go to the range and practice with different guns. Rule out the ones that feel wrong in your hand, and don't be surprised if you find that you prefer ones that are different from what you imagined. Keep an open mind.

Third, buy the one you LIKE (see below for the purchasing process.) Don't get too analytical, don't be paralyzed by the differences in expert opinions. If you stay within the good brands, you can't go wrong with the one that you that you simply think is the "nicest" or "coolest." Trust your gut, and buy the one you will practice with most, and be most proud of.

Fourth, practice and take courses. You never know when THEY decide that civilians should not be allowed to receive firearms training.

Fifth, think toward buying a rifle (like a .308, such as a military style "sport-utility rifle.") Handguns are for defending your life against crooks. Rifles are for defending your liberties against tyrants. A wise man once said that a pistol is "what you use to get back to your rifle."

Now, on the purchasing procedure. There are several ways to find guns for sale in your state. The want ads in the paper are fine, but as with any sales transaction with a stranger, be security conscious, go with a friend, and meet in a safe public place. You can also post a "wanted to buy" card at your local shooting ranges, since you know exactly what you want. You might even try to find a way to post a "WTB" at the local police station, since cops sell nice duty guns quite often.

But the best selection is on the net. Here are some of the options:

1. Go to http://www.auctionarms.com/search/search.cfm and enter your state abbreviation on keywords line.

2. Go to http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/SearchForm.asp and select your state at lower right (you will probably want to limit the search in other ways to avoid sifting through hundreds of gun parts.

3. (My favorite) Go to http://www.gunsamerica.com/search.cgi and search by state.

4. (Not many options, but one that deserves to catch on) http://the56.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl

5. Visit one of the specialty-fan sites (www.hkpro.com, www.glocktalk.com, sigforum.com, etc.) and check the for sale listings (and search the past listings to see what your desired model sold for, even contacitng the past sellers to see what they were paid.) This option will not be useful to find many in-state guns for sale, but the sites are great educational tools where you can get some advice before deciding what to buy.

Basically, if you are willing to spend $400-700, you can get a great, reliable gun. These brands are so good that "lemons" are essentially unknown among the used ones. Buy with a several day return period, or meet at your range where you can test it out or have the armorer look it over. To be perfectly legal, don't buy from someone who might be from out of state (check the license plates, and the driver's license, if you have reason to doubt.) There are lots of nearly new guns out there for sale by private sellers. They're not much cheaper than brand new, but having one unknown to the gun grabbers may prove to be priceless.

To determine if you are getting a decent price, search all of gunsamerica or another site for that model (not limited by state) and you will get a rough feel for market prices. Don't worry about getting a great deal, just get a fair deal. (When you get more expertise, you may be better able to spot the great deals, but that's not what you're looking for at this stage.)

I applaud your incliniation to buy without getting on the government confiscation registry. Every time a formerly-"registered" gun is bought this way, our prospects of maintaining our liberties increases, as one fewer gun is available for ready confiscation. As long as our government faces the reality that vast numbers of firearms ("liberty's teeth") are in unknown hands, they will have some restraint, and not dare try.

If you can't find a "mentor" to help you through this process, email me, and I will help off line. We're all in this together.

I also advise you buy a great book to tell you even more about all this, from safety, to buying a rifle, to gun laws, to what you should buy before the next things are banned: Boston's Gun Bible. You can get it at Amazon, or you can benefit the author even more buy buying it publisher-direct at http://www.javelinpress.com/ I have bought from them, mailing cash, and they came through and kept the government from profiting on their transaction! Their other books are universally good as well. The book has a good chapter on how to negotiate gun sales.

Good luck, and enjoy starting down this path!
45 posted on 11/01/2002 3:31:24 PM PST by Atlas Sneezed
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