IBM server chip seen slimmed down for Apple Macs

Bigcharts Marketwatch ^ | OCTOBER 13, 2002 11:59 PM | Reuters U.S. Company News

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

ARMONK, N.Y., Oct 14 (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. (IBM) on Monday announced a microchip for personal computers that will crunch data in chunks twice as big as the current standard and is expected by industry watchers to be used by Apple Computer Inc. (AAPL)

Apple was not available to comment, and IBM declined to comment on which PC makers would use the chip, but its plans would mark a change for the industry, which has emphasized the importance of the speed of a chip rather than its ability to handle heavy workloads.

IBM said its new PowerPC chip would go into production late next year and process 64 bits of data at a time at 1.8 Gigahertz, or 1.8 billion cycles per second.

The microchip is the brain of a computer, although personal computer chips now come only in 32-bit flavors, which are tuned to do light workloads fast but cannot handle heavy duty server chores.

Chekib Akrout, vice president of IBM microprocessor development, said big databases and the Internet challenged PCs: "This is the time to introduce a 64-bit machine capable of being used on a desktop," he said in a telephone interview.

An industry source said Cupertino, California-based Apple would use the chip in its Macintosh computers.

That could catapult Apple, long dogged by the belief its chips are slower than those produced by Intel Corp. (INTC) , to the technological head of the class and put to rest speculation it was considering moving soon to the Intel platform.

The fastest of the current generation of PowerPC chips in Macintosh computers runs at 1.25 Gigahertz, while the top Intel Pentium is 2.8 Gigahertz. Apple says its machines are already more efficient than Intel-based ones.

Advanced Micro Devices Inc. (AMD) , the main competitor to Intel, is also developing a 64-bit chip code-named Hammer that is expected early next year, although it is planned primarily for servers rather than personal computers.

SERVER LITE

IBM said the new PowerPC 970 microchip is a "lite" version of its Power4 chip, which it launched last fall in its sophisticated computer server, code-named "Regatta."

The PowerPC can run 32-bit applications as well as 64-bit ones and is tuned for graphics, like some Intel chips, IBM said. However, it is not designed to run programs written for Intel chips.

The PowerPC has the same energy-saving attributes as the Power4 but uses only one central processing unit, not two.

The chip will be available in the second half of 2003 and be built in IBM's East Fishkill, New York, chip plant, a new facility that is currently doing test-runs and aims to ramp up into production on other chips later this year.

One analyst said the chip's attributes mean it would work well in the professional publishing sector, for high-end graphics and other media-intense tasks.

"This processor would be a great processor for a Macintosh," said Tom Halfhill, an analyst with San Jose, California-based In-Stat/MDR.

IBM, the world's largest computer company, has seen revenue from its microelectronics division dwindle in recent quarters as the semiconductor sector has been hit by a sharp downturn in demand. It has restructured the unit, selling off some assets.

IBM announced earlier this week more details on its new microelectronics design unit, where it will design chips and other electronics for customers, including Sony Corp. (JP:6758) .

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

OFFICIAL BUMP(TOPIC)LIST

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

And some additional detail:

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IBM to unleash new PowerPC chip

By John G. Spooner
Staff Writer, CNET News.com
October 13, 2002, 9:00 PM PT

IBM will put its PowerPC processor line back on the map Monday when it talks up a speedy chip that promises a substantial performance boost for desktops and servers.

The PowerPC 970 chip, due next year, will run at 1.8GHz, nearly twice as fast as Big Blue's quickest existing PowerPC chip, the 1GHz 750FX. It will also be able to handle both 32-bit software, the current standard on desktops, and 64-bit software, used on high-end servers.

Engineers from IBM's Microelectronics division will disclose the details of the new chip for the first time at this week's Microprocessor Forum in San Jose, Calif.

The new chip might prove a boon to Apple Computer, which could use it to substantially narrow a growing performance gap with the PC world--PC chips will run at 3GHz by the end of the year. Sources familiar with IBM and Apple's plans said that Apple will be a customer for the PowerPC 970 next year. Apple did not return calls for comment.

"It makes logical sense that Apple would at least evaluate the chip. It would be perfect for the Xserve and for content creation," said Kevin Krewell, executive editor of the Microprocessor Report, which sponsors the forum. Xserve is Apple's rack-mounted server.

While not a complete measure, faster clock speeds generally lead to better performance, and Intel and Advanced Micro Devices have been boosting clock speeds all year. And consumers often use clock speed numbers to guide buying decisions. IBM has been eyeing the 2GHz mark for some time.

At the level of "2x gigahertz, we will compete very reasonably against the (Intel) Pentium," said Chekib Akrout, vice president of microprocessor development at IBM Microelectronics.

"This is another situation where frequency is not a good indication of performance," said Krewell. PowerPC chips are "losing the gigahertz race, but with all the performance (IBM) packed into this architecture, it's going to be competitive with the performance of the Pentium 4 in 2003."

The new chip will also give Apple an opportunity to move into the 64-bit world and expand its market. Computers with 32-bit chips can "address," or access, only a limited amount of memory. Chips with 64-bit addresses can access far more. In servers, this capability is already valuable, and a growing number of workstation users are demanding large amounts of memory. In a few years, enthusiast home users will be asking for greater amounts of memory.

As previously reported, the PowerPC 970 borrows its design from the Power4, the chip used in IBM's showcase servers. But PowerPC 970 will be much smaller, faster and less power hungry, allowing for its use in desktops or low-end servers.

The chip's potent mixture--speed, 64-bit addressing and the ability to perform large numbers of calculations--will significantly boost performance for potential customers, engineers from IBM said. IBM's Power chips, such as the Power4, are based on the same basic RISC processor architecture as its PowerPC processors but represent two distinct implementations.

The Power4, for example, has two chip cores, or brains, in the same piece of silicon and handles 64-bit applications. Different divisions inside the company manage and develop the Power and PowerPC families.

Editing very large video files is one area where desktops could use the extra performance of the PowerPC 970 and take advantage of the large amounts of memory afforded by 64-bits. Meanwhile, the extra memory allowed by 64-bits boosts performance for server applications like databases. The software factor
One of the biggest parts of a transition to the PowerPC 970 for Apple or any other customer will involve adapting software to take full advantage of the new capabilities.

Existing 32-bit software and operating systems based on Linux, Unix or Apple's Mac OS X (derived from Unix) will run on the new PowerPC chip. But to take advantage of larger amounts of memory afforded by 64 bits, software makers will have to renovate their operating systems and applications.

IBM will use the chip internally in a project of its own, sources indicated, and the chip will also be sold to customers in the embedded and communications markets, two PowerPC strongholds.

IBM will manufacture the PowerPC 970 in its newest chip plant, located in East Fishkill, N.Y., using its 130-nanometer (0.13 micron) silicon-on-insulator process. SOI allows IBM to boost clock speed and hold down power consumption by better insulating transistors.

Though IBM says the 1.8GHz PowerPC 970 will be the first in a family of chips, the company would not say when the chip will reach higher speeds, such as 2GHz, or if it will be available at slower speeds for applications like notebooks.

IBM is expected, however, to move the chip quickly to a 90-nanometer manufacturing process, which will let it boost the chip's clock speed. Companies will start to make 90-nanometer chips in the second half of 2003.

Although IBM will disclose technical details on the chip's architecture at the Microprocessor Forum, pricing and other commercial details won't emerge until the chip ships in the second half of next year.

[HAL9000]

Breaking news from Associated Press -

Sources: Apple to Use IBM Processor

By MATTHEW FORDAHL

AP TECHNOLOGY WRITER

SAN JOSE, Calif. -- Apple Computer Inc., which for months has been encouraging PC users to switch to its Macintosh computers, is on the verge of some switching itself.

The company, which has used Motorola microprocessors in most of its Macs since 1984, is the customer of a line of next-generation processors to be unveiled Monday by International Business Machines Corp., according to industry sources.

Unlike today's Windows and Mac desktops, the IBM PowerPC 970 can process data in 64-bit chunks as well as today's standard 32-bit chunks. Sixty-four bit chips, which can address massive amounts of memory, are mostly found today in powerful servers.

Apple, IBM and Motorola declined to comment on the switch, which has been rumored as the processors in Macintosh computers have trailed Windows-based counterparts in clock speed.

In its marketing, Apple has stressed that megahertz and gigahertz does not necessarily indicate a machine's performance. Still, the fastest Motorola processor for the Mac, the G4, runs at 1.25 gigahertz; Intel Corp.'s fastest Pentium 4 chip runs at 2.8 gigahertz.

It was not immediately clear in which products Apple will use the IBM PowerPC 970 or whether they will be the foundation of an entirely new system. Besides its professional Macs, Apple also now sells single-processor iMacs and xServe servers.

The PowerPC 970 can run software optimized for both 32-bit and 64-bit environments without emulation. That's a similar strategy to Advanced Micro Devices Inc.'s 64-bit processors for desktops and servers to be released next year.

Critics - notably Intel - argue that most desktop users have no need for 64-bit processing. In fact, Microsoft Corp. has yet to release a 64-bit version of Windows that will run on AMD's Hammer chips.

The new IBM chip is derived from the computer giant's Power4 microprocessor that powers its high-end Regatta servers. When available by the middle of next year, it will range in speeds from 1.6 gigahertz to 1.8 GHz.

Chekib Akrout, vice president of microprocessor development at IBM Microelectronics, said the PowerPC 970 will have plenty of application now in low-end servers and will have uses in high-end desktops in the future.

Apple, IBM and Motorola jointly developed early generation PowerPC chips under an agreement announced in 1991. That partnership dissolved in 1998.

But both Motorola and IBM continued to develop the processor. Currently, all of Apple's desktops are based on Motorola's 32-bit G4 PowerPC. Apple's iBook laptops are built with IBM's G3 PowerPC processors.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Seems like this would be a good move for Apple, but the production date seems a ways off!

[Lizard_King]

I love all this talk of a performance gap between Apple and Pentium/Wintel...Someday people will understand that Gigahertz mean nothing when paired with antiquated infrastructure and crappy code. Right around the same time they realize that .223 is not a high powered rifle round...I wonder where willful ignorance in the media really comes from, an agenda or just plain laziness?

I switched from Apple a year ago back because I wanted to build my own computer and have access to more software...But OS X Jaguar will still be waiting for me when I finally give up on Windows...

[Kaiwen]

But to take advantage of larger amounts of memory afforded by 64 bits, software makers will have to renovate their operating systems and applications.

Yeah, I'm gonna hold my breath over this one. It took the maker of my tablet over a year to come out with an OS X driver. Granted, they're a harware company, but how many software companies are going to look forward to another revamp of their products, so soon after the switch to OS X?

[HAL9000]

Seems like this would be a good move for Apple, but the production date seems a ways off!

Although the new processor is expected mid-2003, it's not a certainty that Apple will release an IBM-based product at the same time. I think it could be 2004 before it is available in a Mac, certainly in the Xserve system and probably in the professional desktop models.

Until then, Apple will be helping developers plan for the transition and ensure that applications take full advantage of the new processor (optimized data alignment, optimized instruction scheduling from the compiler, etc.)

Of course, the thing everyone wants to see is the benchmarks of the new IBM PowerPC 970 compared to the Pentium and Itanium. Hopefully we will know something in a day or two.

The Motorola processors will probably continue to be used in the consumer and portable models for a quite a while, with the usual improvements in performance every few months. One thing that is unclear at the moment is whether Motorola's G5 will be used in the Mac.

[HAL9000]

For the sake of clarity, because someone is bound to ask -

No, this is not an x86/Pentium-type chip.

It will not natively boot up Windows, but it will run Linux.

[Monty22]

I like my ibook alright. It does wireless ok, with the airport I bought.. The notebook I got pretty cheap, the rest was at a premium.

That said, I bought my ibook a pretty long time ago, and the current ones just aren't much faster.

Apple needs a G4 1ghz ibook with nvidia GF4 graphics and at least 128meg ram for around $1200. Otherwise, the new Sony or Toshiba mini-books just KILL anything Apple offers now.

[self_evident]

International Business Machines Corp. (IBM) on Monday announced a microchip for personal computers that will crunch data in chunks twice as big as the current standard and is expected by industry watchers to be used by Apple Computer Inc. (AAPL)

A quarter for the first person that tells me why this is enough to know that the rest of the article isn't worth reading.

[Glenn]

A quarter for the first person that tells me why this is enough to know that the rest of the article isn't worth reading.

A dime if you'll go away.

IBM perfected the 64 bit PowerPC chip in AS/400 boxes. 99.99999% uptime. No kernel panics or BSODs. Maybe you'd prefer the Itanium. You know: The one Intel might not get to market because of lawsuits and bad press? I've been around long enough to remember the point in time when people wondered what the hell IBM was thinking when they introduced the "AT" -- 32 bit pathways for a 16 bit operating system? What was the point? Who'd buy such a thing? And what would you do with it?

OS X is fertile for taking a 64bit pathway on the XServe and the desktop. What will they do with it? Dunno yet. But I can bet you Luddites will rail against it, whatever it is.

[Free the USA]

http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/bump-list

[dennisw]

I don't own an Apple, nor do I plan to, but this sounds very interesting. More power to 'em!

[dennisw]

Otherwise, the new Sony or Toshiba mini-books just KILL anything Apple offers now.
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There are fantastic versions available only in Japan/Asia. But there are USA companies that import them and tack on a $300 premium for doing so.

After 13 months the Vaio battery died and costs $300 to replace.
http://www.epinions.com/content_13712002692

[TXnMA]

Apple, long dogged by the belief its chips are slower than those produced by Intel Corp.

Believed only by those who swallow the Microsoft/Intel propaganda whole and without questioning its veracity.

Those believing that a 1gHz RISC pipelined chip performs slower than a 2 gHz CISC chip are like those who believe that a Chrysler Hemi produces less horsepower at 3000 rpm than a Chevy smallblock does at 6000 rpm...

It ain't how tight you wind it, but the amount of work done per piston stroke that counts when you're moving mass. And it ain't the clock rate, but the size and number of simultaneously-moving words (chunks of info) per processor cycle that count when you're moving data...

Loading any engine down with accesssories like power steering and air conditioning reduces its useful output. Similarly, loading a processor down with the burden of storing and manipulating a huge set of instructions (CISC) results in drastically les computational output than the raw clock rate might lead one to assume.

Beware of accepting (without question) the propaganda-laced claims by Microsoft, Intel, and folks who have only used one (PC) platform.

Before anyone assumes that I'm a " Mac Fanatic", let me say that I have (and use) both Mac and PC systems...

[TXnMA]

"les" = "less"

If you can't type, it matters little what processor is under the hood... '-{

[Bush2000]

"This is another situation where frequency is not a good indication of performance," said Krewell. PowerPC chips are "losing the gigahertz race, but with all the performance (IBM) packed into this architecture, it's going to be competitive with the performance of the Pentium 4 in 2003."

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

[dheretic]

Well this certainly gives one college kid an incentive to kill off his credit card debt! A 64bit PowerMac running 2 of these babies at 1.8Ghz+!!1 I could probably get 6-7 years out of that beast.

[Bush2000]

Well this certainly gives one college kid an incentive to kill off his credit card debt! A 64bit PowerMac running 2 of these babies at 1.8Ghz+!!1 I could probably get 6-7 years out of that beast.

That's not a bad idea. I make it a practice to always buy a dual proc mobo when I pick up a new machine. Makes a machine viable for a lot longer ...