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MTBE battle looms large in energy bill
Sac Bee ^ | 10/08/02 | David Whitney

Posted on 10/08/2002 8:59:00 AM PDT by NormsRevenge

Edited on 04/12/2004 5:45:23 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

WASHINGTON -- A major battle has flared over granting a liability waiver to producers of the gasoline additive MTBE, and it alone could sink the energy bill in the waning congressional session.

Environmental groups and MTBE producers differ over whether this waiver, sought by House leaders, would make it impossible for communities to collect damages from underground contamination.


(Excerpt) Read more at sacbee.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; Politics/Elections; US: California
KEYWORDS: aquifers; california; davis; energylist; enviralists; mtbe; poison; water; wells
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DUMP DAVI$


GO SIMON
1 posted on 10/08/2002 8:59:00 AM PDT by NormsRevenge
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To: NormsRevenge
Just so everyone gets it the decision to put this chemical in gasoline is mot one that is made by the refiners or even the chemical's manufacturers. It is a government decision forced on everyone who is involved with gasoline. Now the same people who forced the use of this chemical are the one's who wish to be compensated for damages from this chemical. Chutzpah
2 posted on 10/08/2002 9:07:27 AM PDT by harpseal
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3 posted on 10/08/2002 9:10:18 AM PDT by William McKinley
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To: NormsRevenge
Let me get this straight...

You want to be able to sue a company for making MTBE if it gets into the ground water, but...
you mandate that MTBE or ethanol be included in every single gallon of gasoline sold in order to protect the environment...

If I were the company making MTBE, I think that I will retool and make sandals instead, because there are going to be a lot of drivers that will be walking instead!!!

4 posted on 10/08/2002 9:13:17 AM PDT by Frohickey
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To: *Enviralists; *Energy_List; Ernest_at_the_Beach; madfly
http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/bump-list
5 posted on 10/08/2002 9:19:35 AM PDT by Free the USA
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To: NormsRevenge
And who put that nasty MTBE in Californians' gasoline? Why, Tom Daschle and Henry Waxman of course. Thanks guys.
6 posted on 10/08/2002 9:26:36 AM PDT by jz638
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To: jz638
The fact that politicians dabble with chemicals that can kill folks, is .. Well, Scary.

MTBE is a by-product of the refining process. It turned into another way to make a lot of money by using itwhere it ought not to have been used, like Everywhere! We needed oxygenated gas like we need more HOV lanes.

DioXin and MTBE and how Davi$ behaved in California recently is a VERY important issue dealing with the health of all California's residents and visitors as well.
7 posted on 10/08/2002 9:36:27 AM PDT by NormsRevenge
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To: NormsRevenge; Dog Gone; snopercod; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Carry_Okie; farmfriend; GVgirl; marsh2; ...
"The Environmental Working Group released a report Monday contending that not only did MTBE producers know that their product would threaten water supplies, they pressed the government to mandate its use."

This report is a GLARING LIE!!!

Although this is the one AND ONLY issue I agree with both our silly senators, I was present at a meeting of the Regional Council of Rural Counties (RCRC) in Redding in 1998 when a deputy director of the Fed EPA and chief legal counsel answered this question of an Amador County Supervisor:

"Why is this trade-off between supposedly cleaning our air, while poisoning our finite drinkable water supplies being so aggressively pushed by your agency?"

Her answer:

"Because we were sued by the Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) under the Clean Air Act, signed by President Bush!"

Now... those of us that have been in government understand how this works... The NRDC and EPA go into a huddle behind very thick closed doors.

NRDC says: "Why aren't you enforcing this aspect of the Clean Air Act that we worked so hard to get passed and signed?"

EPA says: "Well there isn't any public support for aggressive enforcement and the industry doesn't like the expense of changing their refineries. Now, if someone were to file suit to force the issue and win a judgement, then we could act as you wish. As you know, your legal fees are paid by us, win or lose!"

NRDC says: "Ok, and we'll use this a leverage to get industry cooperation."

Meanwhile, the industry discovers that a chemical waste by product of refining gasoline, that it has been paying huge costs to legally dispose of due to enviral regulations, makes a cheap oxygenate, turning a huge liability into a huge asset!!! A hugely profitable asset, so they're all ready when NRDC comes knocking on their meeting room door!.

And that's how EnvironMentalist Litigators and Alegators, along with an industry trying to find a "WIN-WIN" solution to pressure from government agents... threatens to poison the most valuable commodity on earth (potable water) while actually lowering mileage and INCREASING POLLUTION, but putting out media baloney that they are clearing the air.

Now, finally, Boxer and Feinstein realize the cost of this clean-up could swallow-up the "Super Fund" in a "New York Minute!"

8 posted on 10/08/2002 9:41:27 AM PDT by SierraWasp
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To: SierraWasp
Thanks!
9 posted on 10/08/2002 9:48:22 AM PDT by NormsRevenge
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Comment #10 Removed by Moderator

To: harpseal
Underground fuel tanks used to be steel. MTBE doesn't leak through steel. When Lawrence Livermore National Laboratories studied the question of underground contamination, of the 48,000 underground tanks in California, 1,200 leaked. The major oil companies advocated replacing ALL underground tanks with plastic, among other reasons because the cost would put independent sellers out of business.

MTBE diffuses through plastic tanks. The majors knew it. MTBE condenses in air, and the majors knew that in 1985. So when the Clean Air Act Amendments came up in 1990 what did the majors do? The major oil companies demanded indemnification for the liability and yes, that move was supported by every major environmental group, many of whom subsist off foundation dollars from Pew, Rockefeller, BP...

Just so you remember: It was ARCO that put Pete Wilson's wife on its Board of Directors when California adopted an RFG formula that constituted 15% MTBE. EPA had only mandated the use of an 8% formula in two critical air basins. The CARB mandated the 15% formula statewide.

Go ahead, blame only the environmentalists, but you'll only have half the story.
11 posted on 10/08/2002 9:58:11 AM PDT by Carry_Okie
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To: DrJET; Grampa Dave; Jim Robinson
"Wonder why? Maybe it has something to do with the Middle East."

Could it be so the clever bastards can march around US cities, yelling "NO BLOOD FOR OIL?"

Anti-knock... as in the lead that was forced out by EnvironMentalists, as in DDT that was forced out by EnvironMentalists so we can't prevent West Nile Virus and Malaria?

Doesn't anybody see the parallels between the mutually America hating Muslim extremist terrorists and the America hating EnvironMentalist terrorists? No! Because none dare question EnvironMentalism or MuslimTerrorism, one a Pagan religion and the other a total mixture of Church & State totalitarianism!!!

Where are the Feminazi's? Where is the ACLU? Where are the Kennedy Democrats, the Truman Democrats and even the LBJ Democrats? Are they all now cowardly Mc Govern/Dasshole Demonicrats that wish the USA to live in fear and an environmental waste land like formerly Socialist/Communist Eastern Germany?

No wonder Jim Robinson finally switched from the Democrat Party! I congratulate him, once again!!!

12 posted on 10/08/2002 10:14:45 AM PDT by SierraWasp
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To: Carry_Okie
"Just so you remember: It was ARCO that put Pete Wilson's wife on its Board of Directors..."

Yup! Nobody's clean in this monumental bamboozle! But you remember this... WHO STARTED ALL THIS CRAPOLA?

Who has relentlessly, ruthlessly and remorselessly pushed, prodded and pounded until they have turned our major federal and state agencies into their errand boys & girls? Nearly every Gestapo-like action by a formerly somewhat benevolent American government can be traced back to these liberals and envirowhacko Socialist prigs!

Who has manipulated and coerced the private sector corporations even better than Jesse Jackson ever could, into one lose-lose situation after another, until they finally turn to these falsely perceived win-win boondawgles?

As things have turned out... You are right! But they didn't start out that way and cornered corporations are kinda like cornered animals... they look for any way possible to survive when constantly cornered at every turn!!!

13 posted on 10/08/2002 10:34:40 AM PDT by SierraWasp
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To: SierraWasp; Ernest_at_the_Beach
Sir Wasp, is this the same B$tch senator that only a few years ago said that MTBE was good for our state, our gasoline and our environment?

Sen. Dianne Feinstein, who is among the Senate negotiators on the energy bill, said she was outraged that House negotiators had even proposed the MTBE waiver.

"MTBE is a clear environmental hazard and a potential human carcinogen, and in my view providing a liability exemption would be a serious mistake," she said.

Sir Wasp are we living in a separate world re MTBE?

Remember only a few years ago we and the KSFO people were called Right Wing Whackos who wanted to pollute the air by removing MTBE.

This article will be sent to every lying enviro whacko to called me dangerous for wanting this poison removed from our gas.

One final sideline, most 76 stations in N. Kali are not selling nor pumping MTBE for several months. Their gasoline is MTBE free.

14 posted on 10/08/2002 10:41:50 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: SierraWasp
As things have turned out... You are right! But they didn't start out that way and cornered corporations are kinda like cornered animals... they look for any way possible to survive when constantly cornered at every turn!!!

Sorry sir Wasp, but the corporate types were way out ahead of the enviros with these manipulations, even in the 19th Century.

15 posted on 10/08/2002 10:57:02 AM PDT by Carry_Okie
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To: Carry_Okie
I for one am not necessarily blaming anyone I am merely pointing out that the chemical is government mandated so the Government is therefor liable.

Stay well - Stay safe - stay armed - Yorktown

16 posted on 10/08/2002 10:58:20 AM PDT by harpseal
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To: Grampa Dave; SierraWasp
Thanks for the pings!

One final sideline, most 76 stations in N. Kali are not selling nor pumping MTBE for several months. Their gasoline is MTBE free.

Hmmm!

17 posted on 10/08/2002 11:41:06 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
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To: Complacent Sheeple
We just had to have that MTBE....These same envirowackos were the same ones pushing this crap on us in the first place. "It's only a few cents more and it saves the environment they said"...
18 posted on 10/08/2002 4:54:41 PM PDT by Orion78
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To: Carry_Okie
"the corporate types were way out ahead of the enviros with these manipulations"

Yeah... I watched the Rock Ribbed Repellican Rockerfeller show on PBS, last night. Seen ol baldie Robber Baron hisself, I did.

I observe greed and corruption in corporate environmentalism has rapidly equalled, but now surpassed corporate multi-nationalism. They now reign supreme by not only winning the legislative, but the public relations/media and court of public opinion battles.

They are now the hulking giants stalking the earth, seeking whom they may over-regulate, overburden and devour. The "C" corps are as they always have been... reactionary pragmatists, cutting deals to constantly cut their losses in an increasingly hostile environment toward the biggest governmental program of the USA... Capitalism, or what's left of it after taxes.

The rest of us cerfs out here working in the field (so to speak) are too busy and tired to raise our heads and that's a good thing because the live fire between these giants would blow our heads off if we are dumb enough to rise up and question any of it.

Plus, we just don't have the resources. And if we did and came up with the ideas in an authorship exercise, they would not respond as they, including academia are too heavily invested in the status quo. They are all very afraid of losing out to any idea whose time has come!!!

19 posted on 10/08/2002 7:39:56 PM PDT by SierraWasp
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To: SierraWasp
Plus, we just don't have the resources. And if we did and came up with the ideas in an authorship exercise, they would not respond as they, including academia are too heavily invested in the status quo. They are all very afraid of losing out to any idea whose time has come!!!

Thou art a Hugo-not?

"Nothing is so powerful as an idea whose time has come."

Well, we both know that, so I guess I have to live it. You see, I don't have a choice. It's just that kind of thing.

20 posted on 10/08/2002 8:24:55 PM PDT by Carry_Okie
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