GAO to study impact of H-1B program on hiring

WASHINGTON -- There's no shortage of anecdotal reports from U.S. workers that the H-1B visa program is costing Americans jobs. But proving it has been elusive because companies don't disclose whom they hire or lay off.

That's a problem facing the U.S. General Accounting Office as it embarks on a study to answer a question posed by two Democrats on the U.S. House Science Committee: Do companies show a preference for retaining H-1B workers, and if so, why?

The GAO study, due out sometime next year, is expected to arrive during a congressional debate on whether the cap on the controversial program should be allowed to shrink from 195,000, its level for the past two fiscal years, to 65,000 after the next fiscal year ends on Sept. 30, 2003.

The H-1B program is a contentious issue in the technology community. Critics charge that in many cases, foreign workers are hired because of their willingness to work for lower wages and fewer benefits. Industry groups counter that the U.S. doesn't supply enough workers with technical skills to meet demand. H-1B employees, hired for certain technical skills, can work in the U.S. for six years through the visa program, and possibly longer under some exceptions.

The value of the upcoming report will rest on the strength of its data. But GAO officials haven't determined how to research the H-1B program's impact, and agency officials are now planning to meet with House Science Committee staff members to discuss a research methodology, according to agency and congressional staff members.

The plan is already drawing criticism from one H-1B advocate. Harris Miller, who heads the Information Technology Association of America in Arlington, Va., said he believes that the latest H-1B usage data is proof enough that the program isn't being abused.

The U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service recently reported that it granted 60,500 H-1B visas in the nine-month period that ended June 30, representing a 54% drop from the same period last year.

"The numbers speak for themselves," said Miller. The downturn shows that H-1B's critics are wrong about the visa program serving as a supply of cheap labor, he said.

"If they [the H-1B opponents] were right, which they are not, there would just be as many H-1Bs today as a year ago," said Miller. Given the pressure on companies to cut payroll, he said, wouldn't they use "more H-1Bs rather than less H-1Bs during an economic downturn?"

But George McClure, who heads the career policy committee of the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers Inc.-USA, points to rising unemployment numbers for computer and electronics engineers, along with reports from IEEE members who say they have lost jobs to H-1B workers.

"We've got lots of unemployed members ... who can do the jobs that they are bringing in H-1Bs for," said McClure. He said he has heard from engineers who were instructed to train H-1B visa holders and were then laid off.

But McClure said he doesn't know how the GAO can accurately assess the situation, other than to talk to affected workers and hear their stories.

"If the concern is with unemployment, then they ought to be talking to some of the people who are unemployed," said McClure.

U.S. Reps. James Barcia and Lynn Rivers, both Michigan Democrats and House Science Committee members, requested the GAO study a year ago. The GAO divided their request into two parts, starting with a study on the effectiveness of a training program that has been funded through H-1B fees. That report is due in a matter of weeks.

The H-1B training program, which has collected $138 million fees paid by employers who sponsor H-1B visa holders, has been called "ineffective" by the Bush administration because it isn't providing training that would lessen demand for H-1B workers.

These visa holders typically have bachelor's and, in many cases, advanced degrees. But a lot of the training programs are being used to prepare workers for low-tech jobs such as installing cable, the administration said.

The Bush administration's position was determined before anyone had evaluated the training program, said one congressional staff member familiar with the GAO study. That study may yet find some value in the program, he said.

I tried to hire under the "H" visa a few fellows from Scotland that had a vast experience in the forets products industry. All I got is a run around and told in short that there were a lot of people in this state that could fill the positions.
I now ask any of you here, do you think that you would hire people that have never held a chainsaw in their hands and put them to work in the woods and stand back and watch the blood fly or the arms and legs snap?..that is if they are lucky and dont kill themselves? The whole rotten immigration thing is a joke. I need EXPERIENCED timber fallers, and they say I should hire and train. Ya right! And then all the skunks, drunks and creeps come along and my WC insurance goes so friggan high I cant survive. I wonder why these friggan jerks in the DOL think that we in this industry are so rich we can just throw money away like that. It takes years to learn how to fall trees...much to everyones amazement.

That may be your experience. In the high tech, computer related, industry it is quite different. 100's of thousands of US citizen IT workers have been laid of in the last 2 years. Yes, > 100,000 in that industry. The big consulting firms have crashed. They are merging right and left and shedding workers like crazy. The software houses have been doing layoffs. Silicon valley has been trashed. The dotcoms are dead (not that they actually hired that many, really.) The corporate IT shops have done layoffs - and hardly anyone is hiring.
Big deal, you say. Well, those workers tended to be college educated, advance degrees, and higher income. When their jobs got cut - they either remain unemployeed, and thus not spending money, thus impacting everyone else from barbers to car salemen; or they are taking jobs in real estate, telemarketing (god forbid more evening phone calls), etc. - thus filling job holes for which they are overqualified and preventing other Americans from filling those same jobs. Its a real problem.

What you are saying is incorrect.
To hire a "H" visa person you must first go through several steps, at least in my experience. One is, that you must prove you cannot find the help in this field in the US before you hire a foriegn national to take the position.
The employer must apply to the Dept Of Labor in his/her state to get permission to hire a foriegn national. Then they make the employer go through several steps. First, after you provide the info on the foriegn nationals you intend to try and hire, you must advertise in several major papers and in the unemployment office of the state for a lenght of time. Then after that, the employer gets the permission to hire (if no person is available in the state)and then the foriegn national must go to the INS and get Passports to get the proper Visa's to be able to work.
If they did hire and laid off as you say it is illegal per INS rules and regs as well as I suspect it would be in your state. I suggest you investigate this as this sounds a bit fishy to me. In short I dont believe a word of this as my wife has taken a job that was to be offered to a person from Central America...and it happened in her place of employment. They wanted a CIS specialist and intended to hire from C.America. My wife has a degree in business admin with a specialty in CIS and found out and confronted them through the MESC and got the job...which pissed off the boss as they had to give her the job at her rate of pay to boot. Of course money talks and bullcrap walks if one knows the right congressperson which could be the key to this.
The other side of the coin. I tried to hire experienced sawyers who had training in several steps of timber falling. There is no such thing in the upper midwest. I could not hire as the MESC insisted that I hire and do on the job traing. I've advertised all over the north west to with not responce. I've advertised here and have decided to forget it. I'm sick of drunks and skunks that show up one day a week and such.

Temporary Work Visa (H) - required by an alien who is to perform a prearranged professional or highly skilled job for a temporary period, or to fill a temporary position for which there is a shortage of U.S. workers, or receive training from an employer. The employment or training must be approved in advance by an office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service in the United States on the basis of an application filed by the prospective employer. Read more...

Temporary Work Visa (H-1C) - required by registered nurses seeking temporary employment in the U.S. Effective September 21, 2000, 500 visas are available annually over a four-year period (2000 - 2003). Employment is limited to areas designated as "health professional shortage areas" by the Department of Health and Human Services (DHHS). Registered nurses practicing under the H-1C visa may be admitted for three years with no extensions. Read more...

Intra-company Transferee Visa (L-1) - required by an alien who is being transferred by his current employer to a specific executive or technical job with the same firm, or subsidiary thereof, in the United States. The employment must be approved in advance by an office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service in the United States on the basis of an application filed by the prospective employer. Read more...

All a company has to do is post a job ad in the local paper. It is that simple. I contracted for a company that put ads in the paper all the time for immigration purposes only. They just delete the resumes they receive. No one checks.

Then they fill out their Labor Condition Application, fax it to the Labor Department, and it is immediately approved without checking for accuracy. It is a rubber stamp process.

The fact that there are still H1-Bs being issued in spite of all the layoffs is proof that it is abusive.

I agree with you completely.

My retired husband has a close friend who was laid-off over two years ago from a large shipping concern. Hugh was a long time IT worker with something like 25 years in the business and he has a degree and he says he is up to date in his skills.

He trained 6 programmers from India for 4 months before his lay-off.

They are still on the job at the shipping concern....Hugh does security work by day, he guards a freight terminal of a company that just went belly-up and he does telephone market research at night.

He has already spent most of his 401k on his wife's health problems( a by-pass surgery with NO insurance). He also continued for awhile to take course$$$ at the local college in his field. They gave up their house about 8 months ago in an effort to save money. Their adult kids help them as well.

We sold them (FOR A REALLY LOW PRICE) our second car last year, as I inherited a better one from an Aunt.

Our friend is a hardworking guy. He tries so hard. His wife works only part-time as she has a heart condition but doesn't consider herself to be disabled.

He told my husband that he has had MANY telephone interviews for jobs, and the interviewers can BARELY SPEAK OR UNDERSTAND ENGLISH!! The interviewers were from India. He did NOT get the jobs.

He has given up the hunt for IT jobs. He says enough...he is tired of the hassels!!

AH....globalization!!!Just lovely!!

If these foreign worker trends continue, I foresee.... AMERICA THE THIRD WORLD COUNTRY!! Americans NEED not apply!!

What I am saying is not incorrect - I limited my discussion to the IT field, which is my area of expertise. I understand about the steps one must go through to hire an H1-B visa person. A simple way around this is to first hire someone as a contractor. Let them build specific skills on a specific project, using specific technologies. Then advertise for someone with all of those skills. Say, for example, you want someone who can use: webMethods integration with MQSeries, to integrate an Oracle financial system to an SAA BPICs shop floor system, with custom Unix HR integration. How many people who answer the ad will have all of those skills? Answer - none except for that contractor.
As for the newspaper ads and the unemployment office - the corporate HR department has processes to handle this on a weekly basis. Also, I think advertising on your website, and job boards, can replace the newspaper ads. Typically the contractor is already working on an H1-B anyway - the trick is to hire existing H1-B's not new ones. But there are H1-B shops that specialize in handling the embassy's, the visa's, etc. - it is a big business for them. That is how they get the people into the country.

Sorry, but the high tech IT situation is quite different than your timber falling situation.

Temporary Work Visa (H) - required by an alien who is to perform a prearranged professional or highly skilled job for a temporary period, or to fill a temporary position for which there is a shortage of U.S. workers, or receive training from an employer. The employment or training must be approved in advance by an office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service in the United States on the basis of an application filed by the prospective employer.
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Sorry; But this is from the INS site. So what you are saying you are being replaced by foriegn nationals in a permanent matter. Note that it says temporary positions for jobs in which there is a shortage in the USA. Even training must be approved by the INS. So in short my friend, you guys are screwing the pooch, as they say, and not using the exsisting laws to stop the back handed dealings. All it takes is a group of you to file a complaint with the Justice Dept and get a federal judge to issue a court order to cease such activities.
Sorry to hear of the IT downturn in the economy. But you know as well as I that many of these companies were not going to last anyway.

As per your contractor issue. A L1 intra company transfer can only be done if the company keeps 50% of its business going in the nation it hires from. So if company x wants to transfer or hire a contractor from the UK, it must be doing at least 50% of its business in revenue in the UK or the contractor must be doing 50% of his/her business in the UK. They MUST have keep a viable business in the foriegn country. I suspect this is not happening though. And sorry to say, I am for the L1 intra company transfer. It brings business to this country. I believe anyone who wants to come to this country to establish a viable and leagal business, should be able to do so..as long as they meet a few requirments and adhere to a couple of rules such as showing the business turns a taxable profit in the first 2 years.

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