Men filming ferry ride raise suspicion [Tacoma, WA]

tribnet.com ^ | July 7, 2002

[TomGuy]

Men filming ferry ride raise suspicion

The Associated Press

State ferry officials have told the U.S. Coast Guard and the Washington State Patrol about two groups of men taking extensive videotapes on state ferries in the past 10 days.

Four men who appeared to be of Middle Eastern descent were videotaping, taking notes and talking on cellphones during two round trips June 24 on the ferry Spokane between Edmonds and Kingston, said Susan Harris of the Washington State Ferries.

"They seemed to be filming more of the interior of the cabin rather than the normal tourist filming, which is always the exterior," she said.

They became agitated when told to leave the vessel at each terminal as required, she said. The captain went home and decided to report the incident the next day.

On July 3, a different group of men appearing to be of Middle Eastern descent took extensive videotapes on the ferry Tacoma between Bainbridge and Seattle, she said.

"They were filming all over the place" even before boarding the ferry, and some observers said they were just tourists, she said.

She said no terrorist incidents have occurred on the ferries.

"There's no proof that there's anything to be concerned about; it's just that we're on heightened alert," she said.

Chief Warrant Officer Ray Cain with the Coast Guard said the incidents have been reported to the State Patrol, which handles law enforcement on the ferries, because they are considered part of the highway system.

"They were notified and they would investigate, trying to identify any such individuals," Cain said.

State Patrol officials were not available for comment late Friday.

(Published 12:30AM, July 6th, 2002)

[GretchenEE]

Your fear-o-meter isn't working, Dave S.

[TomGuy]

So the one specific of the LAX Killer whose family returned to Egypt to visit family several weeks ago becomes the generalized the Muslims are sending their familes home to the ME, presumably to get them out of harms way. So much for logic.

You apparently missed some intervening posts. Go back and re-read the thread. Someone else posted that many Muslim families were leaving. I posted that this killer's family left. I was posting a fact. I (in a following post) asked for the poster's link.

You are knee-jerking to find something implied in my statement that isn't there. So much for your logic.

[willyone]

What should be a concern is our nations seemingly insatiable need to import huge numbers of legal and illegal immigrants. At the present rate of immigration the US will cease to exist in thirty years no matter what happens with terrorism. That should be a far bigger worry than some morons on a ferry. We will experience a Kosovo situation here if things are not corrected. And Jorge seems to want to increase the flood at our expense.

[elfman2]

"Was our round-up post-9/11 successful at preventing them? "

I think that's closer to the case. What's left is on the run, but would regroup if we stopped chasing.

Cruz ships have a significant patrol zone around them in Key West. I presume it's the same everywhere. I'm guessing that an attack is still possible, just more difficult, leaving terrorist to look elsewhere.

The SA-7 thing has always been a big issue, and more so now. I think dozens were recently captured in Afghanistan. Ends of runways are now being patrolled as well, and I heard of an incident of people stopped and taking pictures in Miami. I have even less confidence in these patrols. They can't always be there in time to stop it, and they can't completely cover all the vantage points, just the best ones.

[elfman2]

"I don't see imaginations being overworked here. I see analysis of actual events taking place. "

Imagination's not "overworked" in the case of carrier attack concerns, just fundamental. Just like a talk show buzz on some vague issue, we have few facts to analyze with respect to carrier countermeasures. But I agree that we need to stay vigilant.

[makoman]

Somebody oughtta film these groups filming. <|:)~

Great Idea!

[Dave S]

Your fear-o-meter isn't working, Dave S.

You stand a greater chance of getting carpal tunnel syndrome hacking away at your computer trying to frighten people so they can be as fearful as you, than you do of ever being harmed in a terrorist attack.

[mikegi]

I hope our security is good and that's what is stopping these easy attacks. Maybe they need time to adjust to the new security arrangements.

About the end of the runway SA-7 attack. How can our security patrols stop a couple of guys pulling up in a pickup truck, popping out a SA-7, and firing it at a jet taking off or landing? They don't have to be on airport grounds, they can sit in one of the many neighborhoods along the flight line. There's no way we can have enough security patrols to prevent that. The area is too large.

I've been baffled by the lack of SAM attacks on airliners for years. It seems so simple. What have I missed?

[Grampa Dave]

Looks like the perfect gismo for we fly fishers.

Get up high, above the river/stream, take a few pictures of what appears to be fish and document the position of the fish. Then down load the digital pictures at home on your computer, and you can then enlarge them to confirm if trout or some migrating fish were in that spot. When you return, you can go to that spot to fish.

I will probably buy one these unless it is like lugging an anchor around your neck.

[exodus]

To: TomGuy
A group of Middle Eastern men were also seen videotaping ferries
in San Francisco Bay a couple of weeks ago.
Their behavior was almost identical to that mentioned in this article about Seattle.
The captain and crew in SF reported it, too,
but too late for the men to be found by law enforcement.
# 8 by livius

*************************

If the "group of Middle Eastern men " had started shooting,
could we depend on law enforcement to arrive on time?

Our situation today is one of the reasons that carrying weapons is allowed by the Constitution. Ordinary citizens carrying weapons are the only way to defend our nation.

[Husker24]

How many people usually travel on one of those ferries at a time.

[CyberAnt]

Ahhh ... I don't think the tugboat is the target - how about the big military ships which the tugs steer out through the harbor. If you take out a ship that size, you could also plug the channel - such as they did at Pearl Harbor.

The only reason some of our ships survived was because they ran for the open sea BEFORE other ships could close the harbor. I remember reading a book once about one ship whose captain didn't want to leave - he wanted to stay and fight. He was ordered to leave - and fortunately for us, he obeyed his orders, and ended up being spared destruction. I cannot remember the specific ship, but I do remember it was a ship of great importance to the U.S. Navy.

[GretchenEE]

Give it up. This is a non-issue.

[exodus]

To: elfman2
"...About the end of the runway SA-7 attack.
How can our security patrols stop a couple of guys
pulling up in a pickup truck, popping out a SA-7,
and firing it at a jet taking off or landing?

They don't have to be on airport grounds,
they can sit in one of the many neighborhoods along the flight line.

There's no way we can have enough security patrols to prevent that..."
# 88 by mikegi

*************************

A total police state wouldn't provide enough agents to watch every area.
There is only one way to guard every populated area of the country.

A nation of armed citizens.

[snippy_about_it]

http://www.freerepublic.com/fo cus/news/701000/posts

Here is the SF incident

[elfman2]

"If you take out a ship that size, you could also plug the channel"

There're lots of ifs behind that if.

[Grampa Dave]

Re certain people photograping possible sites for terrorist activities.

There is a great fishing stream about 30 miles from my home. It is a tailwater stream below a dam.

The place is 25 miles from nowhere from here, and sight seeing tourists never go to this lake and its dam. The people who go there are locals, who fish, hike or boat on the lake or fly fish the stream below the dam.

After 9/11, several of us noticed rental cars loaded with middle eastern appearing men and sometimes women with cameras taking pictures not of the lake, but the dam it self.

One of my friends contacted a sheriff deputy to talk to him about it. The area lies between two counties and is kinda of a no patrol area. His suggestion was for all of us to buy a cheap one time/use telephoto camera and keep it handy in our trucks and vehicles. Then if we saw these "visitors" to stop at a safe distance and take a picture of them and their vehicle.

Two times since then I have seen these "visitors" and stopped. When they saw me stopping and getting out with a camera, in both instances they got into their rental vehicles and took off.

I will probably replace my one time/use camera with the Radio Shack binoc/digitial camera that you posted the pictures of.

These people do not want their pictures taken. So those who ride the ferries, just have a camera handy to take pictures of the Diversity Visa Lottery Winners when they start to take pictures.

[elfman2]

"I've been baffled by the lack of SAM attacks on airliners for years. It seems so simple. What have I missed? "

I'm not sure. Perhaps it's not as easy as it looks for someone with nothing to lose. Perhaps it was rarely seen as being to the advantage of people with something to lose, kind of like pulling on a tiger's tale.

[CyberAnt]

Well ... your gun won't do you much good if you are blown into a million pieces.

[exodus]

To: elfman2
This war is a war to destroy the economy and infrastructure.
The targets will not be normal military war targets.
The targets will be those things that can cause disruption to the economy, cost dollars and lives, etc.
[Think outside the box.]
# 13 by TomGuy

*************************

This "war" is non-existent.

A war is against something that has a nation.
A war ends with the defeat of that nation.
If our nation were serious about stopping terrorism,
we would have declared war on Afganistan.

No declaration of war is an indication that
something other than the eradication of terror is the goal.
The passage of the Patriot Act is a strong indicator
of the true objective of our leaders.

The real target of this "war" is our freedom,
and the enemy doesn't have a towel on his head.