Posted on 06/24/2002 7:01:11 PM PDT by gcruse
Joe Bob's America: Slamming Mohammed
By Joe Bob Briggs
Published 6/24/2002 3:04 PM
NEW YORK, June 24 (UPI) -- Now this is ironic. On the same day the Catholics were meeting in Dallas to try to get rid of pedophiles in the church, a Baptist guy from Florida was calling Mohammed a pedophile.
The Rev. Jerry Vines -- is that a great Baptist name or what? -- actually called Mohammed a "demon-possessed" pedophile, which summons up an image of a cloven-hoofed satyr with long fingernails peering into a baby crib as he froths at the mouth.
To be fair to Jerry, he was speaking only to his fellow Baptists, at their annual convention in St. Louis, but in these days of profiling that's probably every Muslim's nightmare: Here's what they REALLY think of us.
The reaction was a little overboard, though, partly caused, I think, by the shirt-sleeve blue-collar over-the-top Baptist preaching tradition others may not relate to. Everybody from the People for the American Way to the Anti-Defamation League to the Muslim Political Affairs Council jumped all over Brother Jerry, saying that his remarks promote "intolerance."
Well, of COURSE they promote intolerance. He's the leader of a RELIGION. They think all the OTHER religions are WRONG. I'm surprised I have to point this out.
It was kind of a silly way to go after Islam, because nobody ever claimed that any of the CHRISTIAN prophets were pure and virtuous and unblemished. They were simply vessels for PROPHECY.
So why should Mohammed be any different?
Still, it was Jerry's way of making his point, and it's a point that has nothing to do with anyone who's not Baptist or Islamic. That's why we have the separation of church and state in the first place -- so the church can have its battles without being subject to the secular side.
Over the last few months we've had all these calls for "tolerance," which is fine when you're talking about politics. The government SHOULD tolerate every religion. Better yet, the government should IGNORE every religion. But increasingly there's pressure on church leaders to become political leaders and say that all religions are wonderful, even the ones they think are nonsense.
The only people who believe that all religions are wonderful are people who don't believe in anything. That's why the People for the American Way might not like sectarian conflict. They prefer their preachers docile, harmless and invisible. But do they really believe the Constitution FORBIDS sectarian conflict? That IS the American Way.
The real hypocrites in this picture are the people who don't believe in God at all -- or believe in some vague omniscient dispenser of practical wisdom that we might as well call "Zeus." They're religious pluralists. They believe in a PANTHEON of gods, just like the Romans and Greeks did. And this is exactly the people who were being criticized by Jerry Vines.
Vines didn't say, "Go beat up some Muslims," and he wasn't saying anything new. In fact, I was at a service three years ago at Calvary Baptist Church on West 57th Street where they were promoting a whole month-long series of seminars and classes on Islam -- so they could understand it, and then DEFEAT IT. The church was planning a war against Muslims, but it was entirely a spiritual war. They were gonna send people into Brooklyn to convert Muslims to Christianity, and there were references made to similar conversion campaigns going on all across the country.
Even though I think they're a little nutty, I have more respect for the Baptists than I do for, say, the Presbyterians, who don't seem to know exactly WHAT they believe in. One way to arrive at the truth is to insist on a position so fervently that, even if it's wrong, you'll eventually get dashed against the rocks of your own enthusiasm.
That's what the Baptists tend to do. They push and they push and they push. As late as the 1960s they were still trying to keep blacks out of the Southern Baptist Convention, but that blew up in their faces because it was biblically indefensible -- and then they integrated overnight.
Vines got some support from Jerry Falwell and others on the Christian right, but he also got hammered by, among others, the Episcopalians and the Jews -- although I can't imagine their clerics believe Mohammed is actually RIGHT. The Anti-Defamation League, in fact, refuses to work on civil rights issues with Arab and Muslim groups.
The church historian Eusebius relates a story that's very much like this, but it happened 2,000 years ago. The apostle John was in Ephesus with his disciples, and they had decided to go to a bathhouse. But before they could enter the bathhouse, John learned that Cerinthius was inside.
Cerinthius was considered a heretic for his preaching that material gain is godliness. (He was born 20 centuries too soon or he would have been a televangelist.) So John refused to go into the bathhouse. Instead he called the disciples together under a tree and led them in a group prayer -- that the bathhouse building would fall down and bury Cerinthius in the rubble.
Apparently John took his religion seriously. So does Jerry Vines.
-0-
What in the world is this guy blathering about? True atheists don't believe in ANY god or gods. Those who don't believe don't think "all religions are wonderful". To the contrary, intellectually honest non-believers see organized religion as a cause for much of mankind's violent history.
Was Cerinthius buried in the rubble of the bathhouse?
I. HISTORY OF PREMILLENNIALISM.
A. There Is Little Doubt But That It Had Its Roots In The Jewish Idea Of A Literal Physical Kingdom.
1. The apostles asked of Jesus: "Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?" (Acts 1:8).
2. Earlier in Jesus' ministry, the mother of Zebedee's children came with her sons, worshiping him, and desiring a certain thing of him. . . Grant that these my two sons may sit, the one on thy right hand, and the other on the left, in thy kingdom." (Matt. 20:20-21).
B. The Early Church, With Its Jewish Converts Had A Problem With This Theory In The Second Century.
1. It is said that one named Cerinthius was in a bathhouse when the apostle John came in and called for all to flee lest the roof fall on them, for Cerinthius, the enemy of the truth, was inside.
2. This doctrine died for a long time, until the reformation movement when it was revived by John Darby and the "Plymouth Brethren."
a. It swept through the "Protestant movement."
b. Today, approx. 75% of protestant groups hold to it.
C. The Lord's Church Faced This Doctrine Heavily In Kentucky.
1. The Louisville congregation split with her elders over it--the elders were on the side of truth.
2. R.H. Bolls (1915), front page editor of the Gospel Advocate, published articles promoting premillennialism, (Brother H. Leo Boles debated the issue with bro. Bolls on the pages of the Gospel Advocate).
3. Charles Neal said premillennialism is as "clear as Acts 2:38." — Is it reall
I am very impressed to hear what Calvary is doing re. Islam. More power to them! I wish every Christian church was doing this in America. Unfortunately, a lot of "mainline" churches are like another church with is not too far from me (less than a mile). It has been holding a lecture series over the past couple of months called "Understanding Islam", where they invite in speakers from Muslim groups (according to my local newspaper) to basically preach on Sunday. I have not attended those, and I probably wouldn't be able to stomach them. I can only imagine what the dialogue is like:
American: Hi, I'm not really sure what I believe, but we're all worshipping the same God, right?
...
I tend to agree with the Rev Vines. Mohammed had good timing to set up his religion when his competition was at a weak point. Those east of the Jordan we were to hot about a new religion that originated form Judea and Rome anyway.
Those that lean in the way of The Unitarian Universalists praise everything in the name of religion(and sometimes not so religious), but never zero in on anything seems trivial. They never focus their faith for its full benefit. Those are the ones Christ will have trouble remembering.
Along with Jimmy Hoffa.
The Catholic current problem is a view of what the faggots want in the Boy Scouts, a private fishing pond.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.