Posted on 05/11/2002 12:21:01 PM PDT by Garegaupa
I've been reading many interesting discussions concerning women in the military on these boards, but there is one subject that has been little mentioned. I'd like to get some comments on that.
Just so that's clear: I'm against women in the military (in combat positions, at least, but I suppose most positions in the military will become combat positions during a conflict). I agree what has been said about women lacking the necessary physical strength and endurance, being more prone to injuries, disrupting unit cohesion, not being mentally suited for combat and so on.
But, many people say, if a woman can perform as well as a man, shouldn't she then be allowed to serve where she pleases. I still say no. And now we're getting to the point of this post:
I am (both as a Christian and as a man) thoroughly convinced that men should protect and cherish women, and that any man who would willingly send a woman to fight in his stead is a criminal.
Since this view (as far as I can see) hasn't come up too often in the debate over whether women should serve in the military or not, I'm starting to wonder if I'm the only person left on the planet who thinks this is a good principle. Ladies and gentlemen, what are your opinions on this matter?
Best regards, Garegaupa
11B83, I agree women shouldn't serve in direct combat roles. Upper body strength and integration into small units under stressful conditions are the issues. You explained them well. I'm especially glad you mentioned the chivalry aspect which in an immediate combat situation is more important than the frequently mentioned "sex" issue.
68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub, thanks for sticking up for the women. It's almost Mother's day, and I was thinking about my mom (all I can do) who served 5 years, about half in combat zones, and her many friends who served.
You're right, they were ALL volunteers, and not because of the draft. In will, commitment, or bravery I don't believe there's a gap between those who have served, or those who serve today.
Lot's of Mom's far away from their children who should be in our thoughts tomorrow.
should have been
I don't believe there's a gender gap between those who have served, or those who serve today.
That may have been freudian (sp?)
Ice water runs through their veins. Most are immoral and amoral. I am reminded of the black widow female spider that mates with then kills the male.
LOL! You wrote this because your wife threatened to kick your ass if you didn't,right? Tell her she knows NOTHING about being in the combat arms in the military if she believes this simplistic Oprah/Rosie lesbo psyco-babble.
I can see sexual harrassment charges from BOTH sides happening from situations like this. I can also see unit cohesion going all to hell if/when the women "choose favorites",and the fights break-out between the male "getting" and "not-getting".
It doesn't matter. Thanks to the "all volunteer military" women's roles ARE going to expand in the military,especially women who have 1 or more children. The reason for this is they are the ones most in NEED of a steady job with medical benifits and reasonable pay for people with limited work experience or education. The fact that most won't or can't deploy because of having nobody to leave their children with has nothing to do with this. As fewer and fewer males and young women without children enlist,this will be overlooked as our politicians try to keep the illusion going that a all-volunteer military "works".
The only way to fix this is to bring back the draft,and this is something soccer moms and dads just will NOT allow. They might all talk a lot of crap about "America is number 1!",and "We are going to kick the terrorists/Iraqui's/Iranians/etc asses,man!",but when push comes to shove they ain't about to allow little Tiffany or Roger Jr to be drafted. The "We" they keep talking about are the children of the poor and uneducated without family connections who only join the military to have a steady job with good benifits. It certainly doesn't apply to THEIR children,who are MUCH too valuable to risk their lives in uniform.
BTW,you want to know what's wrong with America? It's attitudes as described above. There is a local restaurant owned by Greeks that I go to fairly often. The father IS Greek,and the mother is a 1st generation American of Greek immigrant parents who was born and grew up in NYC. You should have heard her rant and rave about the terrorist attack on NYC on 9-11,and about how "we are gonna kick their asses!". Guess what? She went absolutely ballistic when I asked her son if he had registered for the draft yet. She loudly informed me "He doesn't have to register for the draft anymore. We have a all-volunteer military,and we need him here to work in the family business." When I told her none of this mattered and that registering for the draft was still required,she informed me that "I will send him to live in Greece before I will let him be drafted! He also has Greek citizenship and speaks the language. He can live with relatives there!". When I asked her about him speaking Greek,she informed me,"Of course I taught him to speak Greek. It's his native language. I taught him Greek before I taught him English."
This is the problem. We have too many people already in this country who see America as a opportunity to build wealth,and nothing more. They have no real "connection" to what they see as a place of employment instead of a country. This attitude is more noticable with the recent illegal immigrants from Mexico,but it also exists with legal immigrants from other areas. In fact,if you check around and are even half-way subtle with your questions,you will find out this is the dominant attitude with recent legal immigrants and their US-born children. They didn't come here for freedom or to avoid persecution,they came here for the money.
I can't say for sure that the above is what he was saying,but if he was,he's right. War is already ugly enough without bringing women into it.
No it's not. It IS dangerous and requires courage,but let's not get carried away,here.
You tell her.
While you are gazing at her chest, take notice of the CIB.
Even one, lone surviving man returning from battle could impregnate a village of women, thereby ensuring the continuation of the tribe.
But one, lone surviving woman would not be able to give birth to enough babies in a lifetime to replace the losses of battle, and her tribe would die-out, conquered by a more fecund foe.
In the course of ages, tribes whose men and women had an inborn aversion to sending women into battle, were the tribes that survived, and hence mentally heatlhy, unbrainwashed men and women today have an instinctive aversion to sending women out to fight.
But the left does not want to believe that behavior is ingrained.
And where weak-minded people may be propagandized into sending women to fight, those same people will pay a price in mental health for going against their inner wishes.
She doesn't HAVE a CIB. If she DOES have one,she didn't earn it,and should be busted out of the military for trying to wear it. She might be able to get away with pulling that crap on you,but she can't with me. SOMEBODY is lying. Is it you,or her?
Consider this for a moment. If you came upon a car wreck with a decapitated person or persons in the wreck would you tell your daughter to go pick up the pieces? Would you want her to even look? Or would you as a man do it yourself & maybe with help from your son. Do you tell you wife and daughter not to look at a bad wreck?
Same situation. An S-3 has hit the flight deck missing the first three arresting gears snagging the forth forward cable. The plane dangles fron the angle , the pilot and crew disoriented pop out, one across the water like a skipping rock, one straight into the side of the ship with skull crushed and splattered, one you can not even find intact. A war zone? No actually this happened in peace time under normal Navy flight opps. Pretty graphic huh? Another one in mind is I would never want my daughter to see the Forestal flight deck footage. It's real men dying in a very real fire. Would I allow my son to see this? If I had one yes. I would want him to understand what can and does happen in life.
When it does happen you have to put it behind you very quickly that moment to be precise as others lives and saftey depend on it. I am a peace time vet but I would not want my daughters to see things I saw while on active duty.
Phffffft!
Really? What is her MOS,and what units has she been assigned to? Even more importantly,what unit was she assigned to when she allegedly "earned" (she didn't) "her" CIB? C'mon,Buchwheat! You were quick to make these claims,stand up for them! I see by your profile you are in NC,so this means your wife is stationed at Ft.Bragg. I'd be happy to make a trip to Bragg to discuss this with her unit commander. Just tell me what unit.
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