Posted on 05/08/2002 5:41:05 AM PDT by floriduh voter
CAPTION: Backers of the proposal say the number is just an estimate, and if the ballot carries a price tag, it could be different.
TALLAHASSEE -- Supporters of a move to force the Legislature to reduce class sizes in Florida public schools released the first estimate of how much that would cost: $8-billion to $12-billion. That amounts to about a half-cent of sales tax statewide each year.
The state Legislature would be responsible for finding the money if the measure makes it to the November ballot and voters approve. Supporters of the citizen initiative said they are "not afraid of having a full and public debate about the figure," said Mark Herron, a lawyer and lobbyist for the Coalition to Reduce Class Size.
No detailed study has been conducted to determine the cost of the proposal.
The new estimate emerged Tuesday during a Senate committee hearing on a bill that would require price tags to be placed on every citizen initiative. The cost voters would see, however, would be determined by a group of state officials who periodically estimate how much revenue the state will raise.
Gov. Jeb Bush, who has expressed serious reservations about the class size amendment, asked lawmakers at the last minute to require price tags for citizen initiatives.
Herron, who testified about the bill Tuesday before the Senate Ethics and Elections Committee, gave the estimate in response to a question. Later, when questioned how the state would pay for smaller classes, Herron said: "If you have to raise taxes, then so be it."
The committee approved the bill 8-2. The full Senate takes up the bill today. The House approved a similar measure that differs from the Senate version. "People voting on it deserve to know what it's going to cost," Daniel Woodring, a lawyer in the governor's office, told senators Tuesday.
But opponents say the measure would discourage voters from approving expensive proposals, like the multibillion-dollar high-speed rail system that passed overwhelmingly two years ago. Lawmakers want a price tag to be included with all citizen-led constitutional amendments in November, including a universal prekindergarten program, a ban on smoking in restaurants and other workplaces and reducing class sizes.
The Coalition to Reduce Class Size still needs to gather more than 250,000 signatures before Aug. 6 to get the question on the Nov. 5 ballot. The group has collected 225,000 of the 488,000 signatures needed.
The coalition, led by Sen. Kendrick Meek, D-Miami, based its number on a 2000 legislative analysis. This year, the Board of Education estimated it would cost $2.3-billion, but officials there now say that number is wrong. Derek Newton, the coalition's executive director, cautioned that the price tag Herron cited was merely an estimate. "We don't necessarily agree with the entire assessment, but it's the only number that's been put on paper," he said.
Wayne Blanton, head of the Florida School Boards Association, has estimated it could cost $4-billion to $5-billion in initial construction costs for new classrooms, and almost $1-billion to pay for 10,000 to 12,000 new teachers.
A recent St. Petersburg Times/Miami Herald poll shows that 78 percent of voters would support the amendment. Nearly three of every four voters say they would limit the number of students in a class, "even if it means having to pay higher taxes," which the proposed amendment does not address.
If the bill passes, the state Revenue Estimating Conference, which calculates how much tax revenue the state will generate, will come up with the cost for implementing all citizen-led amendments. Starting in July 2003, the conference's estimate would be subject to review by the Florida Supreme Court and would apply to all amendments regardless of whether they were proposed by citizens, the Legislature or the Constitutional Revision Commission.
"I'm not sure why it is a necessity this year," said Sen. Buddy Dyer, D-Orlando, who voted against it. The Legislature has placed a measure similar to Bush's proposal on the Nov. 5 ballot, but it applies only to future initiatives.
Please pay close attention to the lobbyist for The Coalition to Reduce Class Size. It's none other than MARK HERRON, Janet Reno's campaign lawyer. Further, this initiative in my opinion is nothing more than the dems attempt to draw Governor Bush into the class size argument but indirectly. JANET RENO's name doesn't even come up in this article. The author certainly knows that Mark Herron is Reno's campaign lawyer but fails to provide her readers with this relevant fact.
Please see floriduh voter's profile page re: Mark Herron is JR's campaign lawyer. If I forgot to bookmark it, freepmail me and I'll put the link here.
He's the great American (sarcasm) who worked with Algor to challenge absentee military ballots in the recount phase of the POTUS election in Florida.
Finally, the following words should make your coffee go cold. Mark Herron who is a legal challenger, NOT A LEGISLATOR wants to raise our taxes "If you have to raise taxes, so be it." A detailed study has not been conducted to determine the cost of this program. Why? Because IMO, this is not really a ballot initiative - it's a campaign initiative for JR.
I can't even begin to discuss the legal issues involved here without having to stick my head in my freezer to revive myself. Please ping your pals and keep this BTTT because we are in the early stages of Janet Reno's antics.
FR member attorneys are invited to address the legal gray areas of lobbying for a ballot initiative and being Reno's campaign lawyer concurrently. Perfectly legal?
I believe that I have heard that the average class size is 30-35 students. Thats pretty small if you ask me. My private school had classes that size.
Im not sure what they are trying to lower it to.
IMHO, we Floridians need to vote this down.
The last five teachers of the year are all Jeb supporters: 1998, 1999, 2000 and 2001. You can email them individually and check out their bios at www.jeb.org by clicking on the Educators button on the left. Someone here may wish to do so and report back to us later in the week. I have to take mom to the dentist.
Thanks for stopping by.
Additionally, consideration has been given to reducing the salaries of school board members.
b/c high school graduation rates in florida are among the lowest in the nation.
It's worth noting that upon dropping out, many former students return to adult classrooms to obtain their GEDS or to start one of many on the job training programs, because they realized that THEY a big error in judgment by dropping out in the first place.
Do we make a law forcing them to stay in school against their wishes?
Why is everyone getting so excited over a half-cent increase? What's the big deal in paying an extra half-cent? You Floridians are really cheap!(my impression of Rosanne Rosannadanna).
Please take into consideration just some of the stadiums in Florida that are paid for by taxpayers via their property taxes. Hillsborough County i.e. Tampa Bay Bucs, Lightning Hockey Arena, Pinellas County i.e. Tropicana Field (remember the Devil Rays?).
By the way, the St. Pete Times tucked an additional story in their paper today and I think a reduction of class size to 22 per class is RIDICULOUS. Once I scanned the second story, I can see this is a jobs for teachers initiative, it has NOTHING to do with educating even one child. I would like someone who ever attended a class with only 22 students in it to step forward and give your account. There is nor was there ever such a classroom, unless you are from a rural community - one room schoolhouse. Beyond that, I respect ALL free republic registereds - certainly, you are entitled to your opinion.
Only pet peeve is election year straying off topic - which I am not accusing you of here.
What next classroom size of FIFTEEN? This is a jobs for teachers initiative to get votes for the democrats because the teachers' unions are starting to fragment here in Fla.
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