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To: Rum Tum Tugger
he questions whether Christ founded his Church on Peter
No he doesn't. He says Christ chose Peter as his first Pope but didn't intend him to be the ruler of an absolute monarchy. Many theologians agree that Christ did not intend the Church to play any part in secular government.

He also attacks Papal infallibility. I'd say that's anti-Catholic.
Was John XXII, fondly referred to as the "whore of Avignon" and whose reputation was so sullied no one would take his papal name for the next 700 years, infallible? Was St. Peter, who denied Christ three times, infallible? Again, this is a doctrine which was promulgated by men 1900 years into the Church's history. The Church has had theological debates over such issues throughout its existence. Just because someone differs with you doesn't make them "anti-Catholic" any more than the debate over the poverty of Christ rendered either of the opposing sides "anti-Catholic."

I suspect you agree with the author though.
So what? That is only an assertion ad hominem and not a valid deconstruction of the arguments presented.

William of Occam would grab you by the ear and tell you to get thee to a Jesuit for some schooling in the trivium.

15 posted on 04/18/2002 11:46:44 AM PDT by SteamshipTime
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To: SteamshipTime
You seem to be missing my point in posting this article.

I posted this article for Catholics. I wanted to hear from them as to whether this article was as anti-Catholic as it appears to me.

I realized when I posted it though, that good people like you (non-Catholics) would not be able to resist using it as you are using it.

When I said that I suspect that you agree with the author, it was a subtle attempt to refer you to my opening comments in the hope that you would get the hint and step aside.

I certainly did not intend the thread to become a discussion of Catholic beliefs between Catholics and non-Catholics. So, if you would respect my intent, I would like to end our exchange.

19 posted on 04/18/2002 12:10:34 PM PDT by Rum Tum Tugger
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To: SteamshipTime
Was John XXII, fondly referred to as the "whore of Avignon" and whose reputation was so sullied no one would take his papal name for the next 700 years, infallible?

[snip]

William of Occam would grab you by the ear and tell you to get thee to a Jesuit for some schooling in the trivium.

Since infallibility doesn't mean impeccability (sinlessness), what is your point about Pope John XXII ? Are you trying to prove something logically ?
28 posted on 04/18/2002 12:34:01 PM PDT by Mike Fieschko
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To: SteamshipTime
Was John XXII....St. Peter, who denied Christ three times, infallible?

You don't understand what the principle of "infallibility" means. The Pope is "infallible" only when he makes a grave pronouncement on a subject of faith or morals -- not in his every day actions. And "infallible" pronouncements are set apart from other writings and announced after a great deal of studying and praying. And they don't happen very often, as another poster pointed out.

35 posted on 04/18/2002 1:12:17 PM PDT by afraidfortherepublic
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