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Here is another national disgrace at the hands of FDR and Truman
1 posted on 04/15/2002 1:11:20 AM PDT by Angelique
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To: Backhoe; Askel5; LadyX;COB1;History_Matters;Grampa Dave; Sierra#Wasp; 68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub...
This is a great article about the decision to drop the Plutonium Bomb on Nagasaki.
3 posted on 04/15/2002 1:28:57 AM PDT by Angelique
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To: Angelique
Here is another national disgrace at the hands of FDR and Truman

I have no love for Democrats but the fact of the matter is that Truman had more balls than most politicians alive today. I support his decision to drop the bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. If he hadn't done it, there would have been millions more casualties on both sides. His act was more humane than you can possibly realize.
4 posted on 04/15/2002 1:36:11 AM PDT by Bush2000
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To: Angelique
Actually there was a third alternative--blockade. General Lemay and the Navy would have welcomed this alternative as a means of bolstering the value or their respective branches of service. Most of the casualty estimates provided to Truman including that by Douglas MacArthur predicted around 30k American deaths and around 100k wounded in the conquest of Japan. No one predicted hundreds of thousands of American deaths in the event of an invastion. That figure was raised after the war partly to justify the bombing in the face of revisionists. Kokura was the primary target for the second bomb. The pilots decided to move on to the the secondary target, Nagasaki, after heavy haze hindered their appoach to Kokura. If this author's thesis is correct then the fire bombings of German cities were also intended to kill a maximum number of Christians. His thesis also neglects to explain why Tokyo was fire bombed to such great effect. Truman had no hidden agenda. His intention was to end the war at the earliest possible date.

My source for this information is Samuel J. Walker's Prompt and Utter Destruction. University of North Carolina Press, 1997

5 posted on 04/15/2002 1:37:01 AM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: Angelique
Read the book WARS END, written by the American that flew the photography chase plane over Hiroshima and flew the drop plane over Nagasaki.

Unless the Japaneese were willing to unconditionally surrender the bombs should have been used rather than a mainland invasion that would have killed possibly hundreds of thousands of American troops.

America didn't start this war but was willing to end it on our terms.

the Japaneese were ruthless in their pursuit of war. They had commited many many violations of international norm, The rape of nanking, the sneak attack on Pearl, the Bataan death march, the using of prisoners for medical experiments, the using of prisoneers for slave labor,etc etc etc. Hand wringers are trying to rewrite history. Should we have dropped the two bombs? HELL YES, and more if we had any more,which we didn't.If that is what it would have taken.

6 posted on 04/15/2002 1:39:26 AM PDT by Joe Boucher
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To: Angelique
Truman vs Clinton:

Truman saved both Japanese and American lives with his decision. The firebombings would have continued and countless Japanese would have been incinerated in the long term. He saved countless American lives, the estimates are debatable. After Okinawa the death rate of American servicemen in the Pacific Theater dropped to less than 1,000 a month. After Nagasaki it all ended. Patriotic Americans would have crucified Truman if they had known he had the means to end the war in such a quick manner and had not used it.

Now to the recent past. How is Clinton being judged for the Somalia fiasco given it could have been prevented by providing our brave men with the equipment and support they needed to carry out their tasks? He is lauded by the same revisionist leftist crowd that castigates Truman.

20 posted on 04/15/2002 2:38:58 AM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: Angelique
Truman also demonstrated a great deal of political courage by allowing Hirohito to retain the throne, a prospect the vast majority of American's were against as evidenced in contemporary polls.
22 posted on 04/15/2002 2:56:30 AM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: Angelique
This has got to be one of the dumbest conspricy posts I've read here. I'm no fan of FDR or Truman (especially after I just read Blair's The Forgotten War and how Truman decimated the post WWII military), but the idea that Nagasaki was bombed to eliminate Japan's very tiny Christian population is beyond belief and ranks right up there with FDR "allowing" Pearl Harbor to be attacked to get America into the war.

As numerous other posters have brought up, Nagasaki was the secondary target after Kokura (which is also not an inland city as some here suggested-it's on the N.E. coast of Kyushu near the entrance to the the Inland Sea), but that doesn't mean it wasn't a legitimate industrial target on its own. The main Mitsubishi plant was the aiming point, but the bomb missed.

Another poster brought up blockade. In fact, the submarine and aerial mine blockade had nearly brought Japan to it's knees, but not quickly enough to satisfy an America which had seen the end of the war Europe and wanted to get this one over with, too.

The first time I went to my future in-law's house in Nagaski Prefecture, I noticed 2 war era photos on the wall, a woman and a school aged boy. When I asked my wife later who they were, she told me it was her father's older sister and her son, who were killed by the bomb. They didn't live in the city, but by unfortunate chance, went into the city that day.

The fact is, for all the people that died in the atomic bombings, tens, if not hundreds of thousands of lives, both Japanese and American were saved. An invasion of Kyushu would have a bloodbath on a scale that dwarfed Okinawa, the largest battle of the war. The atomic bombing of Nagaski may have "political" in a sense, i.e. let's show the Russians, but it was not bombed because it had a large portion of Japan's tiny Christian population.

26 posted on 04/15/2002 5:26:31 AM PDT by GATOR NAVY
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To: ALL
All, you have to do is read this paragraph and this author is no different than the Americans of today who blame us for the mass murderers on 9/11.

But at the last moment the Secretary of War Henry Stimson, who arguably had knowingly precipitated Japan’s Pearl Harbor attack by instigating an international embargo on its life-or-death oil supplies, removed Kyoto from the list for annihilation and replaced it with Nagasaki.

Ponte is just another anti American Bravo Sierra POS, who will rearrange history to suit his agenda. His POS agenda is simple, blame American for everything!

Blaming Stimson for the Boshida Japanese Racists attack on Pearl Harbor is no different than the POS's who blame 9/11 mass murderers on Americans!

32 posted on 04/15/2002 8:27:42 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: Angelique
On the day Nagasaki was bombed, reporter W.H. Lawrence told New York Times readers that it was “more important industrially” than Hiroshima, a “transshipment” port, and “a major shipbuilding and repair center for both naval and merchantmen.”

Very true. Mitsubishi had two armaments plants at Ohashi. Morimachi and Mitsubishi both had steel plants located in the Urakami Valley, away from the downtown area of Nagasaki. Those targets were detroyed and the residential and business districts of Nagasaki were spared due to the topography of the area.

Bock's Car made three bombing runs on Kokura before Sweeney made the decision to head for the secondary target, Nagasaki. Smoke from the fires still burning from the previous nights bombing of Yawata, by 224 B-29s, prevented the drop on Kokura. Wonder how Stimson was able to manipulate the surface winds to accomplish that feat! One of the many points that revisionists gloss over is this: In the three months that Truman had been President, the United States sustained almost 50% of its total casualties in the Pacific Theater.

On paper it may have appeared that Japan was defeated, but such was not the case. The Japanese conditionally accepted the Potsdam Declaration on 10 August with the following major caveats: Japan would try its own war criminals, Japan would retain control of its troops and disarm said troops itself, the Allies could not occupy the home islands of Japan, Hirohito would remain sovereign ruler. The Allies rejected those terms. Truman counter offered that Hirohito could stay but under the authority of the supreme Allied commander. The Japanese did not reply but instructed their forces to fight on. The Allies toned down their offensive actions and began dropping surrender leaflets instead of bombs. Finally with still no response from Japan, Truman ordered Marshall to resume air raids against Japan. On the 14th Spaatz ordered anything that could carry bombs into the air. The result was the largest raid of the war; 2000 airplanes bombed Japan. High ranking officers planned a coup after Hirohito told them he would announce the surrender to the Japanese people over radio. The coup attempt failed and the message was finally broadcast at noon on the 15th.

33 posted on 04/15/2002 9:15:40 AM PDT by SMEDLEYBUTLER
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To: Angelique
Nagasaki, Mon Amour
35 posted on 04/15/2002 9:29:37 AM PDT by SMEDLEYBUTLER
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To: Angelique
Bump
40 posted on 04/15/2002 2:26:07 PM PDT by nightdriver
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