In Depth: Robert Caro (Three Hours of LBJ on C-SPAN2)

C-SPAN2

[leadpenny]

C-SPAN Schedule

Started at Noon (Eastern)

[PJ-Comix]

However, I can't stomach the idea of spending three hours learning what most of us already know about LBJ, to wit, LBJ was your typical dimocrat: corrupt to the core.

Sorry but you DON'T already know everything about LBJ. True the man had his faults but despite my disagreement with most of his politics he was a master politician. In addition, Caro has found much new (or forgotten) information about LBJ. His article in the current New Yorker is an example. It shows the complexity of LBJ in regards to Civil Rights. Did you know about Johnson's private Chauffer? I think not. Did you know the episode about the burial of a Mexican-American veteran in Arlington Cemetary that LBJ had to back away from after initially instigating it? I think not.

Your attitude seems to be "I don't like LBJ so I won't read a bio of him even though it is masterfully written."

This attitude is like reading only feel-good news. Much can be learned by reading about LBJ and others that you (and I) might not agree with.

[PJ-Comix]

I don't have the stomach to sit through one hour of anything concerning LBJ, let alone three hours.

Ignorance is Bliss.

[PJ-Comix]

You will also see that LBJ had Kennedy killed.

Caro never stated this. Despite the efforts of the conspiracy theorists, what happened is that Lee Harvey Oswald, the LONE gunman assasinated JFK. Where the conspiracty theories find nourishment is that Oswald himself loved to think of himself as part of some espionage network. I knew someone like this so Oswalds delusional thinking is nothing surprising to me. The funny thing is that a lot of folks buy into Oswald's delusions. But enough on oswald, let's get the discussion BACK to Caro and his book.

[Ditter]

I KNOW Caro never said Oswald killed Kennedy, it was a conclusion I made after seeing LBJ up close while reading Caro's books. He was VP, close, but still so far away. He HAD to be president & it was his only way.

[Ditter]

Sorry, I meant to say Caro never said "LBJ" killed Kennedy it was my own conclusion after reading Caro's books. When does the next one come out?

[leadpenny]

He was VP, close, but still so far away. He HAD to be president & it was his only way.

It can't be said any better. Those words should be chiseled on any permanent monument to LBJ.

Again, JMO, but he had to have something to do with any conspiracy, even with eternal deniability. If I had proof, I wouldn't be posting here - I'd be talking to a publisher.

[krb]

Where the conspiracty theories find nourishment is that Oswald himself loved to think of himself as part of some espionage network.

I think the conspiracy theories also get nourishment from the fact that Oswald couldn't have fired so many bullets from so many different directions in such a small space of time by himself.

[leadpenny]

Anyway, however favorably Caro may deal with the later stages of LBJ's political career, the man is irredeemably damned by the LBJ tapes that C-SPAN is running (at least on C-SPAN Radio -- I don't have cable, so I can't say whether they're also on one of C-SPAN's TV channels.) The sycophancy and duplicity on display in those tapes can never be erased.

I've listened to a lot of them while in the car on weekends. Don't know why but I always feel like I need a shower when I turn the ignition off.

[PJ-Comix]

Sorry, I meant to say Caro never said "LBJ" killed Kennedy it was my own conclusion after reading Caro's books.

If you read more about Lee Harvey Oswald you would see that he acted alone. The reason for all the conspiracy theories is that Oswald loved to play spy. He fantisized that he was an agent then a double agent etc.. Basically he wanted to think of himself as a player. The KGB came to this conclusion as well. After Oswald defected (with very little info to offer the Soviets) they concluded that Oswald was living in fantasyland. A nutcase. I've known folks like Oswald. One guy in particular who fantasized that he was in the CIA but also working in a maze of conspiracies as well. I could never really follow it all but basically he, like Oswald, wanted to play spy. The difference is that Oswald also assassinated a President. This was also part of his games. Also the fact that his wife was about to leave him and he wanted to impress her that he was a big man.

When does the next one come out?

Hopefully we won't have to wait another dozen years.

[Ditter]

I agree with all you say about Oswald but he was incompetant. My husband is a lifelong rifle shooter & after visiting the Texas School Book Depository he agreed with me that Oswald had help. He passed up an easy shot at JFK & waited until the very hardest shot. He was shooting a clunker of a gun, not very accurate & he wasn't a very good shot, according to people at the range where he went to practice. It would have been almost impossible to get off that many shots in that length of time & have them hit their mark. Add to that the fact that the back of JFK's head was shot off with the bullet entering his throat. I have seen many deer shot & the entry wound is very small & the exit wound is big. All of thoes things add up to conspiracy with Oswald the patsy just like he said. The person who shot JFK was in front of him (the grassy knoll) not behind him (book depository) LBJ was there to direct the Warren Commission & you were told that Oswald acted alone & you believed it, I don't happen to believe it.

[Ditter]

I agree with all you say about Oswald but he was incompetant. My husband is a lifelong rifle shooter & after visiting the Texas School Book Depository he agreed with me that Oswald had help. He passed up an easy shot at JFK & waited until the very hardest shot. He was shooting a clunker of a gun, not very accurate & he wasn't a very good shot, according to people at the range where he went to practice. It would have been almost impossible to get off that many shots in that length of time & have them hit their mark. Add to that the fact that the back of JFK's head was shot off with the bullet entering his throat. I have seen many deer shot & the entry wound is very small & the exit wound is big. All of thoes things add up to conspiracy with Oswald the patsy just like he said. The person who shot JFK was in front of him (the grassy knoll) not behind him (book depository) LBJ was there to direct the Warren Commission & you were told that Oswald acted alone & you believed it, I don't happen to believe it.

[PJ-Comix]

How about if we keep the discussion to the Caro book to LBJ's years in the Senate? I'm afraid that all future discussion on Caro's book will end up in a debate on the JFK assassination. I would prefer to stick to Caro's book for the discussions. And he is a GREAT writer!

[1L]

However, I can't stomach the idea of spending three hours learning what most of us already know about LBJ, to wit, LBJ was your typical dimocrat: corrupt to the core.

I can't speak to any phone conference, but Caro's volumes are more than just LBJ. Caro's first book was a detailed discussion of Texas political history in the early 20th Century. While I haven't read the third volume yet, I suspect it will be a detailed discussion of Senate politics.

[1L]

It could be that the overconfident Republicans are facing an unexpected defeat in the fall,

I would hope that you don't actually believe this since it is BS. In truth Daffy Duck could run on a statewide Republican ticket and still win. First of all, Morales is going to win the primary Tuesday since 1) he will get more of his supporters to the polls and 2) the Texas RATs who think they are the Democrat establishment in Texas (even though there isn't one) believe that Morales has a better chance against Cornyn than Kirk. Second, Morales' campaign will be limited to this summer because his wife won't let him quit his teaching job. That's how far the RAT party has fallen in Texas. Cornyn could win this race without spending half a million, since that's about all Morales will have.

[Theodore R.]

I just do not share your extreme overconfidence. I hope you are right, but if you are right, conservatives will be left at the door and told they were unneeded to the Perry-Cornyn "victory," which has yet to happen!

[Ditter]

He is a great writer & I can't wait to discuss his new book, just as soon as I read it.

[Ward Smythe]

He is a great writer & I can't wait to discuss his new book, just as soon as I read it.

I can't believe how long we've had to wait for the third book...But I'm glad it's on the way.

[Theodore R.]

It has been 20 years since the TX "democracy" swept all constitutional offices. That was 1982, when Phil Gramm won his last election to the House as a Democrat, and Gramm's one-time intraparty rival Lloyd M. Bentsen, Jr., was elected again to the U.S. Senate. One of those Democrats elected that year was Treasurer Ann Willis Richards, a loud-mouth who went on to higher office. The Democrats are very confident in 2002. Ann Richards has endorsed Ron Kirk, saying he is "like a son" to her. Kirk was also once an aide to Bentsen and now has the enthusiastic endorsement of the Bentsen family. Surprisingly, many Texans consider the Bentsens "conservative." It could be because of Lloyd's Texas accent. All the Democrats are uniting behind Tony "Moneybags" Sanchez for governor. Meanwhile, the Republican slate seems oblivious that its members even have opposition. I was wondering who the people on the forum see as the strongest single Republican candidate this year. Could it be Comptroller Carole Keeton Rylander? Just my guess.

[AdvisorB]

Ignorance may be bliss, PJ, but arrogance isn't. You need to lighten up, friend.

[PJ-Comix]

I can't speak to any phone conference, but Caro's volumes are more than just LBJ. Caro's first book was a detailed discussion of Texas political history in the early 20th Century. While I haven't read the third volume yet, I suspect it will be a detailed discussion of Senate politics.

BINGO!!! You hit the nail on the head. Although the books are bios of LBJ they are also much much more than that. For example, in the first volume Caro has an incredible chapter on what electrification meant to people living in rural areas. We also learn quite a bit about Texas politics such as about the colorful Pappy "Pass the Biscuits" O'Daniel and Texas style ballot stuffing. We also find out what it is like to be a congressional aide. I'm sure the third volume will let us know how the Senate operated back then. I have learned more about how politics REALLY works from Caro's two LBJ volumes than any other books. Poly-sci courses only touch the surface of politics. Caro's books gets into the nitty gritty of politics.

This is what irritates me about folks who say they won't read Caro's books about LBJ because they don't like LBJ. So what do they want? To read simplistic Happy Face type books that makes them feel good but gives them no idea of how the real world works? Yes, LBJ was corrupt and had many other faults but he is also fascinating to read about. (Can't wait to read Master of the Senate.