Celibacy of the priesthood is a church strength, not a liability

Mpls (red) Star Tribune ^ | 4/3/02 | Katherine Kersten

[yooper]

I hear you. Come to think of it, one of the questions the priest asked me during the pre-marital councilling I alluded to earlier was "Have you ever had any homosexual thoughts." I'm not kidding; he really did. Of course I told him "none of your damn business", and things kinda went downhill after that, and after I got a kick in the shins from my betrothed under the table, but we wound up getting married in the Catholic church by a Deacon and the minister from my Methodist church. That's right, the priest allowed a bi-denominational service!

The kicker to all of this is that this priest later fell in love with a woman in the church. He resigned from the priesthood in order to marry her, something which I hugely respected.....

[redhead]

"Well, there's a difference here. Homo boy scout leaders gravitate to the boy scouts because they're pedophile homos and that's where the boys are. Priests who are involved in this present scandal (which is to say not the vast majority of priests) prey on little boys because that's what they have access to. If there were such a thing as altar girls they would be targets too.

A vast majority of the priests involved have chosen to assault teenaged boys. The pedophiles are a very small percentage of the total.

There ARE altar girls in many liberal parishes. It doesn't have even the slightest bearing on sexual assaults on teenaged boys, some as old as 16.

[Canticle_of_Deborah]

*ahem* In those times it was very dangerous to travel, hence the necessity of men traveling in pairs or more. It was too dangerous for women to travel much at all.

Watch out, with the logic you used someone could make a case for gay marriage.

[Joshua]

". Everyone seems to have forgotten the command to "Go forth and multiply" "

"Celibacy is a heroic sacrifice for a greater good, and the church must do a much better job of explaining this to young men. "

And let us not forget this one: Go and learn what this means "I desire mercy not sacrifice" (Matt 9:13)

[Joshua]

"Things I think about if a Priest is allowed to marry: a). What if he has marital problems that lead to divorce? Will the Church be asked to pay alimony and child support? b). What if their children get into all sorts of trouble with the law? Will the Church be asked to pay for defense costs? c). Tuition, medical, dental, housing, clothing, cars, insurance, will the Church be asked to fund? "

I'm with you. I think it would be cost effective to just pay lawyer and court costs on all the abuse cases that are beginning to come forward. (/sarcasm)

[DennisR]

The New Testament says this:

1 Tim 4:1-3--

1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. (NKJ)"

So to teach abstention from marriage is a doctrine of demons. There are other places in the New Testament that discuss remaining single, but it is voluntary, not mandatory. And it should be this way with the Catholic Church, also.

[razorbak]

1Tim.3:1 This [is] a faithful saying: If a man desires the position of a bishop, he desires a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach; 3 not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money, but gentle, not quarrelsome, not covetous; 4 one who rules his own house well, having [his] children in submission with all reverence 5 (for if a man does not know how to rule his own house, how will he take care of the church of God?); 6 not a novice, lest being puffed up with pride he fall into the [same] condemnation as the devil. 7 Moreover he must have a good testimony among those who are outside, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

[FITZ]

Married priests would be a different set of potential problems. Adultery, divorce ---and you're right ---kids could be a problem. I once knew a daughter of a Lutheran minister who hated growing up in a fishbowl ---she said they had to sit in the front and the parishioners would be horrified when they started fighting in church as little kids. She told us that she believed ministers shouldn't have children because it wasn't fair to the children to make them be some kind of "example" for others to watch.

[FITZ]

It could be like the Eastern Orthodox do it ---they let married men become priests but priests don't marry ---so you don't have the problem of them "datings" etc. Or else married deacons could take on more duties but not have quite the status of priests. Either way ---married priests isn't the only answer ---the main thing is to get the homosexuals out. If they're homosexual but celibate then they could stay.

[IncredibleHulk]

I'll bet you used to sleep a lot in school, didn't you? Maybe you went to one of those alternative joints that let you determine your own curriculum.

Actually, I went to one of those joints where they fired our teacher for making all of us non-catholics recite the Lords Prayer before we could eat our lunch. And as a member of Mensa, I can probably sleep through any class and learn more real knowledge than you can awake.

[JessicaDragonet]

According to the Bible...celibacy is a gift. To make it a prerequisite to the priesthood is not only unbiblical...but against nature itself. The failure of this rule has been an open secret for centuries. If the church has the authority to make rules....they also have the authority to change them.

[sailor4321]

Nancy is one sick puppy! She may have been a flower child --- her bitterness sounds like something that has germinated in the disappointment which follows shallow ideals. Given the rigor of her thinking, I doubt that Kerstein was anybody's "flower child"...

[sailor4321]

Gosh! They must have been pretty stupid all these centuries, having to deal with priests (even a Pope or two) who weren't up to celibacy, trying to fight human nature by insisting this was the ideal way for priests to carry out their role. St. Benedict even insisted on celibacy in his monasteries in the 4th century! What an indiot, huh?

[history_matters]

And as a member of Mensa, I can probably sleep through any class and learn more real knowledge than you can awake.

God bless your pointed little head.

[history_matters]

I wish you people could figure this out: celibacy is the normal discipline of the Latin Rite, it is not a matter of doctrine -- and dispensation from celibacy is granted to married Lutheran and Episcopalian ministers who become Catholic priests. Married men can be ordained to the Eastern rites of the Catholic Church.

The Catholic Church does not require celibacy of anyone; you can choose to be married and serve Christ in a hundred different ways apart from those that require the discipline of celibacy. The discipline of being a monk, nun, or a regular Latin rite priest means you choose to be a eunuch for Christ's sake. There are hundreds of ways to serve God in the Catholic Church. Our disciplines are not unbiblical doctrines of demons.

[Codie]

If anyone else has pointed out the fact that celibacy is indeed a choice I haven't seen it.Kudos for you! I don't understand why people have a problem with this.

[Orual]

The priest is to follow Christ's example in every aspect of his life, making a total gift of his life and love to all around him.

What those who advocate that priests should marry always forget is that a priest is different from the rest of us and is held to a much higher standard. The priest is married to the Church - one priest once described his Breviary as his wife. I cannot believe that the priests who make the headlines read their Breviaries every day as they are required to - those beautiful daily prayers would have strengthened them and kept their minds on their vows and Holy Orders.

Putting aside the fact that a priest has not the time nor the finances to support a wife and children and that such a relationship would be doomed from the start, a priest is bound by Canon Law to be a member of a Community of priests, whether it is as a Franciscan or a Dominican or any number of other Priestly Societies. He must live and pray with them, again gaining strength and support from his brother priests.

Celibacy is a God-given grace and cannot be measured within the self-gratification norms of our "present sex-drenched culture", as Kersten describes it so perfectly. Those who argue for marriage for priests simply do not understand the sanctity and holiness of the vocation, and the duties that attend to it.

[JessicaDragonet]

Hey..if your happy then I'm happy.

[born yesterday]

Celibate homosexuals would not work. Homosexuality remains a death loving abberation. What if the Church's authoritative priesthood as in the Roman Catholic world displayed approval of homosexuality. This would display an ugly role modeling.

[FITZ]

I think you're probably right. I'm not sure exactly what the definition of homosexual is. If some one never committed a gay act then probably they aren't one.