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1 posted on 03/15/2002 6:22:07 AM PST by Mulder
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To: Mulder
>>"They say the office opinion on this case is, 'It's a good shooting,'"<<

I wonder how many of these Brownshirts are going to burn in Hell?

79 posted on 03/15/2002 2:41:08 PM PST by SerpentDove
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To: Mulder
Well the big "shake-up" at INS was having four incompetent bureaucratic geeks play musical chairs. What will happen at the FBI? Probably a sensitivity training course i.e. don't shoot the taxpayers morons!
89 posted on 03/15/2002 4:51:56 PM PST by Righty1
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To: Mulder
Clean Shoot??? Oh yeah, like TWA 800, a clean fuel tank explosion! Waco, a clean funeral pyre! Ruby Ridge, a clean mother and infant shooting! Vince Foster, a clean cover-up shooting! OKC, a clean ATF bungle!

The FBI! F*cking Bureaucratic Incompetents!! They're dishonest, violent, lying bastards! The New Gestapo!! And they're coming to your house next!!! Be ready! Be prepared!

90 posted on 03/15/2002 4:52:19 PM PST by Doc Savage
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To: Mulder
BTTT
99 posted on 03/15/2002 5:43:21 PM PST by griffin
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To: Mulder
BTTT
101 posted on 03/15/2002 5:56:10 PM PST by Unicorn
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To: Mulder
"There's no middle ground in this thing. You're either with us or against us."

OK you arrogant bastards, you asked for it. I'm against.

103 posted on 03/15/2002 6:05:36 PM PST by wcbtinman
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To: Mulder
My Uncle Bob was a 30 year veteran of a police force in suburban Cleveland. He was best man at my wedding 40 years ago. He served in an era when MOST cops embodied the now frequently hollow motto emblazoned on patrol cars all over this country: “TO PROTECT AND SERVE.”

The last years of his career were spent as the Chief Juvenile Detective in his department. When he died, a number of the young men whose lives he’d touched years before came forward to tell how his timely and sometimes tough-love intervention turned them around.

I know that many officers STILL try to live that creed today. I also know that there are officers out there who, despite the rulings by the Supremes that they have no obligation to specific, individual citizens, would stand between one of us and a bullet – and have.

My sister is married to a good guy – who was also a good cop.

And I STILL vividly recall a business trip and having a flat tire. I pulled onto the narrow shoulder and was opening the trunk when I spied a Georgia State Trooper’s car cross the median, hit the flashers and pull in some distance behind me and a bit closer to the road, shielding me and my car from the 70 MPH traffic. SHE got out and asked if I needed any help. I told her I could probably handle it. She said she’d keep her unit there until I got done.

THEN she spotted my cane and saw that I was partially disabled. Before I could object, she was in the trunk, had wrestled the spare to the ground and was jacking up the car, all the while asking me to remain safely near the guard rail. About that time, two county deputies stopped and pitched in. The lady trooper cut her hand fooling with the jack and soiled her freshly pressed uniform wrestling the dirty flat back into the trunk. They couldn’t have been nicer! I took their names and wrote highly complimentary letters to their superiors – all of whom promptly acknowledged them and thanked me for the kind words.

These officers – like my uncle – grasped the significance of “To Protect and Serve.”

I also recognize that the cops – like Gort in “The Day The Earth Stood Still” -- are simply the muscle (the “enforcement”) behind the legislative and statutory “law” enacted by society as a whole. That is, after all, why it’s called “LAW ENFORCEMENT.” And although it could be argued that this society may be morphing into the homonym for “whole” as you read this, these laws are enacted by our alleged “representatives” meeting in generally safe, quiet and opulent chambers far from the increasingly mean streets where the cops ply their trade. If the cops have too many intrusive and abusive laws to enforce, check the nearest mirror for a likeness of the responsible party.

And if the cops ARE abusive to the general citizenry, why aren’t HUNDREDS or THOUSANDS of us RAISING UNHOLY HELL at each and every meeting of the responsible governing body? French political philosopher Joseph D'Maistre declared that "Every people gets the government they deserve."

Have we really become the “nation of sheep” an author foresaw many years ago? If so, we have little right to object to the shearing. Or the coming slaughter and culling of the flock. And my guess is that the culling will begin with the most troublesome and noisiest sheep. And guess who THAT is?

An old friend is a ranking officer with a large police department. I would rate his love of our freedoms and the Constitution against anyone here at FR. A few years ago, he told me that IF the order to begin some sort of weapons round-up among the general citizenry ever came down from “on high,” we would quickly know about it from the reports of disturbances and gunfire from the neighborhood cop shop: Fully HALF the officers in his department are Second Amendment guys. He and they would be the first to resist such an order – physically if necessary. What should scare us all is the shift in our demographics and the continuing leftist indoctrination by the government schools, making it impossible to know how much longer that ratio – and sentiment – will hold.

Having said that, I also recognize that EVERY large barrel contains some bad apples -- and SOME cops are “cowboys.” Some are simply power driven megalomaniacs who would have dropped on the OTHER side of the law had their lives drifted a degree or two off the course they did take.

I believe this to be especially true of far too many federal law enforcement types who have allowed their egos and hubris to become as bloated as the bureaucratic federal behemoth they serve. Their mandate is no longer to “…protect and serve” the citizens who pay their salaries: It is to crush any meaningful resistance to a growing body of procedures, regulations and policies – too frequently enforced under severely tortured interpretations of the underlying legislative enactments (if any) – and often put in place by executive fiat. The massively abused SEIZURE statutes – laws the author of which now seeks to RESCIND! -- spring to mind.

And one cannot but help to wonder how the clear criminality of the Clintons – and their subsequent avoidance of any penalty – has played into the problem. There now seems to be a bright line between the easy, highly flexible, slap-on-the-wrist law for the rich and powerful and the rigidly enforced law against even the tiniest victimless “crimes” committed by those of us further down the food chain. Does anyone in his right mind believe THAT will NOT engender added disrespect for ALL law?

Could those things be a large part of the problem in some of the highly disturbing – and DEADLY (on BOTH sides) – confrontations we have witnessed over the past decade or so? Gordon Kahl, Ruby Ridge, OK City, Waco, Beck… This list WILL lengthen and we’d all better pray that WE will be spared.

Roman historian Tacitus warned that one could tell the level of corruption in a society by the NUMBER of its laws. Anyone doubt the level of corruption here?

Am I the only one who thinks we’re long overdue a serious review of the NUMBERS of laws under which we are now forced to exist – and which are increasingly used not to assure our safety or well-being, but to COMMAND AND CONTROL us and KEEP US IN LINE.

Only the most tyrannical and power-crazed members of law enforcement could possibly object to that.

The modern counterparts of my Uncle Bob would not object.

It is THEY, after all, who are most likely to catch that bullet – probably fired by someone who has symbolically screamed to himself “I’M MAD AS HELL AND I’M NOT GONNA TAKE IT ANY MORE” -- referred to earlier when they sally forth to serve that flimsy warrant or make that bogus arrest.

106 posted on 03/15/2002 6:46:44 PM PST by Dick Bachert
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To: Mulder
""There's no middle ground in this thing. You're either with us or against us." "

Yeah, most of us know that. How does it feel to be the declared enemy of the FBI, folks?

108 posted on 03/15/2002 7:04:50 PM PST by Don Myers
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To: Mulder
he was told by one of the agents: "There's no middle ground in this thing. You're either with us or against us."

Someone needs to tell the agent, and fast, that US in the president's context means AMERICANS, and THEM means TERRORISTS and those who support or harbor them. The agent is a loose cannon rolling around deck waiting to explode.

110 posted on 03/15/2002 7:07:01 PM PST by GretchenEE
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To: Mulder
Dudley F.B. "Butch" Hodgson, a former FBI agent who has been retained by the shooting victim's lawyers, said he was told by one of the agents: "There's no middle ground in this thing. You're either with us or against us."

That sounds to me like a threat uttered with intent to obstruct justice.

128 posted on 03/15/2002 7:48:19 PM PST by cynwoody
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To: Mulder
These FBI dudes are slimey. Sounds like something close to obstruction of justice.
135 posted on 03/15/2002 8:54:07 PM PST by savedbygrace
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To: Mulder
BTTT
162 posted on 03/16/2002 7:15:13 AM PST by Unicorn
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To: Mulder
BTTT
163 posted on 03/16/2002 7:15:13 AM PST by Unicorn
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To: Mulder
Do you think 3M is still proud of this agent?

The 13th annual 3M/IAATI Vehicle Theft Investigation Award was presented at the annual IAATI meeting in Virginia Beach, Va. The honored team comprises Sergeant James D. Holmes, Officer David Dyhouse and Detective Marshall Trigg from the Metro Transit Police; Sergeant Pride Rivers, Lieutenant Rob Turano and Corporal Thomas Dupczak of the Maryland State Police; Special Agent Christopher R. Braga and Special Agent Molly Flynn with the FBI; Detective Robin Russell and Detective Chuck Penny with the Montgomery County Police; Agent Greg Klees with the Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms Laboratory; Jeremiah J. Smith with the National Insurance Crime Bureau; and Steven M. Dettelbach and Brent J. Gurney with the U.S. Attorney's Office in Greenbelt, Md.

181 posted on 03/16/2002 2:14:10 PM PST by the
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To: Mulder
. Their supervisor, Lynne A. Hunt, special agent in charge of the Baltimore office, was out of town and not available for comment.

She was probably in NYC,shopping for new shoes with Bubbette! and making sure her career was still on track.

208 posted on 03/17/2002 5:31:47 AM PST by sneakypete
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To: Mulder
What was on that Communist "goals" list...oh yeah, #35...Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.
Easy enough to accomplish. Just get enough incompetents on the job so that it becomes a reality.
Case in point, this incident.
That's their story and they're sticking to it.
And "You're either with us or against us."
220 posted on 03/17/2002 6:26:22 AM PST by philman_36
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To: Mulder
A good shooting???? Did the kid point a gun at the agent???Then how can they say it was a good shooting.

Please don't tell me that this former Marine, combat veteran, etc. etc. etc. was frightened by this kid unbuckling his seat belt.

If what this investigator says is true, 'your either for us or against us' put me down for against.

Unbelievable

240 posted on 03/17/2002 11:41:35 AM PST by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Mulder
http://www.freerepublic.com/fo cus/news/709857/posts?page=1
247 posted on 07/02/2002 4:08:39 PM PDT by NC_Libertarian
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