America First: Why we need to examine our insane Foreign policy

self | 12/29/2001 | Demidog

[Demidog]

I am not an America hater by any stretch of the imagination. Nor are the plethora of folks calling for a re-examination of our foreign policies. But that's what we're called.

I wish I knew why.

I really don't want to be against any American. I don't like being on the butt end of insults. So if there were a way to somehow explain what it is that bothers me about our foreign policy without the resultant cries of "traitor! treason! Islam firster!" I would.

One of the main problems apears to be that any "agreement" with bin Laden and his band of murdering thugs is seen to be support. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is probably true that bin Laden knows that water is tantamount to life in the desert. If I agree with this, I am no more supporting bin Laden than you are by agreeing.

When we decry any actions taken by Israel, we are "anti-semites." When Israel admitted that they had set a booby trap near an area where children played and 5 Palestinian boys died when it went off, you couldn't get near the topic without being ridiculed.

This is puzzling to me. There is nothing wrong per se with Israel and certainly not Jews, but for certain they are not perfect. For some, Israel is perfection and any criticism is tantamount to racism. Those who disagree are shouted down with such fervor it makes one pause.

American policies aren't perfect either. It is arguable for instance that John Wayne's death from cancer could be attributed to nuclear tests performed back in the 40's. Movie locations happened to be in the area where tests occurred. Many film industry professionals who worked on movies filmed in Nevada died from cancer including that great American we called "the Duke."

Many soldiers who were in the vicinity of those tests also died from cancer.

Why is it an indictment on all of America to bring such mistakes to light? In general, the American population has no say so in the slightest regarding these sorts of activities nor do they have much say in our foreign policy.

But as usual, it is the American population that has to accept the consequences of Policy mistakes made by the government. To say that those who object to this "hate America" is completely absurd.

The truth is quite the opposite.

I love America. And those who decry our foreign policy blunders and the theft of our hard earned money that is necessary in order to carry out these blunders also love America. We're simply tired of having to pay the price for those mistakes, while those who carry them out never have to suffer the consequences.

One of the most bizarre claims by those who are calling us "America haters" and "Islam firsters" is that terorrists are simply angry that we are so democratic as a nation and love freedom. These terrorists "hate freedom" and thus hate America and Americans. They're "jealous," in other words, of our prosperity.

This is about as brilliant an analysis as claiming that Timothy McVeigh was upset that he was no longer an employee of the federal government and thus took out his jealosy and rage on that same federal government.

It is the analysis of the simpleton.

The fact is, we only know what the terrorists claim. Not that it matters much. The opinions of mass murderers are not that important. Clearly however, this is not what any of the terrorists are saying. What they are saying is that they believe themselves to be oppressed by our foreign intervention.

When students took Iranian embassy employees hostage, their reason given for such extraordinary measures was American meddling in Iranian internal affairs.

The Shah of Iran was our personally hand-picked leader for their country. The CIA had, in the time period between the time we basically annexed Iran during WWII, purposefully destroyed opposition to the Shah by using tactics they had learned in South America.

None of those tactics were even remotely related to "freedom" or the principles upon which this nation was founded. They were the actions of a government that believed the Iranian people were chattle and were not worthy of chosing their own leadership.

So what happened? A number of Americans paid the price for our meddling. When we allowed the Shah to enter America to receive medical treatment, the last straw was put upon the back of that proverbial camel.

And that is not to mention the American lives that were sacrificed in a botched rescue attempt. For some, these lives are expendable. They are the price a nation pays for being a "super power." I agree with that assesment. But I don't think we need to be a superpower. I don't think we need to meddle in the affairs of other nations in order to protect our borders.

As is proven time and time again, such meddling has a high price.

And therein lies the rub. Dying in order to defend this nation from an attacking force is national defense and is noble. Sending young men and women across the globe to secure oil fields and preserve the "American way of life" is a sick project. I for one, am not willing to lose a single American for the cynical goal of sub-dollar-a-gallon fuel for my SUV.

If that is the measure of value for an American life then you can call me an America hater all day long and I will be proud to wear that badge.

I criticize our foreign policies because they result in the deaths of American soldiers and citizens at home and abroad. In no way do I criticize Americans. In the aftermath of the Trade Center attacks, it wasn't the government that responded with such ferocity and bravery. It was the average American.

The Beaurocrats were busy playing CYA and letting us know that none of this was their fault. In the meantime, Americans came up with over 60 million dollars in cash and even more in valuable resources in spite of the fact that they are taxed to the extreme in order to pay for the very policies that helped to incubate the attacks of 9/11.

America proved it's greatness in the response to the attacks. The government proved it's complete disregard for human liberty by passing laws which violate the spirit and letter of the Supreme law of the land. Even while the fires were still burning.

America is a great nation and is full of great people. Unfortunately its leaders have no respect for its people or its laws. Pointing this out is not showing hate for anything but the lawbreakers who do so.

[JakeWyld]

Yes. I figured you would notice that. While I consider myself a libertarian and I have seen compelling arguments for total privitization I have trouble swallowing some aspects of it....it doesn't fit in with basic economics.

I know I'm at odds....and I see why the LP argues for total privitization which, imho, can work.

However, it would take a community comprised entirely of libertarians for total privitazation to work. Since they all believed in it...they would all do it. However, the likelyhood of that happening is slim...you will have some people that absolutely refuse to pay, and for better or for worse we are in this together so it will take some coercion to make things work.

I believe this for our current system. I understand that some people don't make a lot of money, but everyone should pay. They shouldn't be exempt just because they are a voting bloc for a certain political party...any guesses as to which :)

[Roscoe]

...they spit upon the memories of the dead...

Like when they spit on Arlington National Cemetary...never mind, that was somebody else.

[Don W]

LOL. When I downloaded the file, there were fewer than 100 posts, so pray tell how I can read something that isn't posted?

As I'm on a 100 hrs p/mo dialup, I download a whack of items, peruse them at my leisure, and go back online should something pique my interest. Pardon my lack of adsl, but it's not available here yet, and I refuse to get cable.

as to the "thou shalt nots", I do my best to obey the 10 commandments.

BTW, libertarian philosophy is what gave birth to the USA. A pity there are those who have failed to comprehend the simple rules enshrined in the US Constitution and Bill of Rights.

[carenot]

Changing our foreign policy would only make us look weak to the rest of the world, look weak to the terrorists, and that is asking for trouble. Changing our foreign policy, IMHO, would only lead to more American deaths.

I disagree. If we change our foreign policy, they will, maybe, respect us again and stop killing or harming any American citizen.

I remember in early '60s, no country dared to harm an American citizen.

I don't remember when that changed.

[Demidog]

I never spit upon Arlington. I said it was socialist in nature but then again Davy Crocket voiced the same sorts of sentiments when he rejected a bill funding the widows of veterans. Now, if you feel that Davy Crocket was spitting upon the widows of veterans you say it loudly and proudly, Troll.

[Roscoe]

the LP argues for total privitization which, imho, can work

In some ways, LPers have the same mindset as central planners. They're both so convinced that they have things all figured out, and that the complexities of the world are encompassed by their respective philosophies.

I'd like to see them manage a successful test flight.

[monkeyshine]

We're way past that, man. Keep up.

[Rowdee]

Doesn't the Bible say that man can't serve two masters?

[Demidog]

In some ways, LPers have the same mindset as central planners.

Inane troll.

[JakeWyld]

I would too. The LP platform says a lot of good things when it comes to the FedGov. There is going to be government control somewhere, this the LP doesn't want to concede

Add in the fact that every candidate that could ever communicate our ideas well stuck to raving endlessly about the drug issue, I ran for the hills...

Federalism seems to be the way to go. I think my energy would be better spent arguing for states' rights now.

[exodus]

Great article, Demidog!

To question the policies
and actions of government
is the very basis of our
free political system.

As long as our leaders
keep secret the reasons
for their activities,
there will be a real need
for skeptical citizens.

Uninformed people cannot
operate a Republic.

[Michael2001]

"Make your case FOR foreign aid. Why is it GOOD foreign policy?"

Regarding our aid to Israel: Israel is a small country of about 5 million, surrounded by about 600 million enemies. Israel would most likely still survive if we cut off aid, but they might not. It is entirely possible that left all alone Israel might not survive, and 5 million Israelis would be pushed into the sea.

You might ask why we should care that Israel is pushed into the sea. Now I am a Christian and I have my own reasons for supporting Israel, but I try not to discuss religion on FR. Why should an atheist who only cares about America care if Israel falls?- Well what do you think would happen to America if Israel falls? What happens when Israel no longer exists and the Arabs/Muslims are done celebrating, they will still be dirt poor except they won't have Israel to blame anymore. All the blame will be placed on the shoulders of the great Satan, and they will be envigorated after their most recent victory.

During the Yom Kippur war the Arabs had a slogan, "first the Saturday people, then the Sunday people". When the Saturday people are no more, the Sunday people better start worrying.

If there are 250 million people in the United States, we each pay about 12 dollars a year to help suppprt Israel. I consider that a small price to pay. Considering that together with my wife I pay 30,000 dollars a year (on a good year) to Uncle Sam, most of it going to welfare mothers and BS social and government programs, I am glad that at least 12 of those dollars (less than 1%) go to something I support.

[Rowdee]

..."sooner we drop the bravado of being THE LAST REMAINING SUPERPOWER"...

I agree with this definitely!

[Michael2001]

"If it's all about making the non-believers swear alliegance to Allah, why not go up against the Chinese? Or Inida? They're closer, there's more of them, and they don't share the same God at all."

Well there do seem to be Islamic terrorists in India (they recently killed a bunch of members of their parliament) and China doesn't have our freedoms (harder to get in, harder to operate). Islamic militants set off a bomb in China and the next day there are no Muslims in China, the Chinese don't mess around.

But of course we are the main target. We are the most powerful non-Muslim country in the world. We are a superpower and they don't like it. After the towers fell, there was commentary in the Muslim world, gloating- look at those stupid Americans running, the great superpower brought to its knees. Any two bit terrorist can kill people in India, but to kill so many Americans, only a Superhero, a man of honor can do that (their thinking).

If it's not all about making non-believers swear to Allah then why did Bin Laden say exactly that in his tape (to his friends, when he thought no Westerner would ever see it).

[Roscoe]

CPers: If only we could abolish private property and private enterprise, everything would just fall into place!

LPers: If only we could abolish public property and public institutions, everything would just fall into place!

Myopic, either way.

[RGSpincich]

At least one administration has spit on the dead servicemen who have defended America. The present administration has not and has not exhibited a disrespect for the American prople. The concern has been to safeguard lives while working within our constitutional framework. Bush shot down the idea of a national ID early on but many continue to this day to blame him for trying to institute it.

You reserve you essays for your hatred of Americans not the enemy. Every time it starts out the same 'I love my country but..' You still maintain that there is nothing concrete linking OBL to the WTC. By using the same burden of proof tell us which current American leader is guilty of breaking laws and ignoring the supreme law of the land. Video taped confessions, evidently, are not admissable.

[Texasforever]

Whining is so statist:

inane
You fell for the bait.
Baiting
Don't forget their huge satisfaction when the thead gets pulled because of that same baiting.
That's their exact goal: to clutter up the threads with a bunch of irrelevant flame-baiting so people get discouraged and those who have something intelligent and relevant to say are intimidated by all the filth they have to wade through.
No, their whole purpose is to pervert the thread and change the topic. Extra bonus points to the shills if anyone gets banned.
Off-topic Baiting.
Off-topic Baiting.
Baiting.
Glad to see the "Jack Booted Thugs" supporter showed up.

[Demidog]

Another inane troll.

[Demidog]

The present administration has not

They absolutely have when they signed the Orwellian titled "Patriot Act."

[Michael2001]

"We can't do anything that would concede the slightest to the terrorists even if it means more human suffering and death. After all, the most important thing here is not protecting our nation but being "right.""

I don't know how you got that out of my post. Conceding to the terrorists would mean more American deaths. That is why we must never concede to the terrorists.