The Problem

Me

[Howlin]

I drove: obeyed the laws.

Flushed a toilet.

Used a credit card.

[Jefferson Adams]

That so many on FR support the insane policies being put into action by our government is sad, but understandable given the huge amount of conditioning that occurs every where you look in our society.

Yes.

I, for one, have believed for maybe 5 years now that America is gone. I keep fighting primarily because, as a Christian, I believe that I'm called to stand for what's right. But we ain't gonna win this one, folks. There *is* going to be a global government, our rights have been transmogrified into privileges that "our" government can give and take at their whimsy. Most likely, it all just plays into the last days scenario that the Bible describes.

There really is no difference between the Republicans and the Democrats at this point. It's all smoke and mirrors to keep the sheep occupied while The Agenda goes forward, regardless of who's in office. With the Constitution now essentially totally ignored, by both Rs and Ds, there is nothing to stop them.

I suggest that it's time to start thinking about how you and your family are going to survive under what's coming. Start thinking details - there are a lot of choices to be made. For Christians, we can still be Light, and Light shines brightest in Darkness. And ultimately, that's what's most important.

[A.J.Armitage]

Instead of using the Constitution as a reason to oppose some government action, why don't you try the mental exercise of justifying your position on the practical impact that the action would have on people's lives. If the Constitution is as unerringly sacred as you believe, it should be easy for you to show that the Constitutional position produces the best results for real people. When you are able to do that, you won't need to use the Constitution as a crutch.

Two things. First, the Constitution is the law of the land, and every member of Congress and the president swear oaths to uphold it, so any politician who doesn't follow it is by definition a liar and not to be trusted.

Second, you can't trust any and all future politicians to do what'd right, which is why they must be forced to obey a set of limits. It isn't so much that they can't be trusted to know what right (although they can't be trusted for that, either), they can't be trusted to do what's right. If I were a politician, I would not exclude myself from that. All of them must be limited.

[zeugma]

By making the President and his administration turn his attention, even for a moment, from defeating our enemies to having to campaign for support from the American people, whose obligation it is to support him, you are endangering the lives of my family.

It is exactly the thought embodied in the bolded quote above that is extremely dangerous to the liberty of present and future americans.

It is not my obligation to support the president, it is the president's obligation to support the constitution. That's His Job. He's not doing that very well at the moment. He's prosecuting the undeclared 'war' well, but he's not doing anything to protect rights guaranteed us by the Constitution.

[alpowolf]

During a war, such as we are in now, the militia is subject to military discipline. By attempting to thwart the authority of the Commander in Chief, you are trying to accomplish a mutiny

So sorry, that's not correct. Read Article II, Section 2: "The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;"...which hasn't happened yet.

[A.J.Armitage]

He wasn't calling America Nazi, he was calling you a Nazi. You proved him right.

[Jefferson Adams]

The fact that this nation is at war makes it MORE imperative that we citizens do our duty and see that the Constitution is upheld.

What an interesting sentence. According to the Constitution, we are NOT at war, unless it's declared by Congress. And Bush is NOT the Commander in Chief short of being in a declared war.

But then, who's counting? The Constitution has been dead for several years now.

[zeugma]

"Let's have no more talk of faith in men. Let the chains of the Constitution bind them down!"

Well said!

The vast majority of the people have no idea what powers the Constitution actually delegated to Fedgov. Article I Section 8 just ain't that long.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

It implies that Bush is the only one doing anything and we are all just along for the ride.

The President is the Commander in Chief, in absolute command of the military. As a member of the citizen militia, you have both a moral and a legal obligation to support him in his decisions, while the war is still going on. If you believe that he has usurped his authority, then under the Geneva convention you have an obligation to attempt to remove him from office, presuming that you are willing to suffer the consequences of committing mutiny.

Elections will of course be held, but the position of mutineers will only be successful, if the country faces defeat. That would mean that your interests, and the interests of our country's enemies would be the same, to ensure the military defeat of the United States. For should we prevail you would be in the same positon as the fictional Philip Nolan, in The Man Without a Country condemned to wander a world in which you will never again be permitted to hear the name 'The United States'.

[OWK]

I drove: obeyed the laws.

You'll pardon my raised eyebrow, and my skepticism.

[A.J.Armitage]

So you think fighting for freedom at exactly the point it's being attacked makes you the same as Adolf Hitler?

[OWK]

According to the Constitution, we are NOT at war, unless it's declared by Congress.

AYup....

But don't tell the others here.

They think we're at war, and they don't think any criticism is to be allowed.

[illbenice]

You know, some of us don't think that everything bad ought to be illegall.

you didnt completely miss AppyPappy's point did you?

[OWK]

The vast majority of the people have no idea what powers the Constitution actually delegated to Fedgov. Article I Section 8 just ain't that long.

Sadly, you're absolutely right.

90% of what the fedgov does, is extra-constitutional.

[backup]

What is needed is a basic Constitutional primer on the website that will explain several principles of Constitutional law. Seperation of Powers, the role of the Judiciary, do non-citizens have rights, etc., etc.

I'm not talking about controversial stuff. Rather, very basic third-grade level stuff that 80% of the posters on this forum seemed to have either (a) forgotten or (b) were never taught.

Perhaps this would end a lot of the idiotic posts. If someone posted a comment based on a seriously erroneous view of the Constitution or some principle thereof, the responder could simply reply by saying: "See III(A)(1)(b) of the Primer."

Just a thought. What do you think?

[Jefferson Adams]

The President is the Commander in Chief, in absolute command of the military. As a member of the citizen militia, you have both a moral and a legal obligation to support him in his decisions, while the war is still going on.

LOL - you just don't get it, do you? WHAT war? There *IS* no war until and unless its declared by Congress - then and only then can the President act as he is acting now, according to the Constitution.

You can't pick and choose which parts of the law you wish to follow, ESPECIALLY if you are in a position of leadership, which Bush and Congress are, allegedly by election of We the People. They are supposed to represent us, and they are supposed to obey the law.

But that's only how it is in a free Constitutional Republic, in which we no longer live.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

. Bush has already proven (to me, anyways) that his intentions are not benign, and are fast approaching the preclusion of good. It was not for nothing that the Founders so soberly considered, and so carefully, assiduously and deliberately included among our specifically enumerated rights that of keeping and bearing arms. No...we have nothing to fear...so long as we remain cognizant of the bounds of human ambition, and the frailty of the spirit which constrains it.

I wonder if you are aware that your combining a statement of Presidential iniquity, with the known reason for the second amendment, and the statement about human fraility, either means nothing, or it implies a desire to accomplish the assassination of the President of the United States. If this is not what you mean to imply, you had better say so in short order.

[KirkandBurke]

It seems to be generally true that once liberties are encroached or compromised by legislation, judicial activism or government fiat, they are rarely, if ever, returned to the people. When they're gone, they're gone. To wait until "it's over" is probably to wait until it's too late.

[A.J.Armitage]

It's not that they don't know it, it's that they hate the Constitution. I'd be all for it if you could get it done, but it might just be too "politically incorrect" right now to get done.

[Jefferson Adams]

They think we're at war, and they don't think any criticism is to be allowed.

I just heard an interview of a man who was born in 1925 Germany, was a Hitler Youth, and who fought with the German army in WWII. The parallels are truly amazing. BTW, have you ever read "The Ominous Parallels" by Peikoff? Anyway, the interview is HERE if anyone is interested.