Flight 587's final seconds

CNN ^ | 11/15/2001 | CNN

[The Magical Mischief Tour]

Information from the last 28 seconds of the flight data recorder aboard Flight 587 according to NTSB reports.

[The Magical Mischief Tour]

Bump for mindbender, who was asking for the link and report.

[jlogajan]

The tinfoilers are going to have to explain how the wake encounter just happened to coincide with a missile hit or a bomb in the luggage.

[PRND21]

Tasteless. Lot of people died.

[kylaka]

Sorry, most CVR's record the final words as "shit" "damn", or "love you mom", or "love you _____".

[MissAmericanPie]

What pushed the plane sideways like that? Any idea?

[Rokke]

Wrong. They don't have to explain anything. They just have to say "The government always lies" over and over again, and leave it at that. That usually suffices as a "factual" arguement in tinfoil land.

[TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig]

So it looks like the back and forth action of the G forces could have sheared off the (I just saw on Fox where the bolts that held the tail section on were in tact, but the fittings that secured them to the composite materials that make up the tail section had sheared off) the tail section at the fittings.

That is the first plausible explanation I have heard yet for a strucural failure.

Can someone out there (math minds, engineers, physics gurus, attention please) tell us what the actual forces on the plane would be when the aircraft is driven one way at .3 G's and and then thrown the other direction with a force of .3 or .4 G's?

Or is the G force readings already taken into account? Is there a bullwhip effect that should be accounted for?

[jwalsh07]

I can attest to that. I was in a car once that ran a stop sign and was hit by one going about 70mph. I was the only one who saw it coming. The only thing the other people remembered was "Oh Sh4T".

[MississippiMan]

What pushed the plane sideways like that? Any idea?

The vertical stabilizer had come off, essentially leaving it as an uncontrollable craft. That's my guess.

MM

[MissAmericanPie]

Yes, I can see that, but the entire craft, tip to tail, blowing sideways is kinda weird.

[jwalsh07]

Ask John Jamieson.

NTSB photos of vertical stabilizer separation from fuselage

I think they should be grounding some planes until they find out why the Vertical stabilizers tongues sheared above the pin connections. Apparently they have had some trouble in the past with the composite layers separating.

PS: No evidence of blast that I can see.

[TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig]

Maybe they should have the surfboard crafters do an inspection. No degrees, but they know how forces can crush a composite.

[longshadow]

.... force of .3 or .4 G's?

"G's" are a unit of acceleration, not force. "G" stands for "gravity," meaning the quantity of acceleration equal to that produced by the mutual gravitional attraction between an object and the Earth, as measured at the Earth's surface.

1 "G" of acceleration produces a force equal to the weight of the object. The equation is force = mass x acceleration.

Hence, 0.3 G's produces a force equal to 30% of the weight of the object, 0.4 G's = 40%, etc.

[NixNatAVanG InDaBurgh]

> have to explain how the wake encounter just happened to coincide with a missile hit or a bomb in the luggage.

I believe the operative word has been *sabatage*. Wake turbulance vortexes have been extensively tested at JFK so as to give enough safe-time before another aircraft takes off. There is a minimum wait time before one aircraft can follow another with reasonable safety. It's called a Vortex Spacing System.
There were also tests at JFK to characterize jet blast profiles. So I just can't buy the flutter theory, OR the wake turbulance theory unless that Airbus was built and maintained so badly that a huff and a puff from the big, bad wolf would have caused it to break apart in midair.

[TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig]

Yes I know, I read discover magazine when I was a kid.

[jwalsh07]

Can you offer a rational explanantion as to how somebody could sabotage the tongues which are located internal to the Vertical Stabilizer?

[jwalsh07]

The rudder increases lateral forces on the VS as well. It is my understanding that the rudder was found at a pretty steep angle but I'm not sure.