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To: Proud2BAmerican
Ok, I confess to having misuderstood the larger point you were driving at, namely.
that happens alot on forums with a lot of content, and posters with the propensity to jump into something without being acquainted with everything said.

I infered from your posts that you thought the Catholic Church, as a whole to be a corrupted institution.
One more time---please read carefully, ok?
Yes, I do believe the Roman Catholic church as a whole to be a corrupted institution, by and large, as I have stated numberous times(didn't you see them?), the Roman Catholic church is corrupted by a corrupted gospel, that is in essence another gospel from the Gospel defined in Scripture and taught by the Apostles. The Roman Catholic church is also corrupted by it's many false doctrines, most notably, Mariology, praying to saints, praying to angels, Mary as coredemptrix, coadvocate, comediatrix, queen of heaven, etc, etc.

BTW, those who have believed a false gospel are also numbered among the "wicked".

Now, do I believe that most papists are morally bankrupt? Not devout papists. However, no matter what moral condition one is in, such as a morally decent Buddhist, papist, protestant or Hindu, if they don't have the right Gospel, then they are still relegated to outer darkness.

But your charge of "pattern of evil" about the members is, admittedly not far off the mark. However, it's true of the entirety of Christianity, all denominations included, people have been sinning since Adam and Eve(the beginning of the "pattern of evil"). Heck, even Judas, an apostle of Christ, sinned something fierce.

The "sin nature" is not the "pattern of evil" that I was referring to, now was it?
However, if one is walking in the habitual, ongoing, continuous practice of sin, say of "adultery" as an example, and does not repent, then they are living a life of open rebellion against God, and just as St. John says, If we say(that is, profess with our mouths) we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.
Romans 6:1-2, What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin(that is the ongoing, continuous, habitual practice of being a slave to sin) that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin continue to live any longer in it?

Romans 6:14-16, For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness?

Sins of the "sin nature" that Christians fall into, but yet repent of(turning from the habitual practice of) and confess under the conviction of the Holy Spirit, is not the same as one who proves their dead faith by living a continous, ongoing, habitual slavery to sin without benefit of true repentance---that is what St. Paul calls, "sin leading to death".

Lunchtime---later. Maranantha

31,227 posted on 03/01/2002 7:13:20 AM PST by Isaiah_66_2
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To: Isaiah_66_2
Uh, huh. This pessimism logically leads to the view that those who are "saved" are few in number. But, IMO, this is like judging the world by newspaper headlines. The "proof" of the Church's purity is not that it has not sinned but that it keeps renewing itself. Because men expect to see heaven on earth--even a perfect church-- these renewals keep going off the tracks. I don't see that Paul looked at the world in this light, because he was an evangelist. Paul didn't even condemn Rome, as the author of the Book of Revelations did, even though the Roman empire was "wicked" even by 20th Century standards. John began with the view that the Holy Spirit would enlighten evbery Christian, but he "gew" into the view that human shepards were needed to mind local flocks. The Apostles may have begun as pentacoistals, but they ended up episcopalians.
31,239 posted on 03/01/2002 7:31:44 AM PST by RobbyS
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To: Isaiah_66_2
I66 Post 30896: Did I say the entire papist church is evil? Nope, sure didn't. Did I say there is a pattern of evil conduct by the heirarchy of the papist church throughout a large part of history since the 6th century---yep, sure did! Does that make the entire church, evil---of course not, only those who use emotionally charged, hysterical rhetoric reach that conclusion.

I66 Post 31227: Yes, I do believe the Roman Catholic church as a whole to be a corrupted institution, by and large, as I have stated numberous times(didn't you see them?), the Roman Catholic church is corrupted by a corrupted gospel, that is in essence another gospel from the Gospel defined in Scripture and taught by the Apostles. The Roman Catholic church is also corrupted by it's many false doctrines, most notably, Mariology, praying to saints, praying to angels, Mary as coredemptrix, coadvocate, comediatrix, queen of heaven, etc, etc. BTW, those who have believed a false gospel are also numbered among the "wicked".

Isaiah: How can not all Catholics be evil, If you belive that those that follow a false Gospel are wicked and be definition Catholics follow the Catholc church. It fdoes not appear that only the emotially charged could reach that conclusion

You rhetoric seems made to inflame passion.

Also someone asked you not to use the word papist since it is disrespectful and was started as a slur. I do not know what you mean when you use the term but the impression I get is "tool of satan"

31,300 posted on 03/01/2002 10:26:20 AM PST by Joyful Wisdom
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To: Isaiah_66_2
Yes, I do believe the Roman Catholic church as a whole to be a corrupted institution, by and large,

Let me get this straight: as a whole, you believe it is corrupted. But as a whole, you do not believe it's evil (your post: #30896). Is corruption a good thing in your eyes?

31,438 posted on 03/02/2002 4:35:08 PM PST by Proud2BAmerican
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