The Neverending Story (The New Christian Chronicles)

Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

[malakhi]

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.

Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams

Thread 162
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[NATE4"ONE NATION"]

So the "grafted in" could be the hearers who were joyful. The gentiles of that day partaking in the promise of the Israelites and the bride would be the Jews of the remnant who were being saved?

I have not looked into this but even if it is so, it still confirms my theory on the New Jerusalem because the New Covenant is a "Christian" covenant and therefore WE are now viewed as the bride like the Jews were in that time period.

[WIMom]

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[vmatt]

So the "grafted in" could be the hearers who were joyful. The gentiles of that day partaking in the promise of the Israelites and the bride would be the Jews of the remnant who were being saved?

Yes, all the Jews up to that time covered by the blood of Christ under the different dispensations could be the bride represented by the names of the twelve tribes in the city. The gentiles who were covered by the different dispensations such as the strangers among the Jews who believed in the past could be the friends of the bridegroom.

I have not looked into this but even if it is so, it still confirms my theory on the New Jerusalem because the New Covenant is a "Christian" covenant and therefore WE are now viewed as the bride like the Jews were in that time period.

Don't get carried away with the past fullfilment truths you possess or you will simply be presenting a "hobbyhorse" doctrine and attempt to make everything fit it rather than allow another truth to be added, "to him which hath, more will be given". I believe the bride has been entirely made up and the marriage has taken place. Otherwise, when will the marriage occur? As an aside, imagine the joy of the apostle John at seeing his name on one of the foundation stones of the city in his vision. Awesome.

[NATE4"ONE NATION"]

I believe the bride has been entirely made up and the marriage has taken place. Otherwise, when will the marriage occur?

As do I. I believe the "wife" as we are now, is the church and New Jerusalem. We are the city in which He dwells.

As an aside, imagine the joy of the apostle John at seeing his name on one of the foundation stones of the city in his vision. Awesome.

And humbling.
By the way, John helped found the church by writing his portion of scripture. He added to the foundation we stand on. As Solo Scriptura is our only record of these truths!

[vmatt]

As do I. I believe the "wife" as we are now, is the church and New Jerusalem. We are the city in which He dwells.

However, we were not invited to the wedding, are not the friend of the bridegroom, did not attend it and could not be the five foolish virgins who missed it since it is passed. Where are we in relation to the wedding? What do you use to prove it?

[ksen]

You notice that NATE and vmatt have the place to themselves while the rest of us are at church where we belong? ;^)

-ksen

[trad_anglican]

Ah, yes. In the same way that, according to Anglican dogma, the Roman faction split from the one true Church which was led by Henry VIII.

Honestly, allend, whose "Anglican dogma" says this?

[NATE4"ONE NATION"]

As God divorced the 10 Northern Tribes of Israel, he then did the same to Judah when Christ pronounced that the kingdom would be taken from them and given to another.
He confirmed this with the woes and consumated it with the temple destruction.

He divorced Israel and is now married to His church.
Though I agree the marriage parables were directed to those of that day, His relationship to his people is the same relationship. A never ending marriage. We inherit this relationship through faith by God's grace.

[The_Reader_David]

No, analogizing with the Anglicans is simply silly.

I remind you that all of the sees established directly by the Holy Apostles, with the sole exception of Rome, which set up on its own in the 11th century, have had a continuous succession of Orthodox bishops from the time of the Apostles to the present: Antioch (whose bishops are equally successors to St. Peter, but which never got a puffed up opinion of itself), Alexandria (likewise with Petrine foundations: St. Peter consecrated St. Mark the Evangelist to be its first bishop), Jerusalem, Corinth, Ephesus, Colossae,..., and, yes, Constantinople, founded by St. Andrew the First-Called.

Just because you Latins loudly use the name "Catholic" doesn't make you the One Holy Catholic and Apostlic Church. You are the innovators with your invention of monarchical ecclesiatical government, modification of the Creed in defiance of the Holy Ecumenical Councils, invented notions of purgatory, created grace, "Original Sin" (as opposed to the Orthodox doctrine of Ancestral Sin), "infallible" Popes, and vitiation of the ascetic discipline of the Church. We preserved the Catholic and Apostolic Faith. It is because your self-titling is used to score cheap rhetorical points that I refuse as an Orthodox to go along with it. The One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church is now commonly called the Orthodox Church. The Latin church left it.

[OLD REGGIE]

Honestly, allend, whose "Anglican dogma" says this?

Ypu'd be well advised to ignore allend. He knows not whereof he speaks yet he speaks. IOW Full of it.

[RobbyS]

And I assert that Constantinople, of all the patriarchies, has the least claim to religious leadership, since it owes its foundation to an emperor and in its efforts to maintain control from the center managed to alienate not only Rome but Antioch and Alexandria.

[Invincibly Ignorant]

You notice that NATE and vmatt have the place to themselves while the rest of us are at church where we belong? ;^)

Good point.:-)

[Invincibly Ignorant]

And have you forgotten about St. Denis?

completely slipped my mind.

[Invincibly Ignorant]

Remember there was a second vision involved in that story and it was not to Paul but to his instructor. God teaches us according to our nature, not as if we were angels. Even Our Lord learned through other men. Or do you think he was born with a complete knowledge of the law of Moses?

Yes I remember. And Paul harkened unto Annanias in Damascus because after his conversion Jesus communicated immediately that he was to wait for further instruction. Acts 9;6b The Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

Paul obeyed his master. Go figure.

[Havoc]

I'm losing respect for the work of the History Channel.

[RobbyS]

But if we are talking about an event instead of a process, then the events --the experience--the enccounter--cannot be put into words, and Paul never tries. He knows that he has moved from a blameless life to something --better. He now looks for confirmation. God leads him on just as HE did Moses.

[american colleen]

Hi Reader David,

I wondered had you got my post #31017 where I asked about the writings of St. Cyprian that you referred to in an earlier post of yours? I have tried and failed to find where he wrote what you said he wrote. I don't disbelieve you, I'd just appreciate it if you could direct me to material written by St. Cyprian where he refuted the "Chair of Peter."

TIA