The Neverending Story (The New Christian Chronicles)

Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

[malakhi]

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.

Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams

Thread 162
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[JohnnyM]

So based on what you believe, can you lose your salvation?? In other words, can I being saved lose my salvation and end up eternally separated from God?

JM

[JHavard]

I have no idea. As enticing as women are and as much as misery loves company I just can't see Adam holding out forever!

Are you saying Adam and Eve weren't having sex before they ate the apple, and there was no plan of them ever having children until they became aware of sin?

You then are saying that sex is sin, is that right?..(^g^)

[JHavard]

So the whole infant baptism thing doesn't bother you? Or isn't it a significant issue?

What did I miss? where is anything said about infant Baptism?(*g*)<This is what I look like when I'm confused'lol

[IMRight]

Sorry, just my impression (from some posts on this board) of a doctrine that some non-Catholics think seperates Christians from non-Christians. If the vast majority of protestant churches practice it... it could refute your previous statement. OR you don't consider it an issue related to salvation.

I'll watch for the confused look in the future.

[OLD REGGIE]

If they were called "the twelve" even when there were only eleven, that implies that "apostle" is and office which is passed from person to person (just like the one who held the keys to the house in the OT was an office - starting to see the connection?). If "apostle" IS an office which is passed down, and we already agree that the apostles had authority (Paul spoke of it when choosing not to exercise it), and could speak infallibly (they certainly did when writing scripture)...then where did all the men holding that office go? You want some hints?

I believe you are interested in pursuing Apostolic Succession. I'm not. It means diddle to me. However; I refer you to this article:

. . . It is further strengthened by an objection made to St.Paul: because he was called in an extraordinary way to the Apostolate, he was obliged often to vindicate his Apostolic authority and proclaim that he had seen the Lord (I Cor., ix, 1). Instruction and appointment by Jesus were, therefore, the regular conditions for the Apostolate.

By way of exception. an extraordinary vocation, as in the case of Paul, or a choice by the Apostolic College, as in the case of Matthias, could suffice. Such an extraordinarily called or elected Apostle could preach Christ's doctrine and the Resurrection of the Lord as an authoritative witness. (Catholic Encyclopedia)

Let's see. Matthias replaced Judas, count is 12, Paul appointed by Jesus, count is 13. Were there really 13 Apostles? Who were the logical successors of the Apostles?
<
One more question:

After the accension who was appointed Bishop of the most prestigious church?

Starting with Clement, the bishop of Alexandria (150 - 215 CE), who confirms in Outlines, Bk. VI, "Peter, James (bar Zebedee) and John, after the ascension of the Saviour, did not claim pre-eminence because the Saviour had especially honored them, but chose James the Righteous as Bishop of Jerusalem."

Why isn't James the first "Pope"?

[dignan3]

To all Star Wars freaks out there(which includes me), the new trailer for Episode II will be shown in conjunction with Pixar's "Monsters, Inc." which starts on Nov. 2.

Here is the link to the article from TheForce.net

Carry on!

Pray for John Paul II

[JHavard]

IMRight, Do you know what would be interesting? No! what? I'm glad you asked me that question.

To go to every Christian Church in the USA, get a copy of their doctrine of faith,(What they think is absolutely necessary to obtain eternal life), compare every one of them to the others and then pick out the ones that everyone have in agreement, and then see what is left, I think that most would agree, that what was left, the remenant as it were, isn't really necessary for salvation.

What do you think? (^g^) <-- normal smiley face.

[OLD REGGIE]

As am I after reading what you quoted. Whoever wrote that paragraph doesn't know how to write very well, that's for sure.

Personally, I think that we have prety much exhausted this topic and should move on.

I'm sorry. I should have posted the attribution. I'll post the article in full.

HISTORIC CATHOLIC BIBLE AND WHICH ONE YOU SHOULD HAVE

Wondering what Bible you should use confused as to which on you should have, well there are two books that every Catholic home should have, they are: The Douay Rheims Catholic Bible and the RSV Catholic Edition. Note: other RSV editions are out and say Catholic but it does not mean they are Catholic, a lot of times you will find that these bible are published by protestant publishers. I suggest that if you are interested in safe reading that is in union with the Vicar of Rome Pope John Paul II, look into EWTN or TAN Publishers, they are fully Catholic and contain SAFE Catholic Reading. The Douay Rheims Bible is Based on the Ancient Vulgate of St. Jerome, the very FIRST Bible in containing all the 73 books in the Catholic Church in the year c.405 AD,

The New Vulgate (Nova Vulgata) was done by our Current Pope John Paul II, this is the RSV Catholic Edition containing footnotes of the Ancient Vulgate of St. Jerome. The Ancient Vulgate was used for 390 years and was the only English Catholic bible ever used. To learn more about the oldest bible for English Speaking Catholics you can purchase a book called Which Bible Should You Read? by Thomas A. Nelson not the same Thomas Nelson who is a protestant publisher. TAN Publishers carries the book. It was the only bible used in the liturgy of the mass. Today however we know use the Nova Vulgata in the liturgy of the mass. This book does contain in its foot notes the missing links in its footnotes, and that is why when one purchases the RSV make sure it is the Catholic Edition, because it contains foot note to the oldest Bible the Catholic Church has. God Bless you and may His light and love strengthen you and guide you into all truth through the Authority of the Catholic Church.

ReligiousNet.Com - The Online Religious Shopping Mall

------------------------------------------------------------

You should, for certain, be wary of purchasing anything published by those "dirty Protestants".

FYI I read, and compare, a half dozen Bible translations on-line (for free). I have no intention of purchasing a different one every time someone refers to a single passage to "prove" a point.

Would it be too much for you to post Luke 1:? If not the entire passage, maybe 30-45?

The question is only important to me because you seem to hang your hat on the importance of the exact words "Hail...full of Grace". Modern Bible translators, Protestant or Catholic, don't agree with you. I wonder just what is your authority?

[saradippity]

I will start with answering your question.

What %of Catholics read the Catechism,Canon Law or Encyclicals?How many Catholics have read the Bible?

These are difficult questions to answer without a well designed survey and good sampling and even with that,statistics can be manipulated.My first set of guesstimates is for the Church in the world,the second for the U.S.A. The best guesses I can make are that;

1.approximately 10% have read some or most of the official Church teachings

2.25% are aware that there exists a body of documents that reflect official teaching and that they are incorporated in the New Catholic Catechism,and can be accessed easily if the need occurs.

3.15% have read a few items as needed.

4.25% know that out there somewhere is a library that holds all the documents that connect the Catholic Church with Jesus

5.20 to 30% trust that what they hear is given to those that teach,preach and administer the sacraments in some manner or another.

I think 20% of Catholics in this country read the Bible pretty regularly and maybe 30% less frequently. 100% have heard the Gospel provided they attend mass and are not asleep.

I will respond to the hypocrisy in another post

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Sorry if I sounded like I was being nosy, your right it is "NOYB", and I didn't really want to know anything, I meant it as a joke to what angleo said. Did not mean to offend.

Becky

[JHavard]

We have been talking about how catholics were effected by meatless Friday, and my wife had remembered it to be a venial sin which had to be confessed to a priest, and then several on the threads came on and said she must not have been aware of the church teachings on it.

My wife talked to her (still active catholic sister) in Tenn. every Tuesday morning, and although they usually avoid talking religion since her sister knows she no longer goes to their church, I asked her to simply ask what she remember about meatless Friday, and she told my wife that she had kept it faithfully until one day she went to see a family that was very poor, and all they had to give their children that day was crackers and cheese with a piece of bacon on it, and she gave her sister one, and she ate it.

The next week or so, she went to church and confession, and told the priest what she had done, and he read her such a riot act that she stopped keeping meatless Friday altogether after that. I hope that before the Catholic Church considers bringing it back, they solicit a few testimonies from their people on what it was really like.

[IMRight]

no no. NOYB meant in humor (didn't know what level of conversation was appropriate). I was just trying to say that a couple with two kids in 11months is lacking in many things (like sleep sometimes) but the evidence would show that "romance" aint one of 'em

[JHavard]

To all Star Wars freaks out there(which includes me), the new trailer for Episode II will be shown in conjunction with Pixar's "Monsters, Inc." which starts on Nov.2.Pray for John Paul II

???????Why, won't they let him watch it? (^g^)Lol

[IMRight]

What do you think? (^g^) <-- normal smiley face.

So the difference is in the eyebrows huh? I'll have to give it a try.

Right now I need the confused one since I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. I suspect that if you took the "Roman road" type printings from the front of the bulletin you would find little disagreement (although perhaps more than you would expect). If you scratch much deeper, however, I think the differences are substantial (which is to be expected - people don't seperate over the color of the pastor's shoes). The infant baptism one was just an example. It may be that you are stating that "the fundamentals" are common among the Protestant Churchs and little else is important for salvation, but if that's the standard, I can't think of one the Catholics disagree with (I don't remember all seven(?)).

[dadwags]

<2087>hi, saradipity, dadwags here, born 1/3/34 . Educated by Dominicans (1-80) and Jesuits (9-12) and secularly in University .
My 10th grade teacher told a story about a priest who was in Mexico during the persecution (1920's) and , while residing at Loyola U. wrote a book titled "NO God Next Door" The book was an instant sellout hit in New Orleans because people thought he was writing about tulane U.(Tulane U. is adjacent to Loyola U.)
Just a little irrelevant levity (0_o) )

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Great. The catholic church bound beef for a few years. What a tremendous contribution to Christendom. You should be proud.

It brings tears to my eyes. :)LOLOLOL

BigMack

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

From there on out, all your Doctrine is manufactured by the RCC. I comprehend quite a bit. Get the Spirit of God and you can too.

Do you think he might comprehend this? He is drunk in the spirit tho, the drunker I stand here the longer I get :)

BigMack

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Mine are 24 yrs, and 21 yrs. and have been the greatest joy of my life and what I am most proud of:)

Becky

What about me ? :(

BigMack

[dadwags]

#2219
Becky, are your parents still "around" ? what is their relationship with the Church ?
Just curious >

[OLD REGGIE]

It was not fair of me to ask for you to supply quantitative information where it is almost impossible to provide. Perhaps, instead of beating around the bush, I should have simply stated that, in my opinion, it is probably a very small percentage of the "faithful" who really know and understand just what the Church really teaches, knows how to find out, and/or who really care. Thank you for your answers.

Most of us make the mistake of thinking our personal experience is indicative of the universe. Having said that, my personal experience as a RC (more than 50 years ago and probably not relative to today - though it might still be) is that I knew no one in my circle who read the Bible. Most of my Protestant friends did, and goaded me into it for one reason or another.

As for Bible knowledge from Bible readings in Church. You would have to go for years without missing a Mass to get through the New Testament alone. That is not a valid example.