The Neverending Story (The New Christian Chronicles)

Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

[malakhi]

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.

Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams

Thread 162
TNS Archives

[JWinNC]

"Around here every Methodist Church has a woman pastor. I recently asked a girl I was having a bible study with who went to a Methodist Church if her pastor (a woman) was the husband of one wife. Her answer: She's not married.:) She wasn't even a blonde:)"

Same conditions here. Methodist and many others.

A sad condition among many of our local churches; too much PC, too little JC.

JWinNC

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

2 Tim. 4:1 And the spirit speaketh expressly in the later days some shall depart from the faith giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.;(

Becky

[malakhi]

The Barna Study

I knew I had read about this somewhere. Turns out it was right here on FR! Here is a link to a discussion about it, for those who are interested, so you can draw your own conclusions (warning, long thread):

Charismatics Have Highest Levels of 'Biblical Accuracy'

Reply #18 has the details of the study.

I'm curious about the question "Is Satan real?" The study claims that only 17% of Catholics believe this is true. It lists Baptists at 34%. The highest are the Mormons (!) at 59%. What do all you TNSers believe about Satan? Is he real? What is his nature? What power does have really have?

[al_c]

I don't beleive you become a part of the body of Christ until you have accepted his gift of salvation.

So Jesus died on the cross only for those who accept it? What becomes of someone who has never heard anything about God, Jesus, the Bible, etc. ... someone who was never taught these things?

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

You bet he is real!

Becky

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Rom. 1:20

Becky

[SoothingDave]

As a child he was indeed born, but as a Son he has existed forever.

OK, now what half of him was what? When did the "human" half meet the "god half"? Or, to ask my question again, when did Jesus become God? That is, when did the human Jesus become half God?

Mary, then, had no part whatsoever in mothering the Godhead.

Earth to Protestants. NOBODY IS SAYING THIS!

Nobody says that Mary mothered the Godhead, pre-existed before God, created God. Stop arguing what we don't believe.

Now we attest that Jesus as a person is fully God and fully man. When He was Incarnated He was fully God and fully man. This means that in the womb of his mother, Mary, He was fully God and fully man. It can then be said that Mary carried God in her womb.

Again we find that this key Roman Catholic doctrine is built purely upon human speculation.

Which supporting statement is purely built upon human speculation? Which statement do you not find in Scripture? Which statement is not true?

Jesus is God

Mary is the Mother of Jesus

Answer the question.

SD

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

What do all you TNSers believe about Satan? Is he real?

Yes, and he post here under the name of... well I won't go into to that now. :)

BigMack

[malakhi]

You bet he is real!

(Becky's down as a yes...) OK, what about the rest?

[al_c]

"Women are not to be in church leadership: pastor, deacon, elders, etc. They can teach children and younger women."

I concur (based on scripture), but it seems to have become a minority position

It is becoming a minority position because too many people are wanting to the church to conform to the world's point of view instead of the other way around.

[SoothingDave]

She is the subject of the verb, but as it is in the middle/passive (there is only one way to denote the two voices in the perfect participle), she is being acted upon. When I say, "I was hit" it doesn't say a whole lot about me except what happened to me. It doesn't say that I have a quality of "hitness" which makes people hit me. That is the stretch which you are attempting to make when you say that the participle in the middle/passive shows us something about Mary. She is the object of grace (a far better translation of charitoo than favor, synonomous to the Hebrew word that is translated in KJV "favor" as in "Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord"). It's not that she has some "graceness" which causes her to be the object of grace.

No, but she was the object of grace which left her with a condition of "graceness." I don't find this linguistic argument very compelling. We don't hold that Mary is full of grace because of soemthing she did. She is indeed a (more or less) passive participant in being "graceified."

SD

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Both statements are correct. But let me add that does not make Mary the mother of God, which is where I thought you were going with this becasue I saw that on an earlier thread.

Becky

[JWinNC]

"What becomes of someone who has never heard anything about God, Jesus, the Bible, etc. ... someone who was never taught these things?"

I can't put my finger on the scripture at this moment, but those who have not heard of Christ will be given that opportunity before judgement.

JWinNC

[IMRight]

If all you're gonna do is post at me and not listen to what I say I'm afraid I'm gonna have to expose your lies about what I said. Please stop doing that. It lays bare your disingenuousness when ya try to warm up to the non-catholics.

You may remember that the original issue was something a non-Catholic had posted that I felt was way over the line (no point in rehashing it, he apologized). I was concerned that my rebuke would be ignored because I was Catholic & he might not see me as a Christian brother. So I was calling you in for help. Instead of saying "Hey bro' that's a little extreme, I believe your initial response was:

No different than SoothingDave calling him an ---hole. Police your own and ya may have some credibility.

Not that you disagreed with what he was saying.
You and I passed the argument back and forth in the way you have depicted (although you conveniently forgot your first response to make me look bad?) and I believe I apologized in #1442.

My post (that you obviously seem to have some issues with), was an attempt (appearently a poor one) at humor which I presume was the tone of your initial respose (are you slamming the HS? or just me? or some such).

If that didn't come across well... it's probably my lack of eloquence, not your misinterpretation.

[SoothingDave]

Both statements are correct. But let me add that does not make Mary the mother of God, which is where I thought you were going with this becasue I saw that on an earlier thread.

Why not?

If Fred is a caveman and Wilma is the mother of Fred, logic makes Wilma the mother of a caveman.

We are not saying that Mary pre-dates God, or created God. We are affirming that Jesus was God, even when He was a fetus.

Why isn't that true?

SD

[malakhi]

OK, BigMack, now what does he do? What is his nature? What power does he really have?

[SoothingDave]

OK, what about the rest?

This ring a bell?

Do you reject Satan?

And all his works?

And all his empty promises?

Sounds like a real being to this Catholic boy.

SD

[JohnnyM]

"So Jesus died on the cross only for those who accept it? What becomes of someone who has never heard anything about God, Jesus, the Bible, etc. ... someone who was never taught these things?"

Based on the wording of your response, it seems you are saying that everyone, saved or unsaved, are in the Body of Christ. This is not correct. Jesus did die for everyone, but only those who have accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior are members of the Body of Christ, His Church. Please correct me if I misunderstood your response.

JM